View Full Version : Anyone know if KK will uncap render ranges...
Heavyporker
01-05-06, 00:44
... in v2.2? I don't recall if KK mentioned this in their planfiles.
I mean, even the hardcore level-playing-field advocate can't really say that it's fair to rifle players that the game has a hard-coded limit of a rendered range of about 1 km.
Apocalypsox
01-05-06, 01:47
/signed. i would like my rifles to be able to slightly outrange a BoH.
I didn't see any mention of them uncapping render ranges. I've been wanting them to do that since Beta 4, but I doubt it's going to happen.
This is part of my problem with the whole balancing thing - you can't balance what you can't fix. If render ranges can't be fixed, rifles (especially tech rifles) and their primary users (Spies) will be forever at a disadvantage compared to other classes.
At this point, I have very little faith in KK's ability to fix rifle ranges, which means Rifle Spies will never be properly balanced as per the ideal.
Apocalypsox
01-05-06, 02:14
they could triple our damage...that might make up for it :cool:
they could triple our damage...that might make up for itI didn't mention that explicitily because I don't believe that's on the table right now. The only things on the table right now seem to be based on an ideal world where KK fixes rifles ranges. Unfortunately, I believe that means they're going to make everyone's ranges incredibly short.
... in v2.2? I don't recall if KK mentioned this in their planfiles.
I mean, even the hardcore level-playing-field advocate can't really say that it's fair to rifle players that the game has a hard-coded limit of a rendered range of about 1 km.
Nah I doubt they'll do it, It's been requested in the past, it's not been done...
Scanner Darkly
01-05-06, 23:30
I haven't played in a while, but didn't KK already ramp up the rendering distance with evo 2.1? I seem to remember that the Silent Hunter (especially) had a far longer viewing/targeting distance when using the scope.
Maybe more work needs to be done on the scoped view on rifles - tho I haven't tested any rifles with the scope mod since 2.1, so have no idea if this has been altered in any way.
Of course, it would be fantastic if rifle users could take advantage of a realistic range, but in most combat situations, I found the current range already just about enough.
Realistic range is about 1km anyway isn't it? I noticed a pretty decent draw distance lately too (I left before evo, came back after), more than I remember but I didn't want to say anything so as not to sound like a tard.
Heavyporker
02-05-06, 01:18
Maybe KK did...
... but considering that even lowbie rifles can reach 1km, that kind of rendering cap is quite a disavantage.
Hey, you think if render ranges got uncapped, we could recruit armies of lowbie snipers to come to OP fights and just snipe anything that moved?
Be really funny, I bet.
Apocalypsox
02-05-06, 02:02
Maybe KK did...
... but considering that even lowbie rifles can reach 1km, that kind of rendering cap is quite a disavantage.
Hey, you think if render ranges got uncapped, we could recruit armies of lowbie snipers to come to OP fights and just snipe anything that moved?
Be really funny, I bet.
B1s dont do much damage
Heavyporker
02-05-06, 03:01
Still, get enough of them together, you'll have a nice attrition thing going.
Part of the "problem" is determining how far out the render range is right now.
We use whether or not our weapons can lock on as an indication of range. Is that accurate? There are indications that weapon range is tied to reticle lock speed. With that in mind, are our weapons locking on at much further distances than KK would like just so the reticles close fast?
Has anyone tried determining how far out the clipping distance is using a fixed length object, like a rhino? Has anyone tried lining up a set of Rhinos to see how far out we can get before clipping occurs?
I have a sneaking suspicion that our weapons ranges are going to get a whole lot shorter once reticle lock speed is decoupled from weapon range. I think weapon ranges right now are quit a bit inflated over what they're supposed to be.
Heavyporker
02-05-06, 03:47
Well, if pistols and cannons get their ranges reduced, then, yes, rifles would finally get a proper advantage again.
But how much of and advantage is that, really? I mean... even an overloaded 0 transport APU Monk carrying 100 kg of stuff can run up to a rifler and vape his ass in under ten seconds.*
* Note, this is a rhetorical exaggeration. Do not take it literally.
Oh you know what will happen if runspeed stays an issue. KK will just nerf it.
Part of the problem is that weapons fire is in real time, while the game runs in accelerated time and Runspeed seems to be mapped up to accelerated time. If you don't believe me, keep in mind how long it takes you yourself to walk/run a kilometer, then time how long it takes for you to move that far in-game. Now compare that to your weapon's RoF...
You can see where I'm going with this - either the whole game goes back to real time, or the whole game gets moved to accelerated time. You can't keep RoF in realtime and runspeed in accelerated time and not have balance issues.
Dribble Joy
02-05-06, 05:37
Pistol range needs a serious nerf. Laser pistols in particular are just daft.
... in v2.2? I don't recall if KK mentioned this in their planfiles.
I mean, even the hardcore level-playing-field advocate can't really say that it's fair to rifle players that the game has a hard-coded limit of a rendered range of about 1 km.
Without actually knowing, i would say its ALOT lower than than, looking at FarCry, which was meant to have a 1km view distance - you can see atleast twice as far in that as in NC.
In FarCry though, 1km IS 1km (I'd say it has more like a 2km view distance though) in NC 1km is more like 200m. Scale doesn't mean a fuck of a lot in this game.
Scanner Darkly
02-05-06, 14:04
Part of the problem is the engine, that is something like 6 years old and despite all the patches, Dx9 support, DoY and evo 2.1, it is still something that was designed to work with hardware from quite a few generations ago and as such was never conceived to give realistic rendering ranges.
Sure other games from around the same time were capable of drawing incredible distances, however they were not MMOs with 10s of players and mobs in close proximity to each other.
Then again maybe KK can hack another drawing distance enhancement in, but the only people who know the answer to that are the code jockeys...
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