Second vehicle proposition.

[Dribble Joy]

Slightly different to the chinge from Int to Dex mainstat req idea.

Allow vehicle use with int OR vhc.

Ie. runner can use a vehicle by meeting it's int or vhc reqs.

Increase the vhc reqs considerably (adding performance for vhc skilling too). This would allow tanks to use vehicles, but would have to spec a considerable amount of dex points, severly weakening their agl or spies and monks to use them abeit with poor performance.

[unreal]

To be honest I think forcing people to have vehicle use as a Dexterity subskill to drive vehicles ruins the entire point of vehicles for the following reason:

Most vehicles aren't a viable option for actual combat characters, and because of this, the drivers are usually reserved for tradeskillers that die very easily. Combat vehicles deserve higher requirements, but I think transport vehicles should have the opposite.

A typical Spy, depending on the setup, is slightly gimped on runspeed as it is. Requiring a large amount of vehicle skill (even as much as 17) that won't come from implants is why most vehicles are hardly ever used. The Dexterity skill points are already stretched as far as possible as it is to be as good as your adversaries.

For the previous paragrah explaining why; I think it would be a great idea if Vehicle Use was switched over to Intelligence. Like I said, a Spy is already stretched enough as it is with Dexterity. Having Vehicle Use almost certainly means shitter runspeed than it already is. Nerfing one skill almost completely ruins the profession, whereas if Vehicle Use was an Intelligence subskill, one area could be nerfed, without seriously damaging the PvP side of things.

I think the issues I mentioned in another Vehicle thread (http://forum.neocron.com/showthread.php?t=133099) should be given another reading too...
Not to mention drugflash affects whether you can drive properly because of the spastic movements. There should be a WoC Dex 2 or WoC Int 1 item (preferably in the form of a glove or a piece of easily switchable armour, such as boots perhaps) which gives +100 VHC and a nice intelligence bonus.

Vehicles are a joke at the moment. It's not worth skilling the large amount of VHC to be able to drive them. Only character it's worth doing on is a tradeskiller, which typically won't be set up for taking damage and won't be able to wear good armour.

It's not worth paying a large amount of credits to drive a vehicle to an OP war, or just any sector with enemies in, to have them be able to easily destroy it in seconds (especially if monks are there). That's why you only ever see Quads, Revelers, and the odd Rhino with an LE'd noob driver to repair it or stop it from taking damage.

Edit: Most vehicles are a POS these days anyway. Look at the smoke effects added to the Hovertecs and such, they completely ******** (beep) my FPS and cause the screen to lag.

[Dribble Joy]

I'm almost tempted to agree with making vhc an int skill, but I am not sure.

Pure drivers need a reason to exist, but forcing people to make a char so they or their clannies can use them is in the same area as PPUs, if PPUs become less important, then vehicles will increase in value. Then you will 'require' a driver at an OP fight, so making them more availiable whist ssill maintaining a degree of specialisation is what we need.

[Clive tombstone]

Some how though, Im getting the feeling right now that driver will translate into "spy" by the reasoning thats going here. I still say the end result of the first prop was a better idea, Tanks, Spies and PE's all win on that one.

[Apocalypsox]

I dont think we should only have to require one req, but instead lower the vhc reqs, as if you only needed int every damned spy would be able to fly a hoverbomber. thats jut not fair tbh.

[unreal]

Pure drivers need a reason to exist, but forcing people to make a char so they or their clannies can use them is in the same area as PPUs, if PPUs become less important, then vehicles will increase in value. Then you will 'require' a driver at an OP fight, so making them more availiable whist ssill maintaining a degree of specialisation is what we need.Specialization should be there for combat vehicles in my opinion, and not transport ones, more specifically, the single seated transport vehicles. This would mean my pure combat characters would be able to take advtange of using vehicles, but won't be able to help drive combat vehicles around for gunners because I won't have the skill for it. I think that's the way it should be.

Vehicles where only yourself gains something (such as being able to travel across sectors quicker than running) should have possibly an intelligence requirement, a dexterity requirement, and half the VHC skill than is currently needed. Possibly think about lowering the VHC skill required by other vehicles too... to make them more usable. Whereas combat vehicles would need to require a driver that specializes in much higher amounts of VHC.

As long as the game engine/physics is as poor as it is, there really isn't much point to having a "pure" driver. You bump into another vehicle, and your vehicle burps and instantly stops on the spot. If anything, make it slightly realistic considering these high tech type of vehicles should have very dangerous results when collisions occur. If the vehicle is classed as non LE'd, and it bangs into another vehicle, make it a destruction derby, forcing the vehicles to be either damaged or destroyed on impact. The same sort of thing should apply when driving into obstacles and trees, not forgetting that some obstacles are invisible until you come across them, or are wider objects than they appear to be.

Edit: I think there could be some sort of system where you bang into something, and depending on the damage you could have done to the vehicle, you get warnings instead. Perhaps rupturing the vehicles reactor/engine after b times, requiring you to return the vehicle to the depot in n real minutes before it explodes.

[nellus]

I do like the idea of you damaging your vehichle when running into things this would make it more realistic, but what about the zoning problems some people have? they go through to the next zone there still in sync but the vehichles there and keeps going straight into a nuclear ractor ..... er sorry meant tree :p .

This problem would cause a lot of people totaly un necessaary damage and time and money spent sorting their vehichle when it wasnt their fault.

But yer i do like the idea :cool:

[unreal]

This problem would cause a lot of people totaly un necessaary damage and time and money spent sorting their vehichle when it wasnt their fault.The same way you randomly fatal in a populated sector and have the nearest monk zerg destroy the vehicle in seconds, and after relogging in, only seeing a pile of metal plates on the floor? :rolleyes:

[nellus]

Yup prety much. im fortunate not to have these sync problems but i can see how people get annoyed by them.


But as i did say i do very much like the idea and hope KK take notice and try and introduce something like this.

[Dogface]

Who knows? Dirus might have some ideas about what he wants to do with vehicles. I'm waiting especially for that topic (If there will actually be one open for discussion) because I'm beginning to take an interest in them.

I say make it viable for spies, tanks and PEs (not monks, imo) to be able to drive with a certain amount of sacrifice, for example a tank have to use a few int implants or a spy having to use a few str imps for gunning (certain things) or what have you. I say a tank should totally be able to drive a rhino, but obviously not something like a glider.