View Full Version : HC PA Athletics Nerf! <-- Remove it?
How many HC tanks wear PA (including Camo),
Well I see a few but not alot and why not? -25 Athletics. Is that fair?
PPU PA: -30 APU (i think)
APU PA: -30 PPU (i think)
MC PA: -25 HC
Why is it those three have something that in theory you shouldnt be using anyway unless your trying to make a hybrid, which KK nerf anyway.
HC tank lose a great deal of speed when welding a cannon I think it's like 30% or more so why do they need the -25 athletics nerf? It just stops people using PA which they are suposed to use as it's suposed to be the ultimate armour!
I think KK need to review PA and the +'s and -'s they give because as it is it's unfair.
Anyone agree with that?
monk pa takes away agility
Not really, Its huge heavy armour its simple logic that its going to slow you down.
And another point, Tanks are supposed to be slow, they are big heavy weapons wielding brick shithouses, I suppose in that respect they airnt meant to move fast.
(If I were KK I would of probably put the speed effecting sub-skills in a different skill, with some major tweaks to the whole system of course. Mainly because Spies have low resists and body health etc which is fair but surely they would be agile enough to outrun a Tank, but I guess it all comes down to balance.)
maybe they should just get rid of athletics and make agility count for all of the speed.
If the agility:runspeed ratio was ajusted that might be a pretty good idea.
But then again monks might have the speed advantage second to spies since they have all the dex to spend on agil.
Paper Dragon
22-01-06, 17:41
maybe they should just get rid of athletics and make agility count for all of the speed.
Cue Monks dumping every DEX point into agility, and Tanks having a fairly large amount of excess points to put there.
Monks already do dump (almost) every dex point in agility. What I always wonder is how come only spy and PE PA nerf an important mainstat (int an psi respectively) as well as a subskill? How come monk PA seems to be so all-round useful?
Paper Dragon
22-01-06, 17:50
Monks already do dump (almost) every dex point in agility.
But if Athletics was removed, they wouldn't have to put anything into that skill; more CON points to go around.
Monks already do dump (almost) every dex point in agility. What I always wonder is how come only spy and PE PA nerf an important mainstat (int an psi respectively) as well as a subskill? How come monk PA seems to be so all-round useful?
I'll take -5 int and ditch the -20 agil on monk pa anyday
Why the h-c one got -atl plus a huge runspeed nerf with guns out where the m-c one got no -atl and you dont got a runspeed nerf anyway doesnt make sense to me.
Both should either give -atl or not. Just one is plain stupid.
Actually, i'd say give -atl to both types of PA, then lower the runspeed nerf for h-c weapons slightly.
On the other hand, i wouldnt use PA anyway. It's easy to cap all weapons, i dont really need the +str and the only armor that gives por is a chest armor aswell. So VK > PA. :)
Why the h-c one got -atl plus a huge runspeed nerf with guns out where the m-c one got no -atl and you dont got a runspeed nerf anyway doesnt make sense to me.
Both should either give -atl or not. Just one is plain stupid.
Actually, i'd say give -atl to both types of PA, then lower the runspeed nerf for h-c weapons slightly.
On the other hand, i wouldnt use PA anyway. It's easy to cap all weapons, i dont really need the +str and the only armor that gives por is a chest armor aswell. So VK > PA. :)
on a pure apu/ppu pa can be worth it in order to spec more ppw.
I think in the character creation screen for tank it says "sprinters they are not, but their staying abilities can decide the fight" or something like that. So they arn't meant to be fast.
Could you imagine trying to kill an HC tank running almost as fast as an MC tank? :eek:
Dargeshaad
22-01-06, 18:44
Why the h-c one got -atl plus a huge runspeed nerf with guns out where the m-c one got no -atl and you dont got a runspeed nerf anyway doesnt make sense to me.
It has something to do with the fact that since it gives +HC it implies the armor is crafted for more stability and/or turret mode, whereas the +MC armor is crafted for more flexibility since a MC tank has to move around alot more than a HC.
Hope it made sense :p
Normally when i see threads like this, i usually respond with "it's like that for a reason" but on this occasion, something occurred to me that may have some logical excuse for an "unnerf" if such a thing exists.
Which came first - the PA athletics malus or the H-C weapon runspeed nerf? If the PA malus came first, was this overlooked when the H-C runspeed nerf came into being? I can imagine the H-C runspeed nerf being introduced when people tried to overcome the PA malus by simply not wearing it. What is happening now is that people who DO wear it are being punished twice.
KK seem to use the same solution to avoid hybrid setups, whether between H-C/melee combos, rifle/pistol combos, apu/ppu combos. One implant / PA for one skill nerfs the other. So if the M-C PA nerfs H-C, why not simply the other way round too? It would be consistent with other classes.
Not really, Its huge heavy armour its simple logic that its going to slow you down.So is melee PA, so why the difference? Also, a runner should be able to spec more transport at the expense of damage dealt if he wants to.
Not really, Its huge heavy armour its simple logic that its going to slow you down.
And another point, Tanks are supposed to be slow, they are big heavy weapons wielding brick shithouses, I suppose in that respect they airnt meant to move fast.
Perhaps you failed to notice that I said welding heavy weapons slows you down!?
The -25 athletics is ontop of that, and MC PA doesn't effect anything an MC tank wouldn't mind having effected EG -25 HC when you don't use HC weapons means nothing to you. perhaps it's MC PA thats wrong then if Monk PA gives - agility, im sure it does give -apu or ppu too though,
i use meele tank armour on my heavy tank hyb and cap both weapons perfectly on a 1 drug
and when buffed i nearly cap all resists.. my speed is through the roof i have a enormus carry weight and carry 3 weapons or more
=\ realy dont get peoples problem with the run speed nurf... just wear the meele armour and over spec heavy points... the weapons are simple to cap
RogerRamjet
22-01-06, 22:10
Dont wear PA at all ^^
Heavyporker
22-01-06, 22:13
I really hate blanket statements.
Anyways, not every monk puts every last DEX point into agility! Sheesh!
How about just giving HC PAs some +weaponlore, since it's got a weapons mount for that heavy cannon, link it up to that helmet for better aim.
Voila, you get a nice little edge that doesn't completely unbalance everything.
Dont wear PA at all ^^
now thats just plain not viable =] pa gives you a maaaaasive energy bonus... if u realy wana cap ALL resists. then pa is a must
What roger said :)
Zovos thats almost as funny as when you said tanks should not bother with psi at all.
What roger said :)
Zovos thats almost as funny as when you said tanks should not bother with psi at all.
they realy dont need it IF psi resist was introduced... as it is ofcorse theres a use... but playing a tank since well. the game fresh came out of nc1 beta... in my opinion tanks have never needed psi =\ maby u run around on your own. i run around with people. i dont play the game to dual i play the game to fight team v team =\ wheres the fun in fighting one person... when u can drive a tank into them and shoot them (yeh babey my tank once could drive a rhyno woot)
anyway back on topic, cammo pa, REALY helps a well made setup... maby because my tank is one with natural speed (back when i was only 75 75 it ran faster than a person with 101 150 i have seen) but i have never realy had a problem with the hc pa nurf
bestides as i said use the meele armour and over spec your heavy...
RogerRamjet
22-01-06, 22:34
now thats just plain not viable =] pa gives you a maaaaasive energy bonus... if u realy wana cap ALL resists. then pa is a must
You cant cap ALL resists, unless you include a lvl3 buff, or even use drugs.
I think KK need to review PA and the +'s and -'s they give because as it is it's unfair.
Anyone agree with that?
outright no. instead think of a side-effect of psi-related mind concentration, like setting runspeed to 10% once a psi-spell is in use. any spell, from any char. just like a dark heritage from the elder elves.
dont run with your weapon out all the time, even in a fight, i fire, reload and unless i can lock on with my weapon i holster it and move closer, takes a bit of time but you can get alot closer then do alot more damg and if you take the time to try it out you can become realy good at it and be "moblie" in fights. If you cba with that just dont use it ;)
Imo remove ath / dex cap!
Bring back judge / liba warping speed tanks :)
Ps : pa sux anyway
dont run with your weapon out all the time, even in a fight, i fire, reload and unless i can lock on with my weapon i holster it and move closer, takes a bit of time but you can get alot closer then do alot more damg and if you take the time to try it out you can become realy good at it and be "moblie" in fights. If you cba with that just dont use it ;)
i roll my mouse down over my thunderbolt until i get close enough to shock. if im in shock range i can then pull the weapon out n start blasting
that or the pob
=\ imo all tanks should hyb between meele n heavy
pain_easer
22-01-06, 23:14
tbh , who uses tank pa ?
tbh , who uses tank pa ?
me...
the outcome of my old setup before i mixed in meele
i can drive and cap my weapons enough tc for doomies adn can cycle tl 30 withough drugs/buffs/ops
my 3 main types of play are solo
monk asistance
and pe assistance
the advantage of having a pe ppuing over a monk is pritty ovious. although having a blessed hyb buff is even more welcome... ppus are just a waste. standing there doing nothing... in nc the only limitation is the amount of people you have shooting your enemy... if one is sitting there not shooting then hes a waste of bloody space >_<
=] also pe's db the people ur trying to kill makes it so much more fun
-=EDIT=-
oh ye. and IF you could get a zarg belt... and throw it in the mix then you gain about 0.5-1% in all the resist. and pritty much cap them all
apart from poison wich is only realy cappable if u chnge to VK armour... which i am NOT willing to do. PA FTW
Just fix the client side run nerf.
Because on everyone elses screen your always moving much faster than you are on your own screen.
For all we know aiming, hit detection and numerous other things are bugged due to this.
pff, overspec H-C and use melee PA.
Tanks got enought STR to cap cs, resist FOR and have some nice TRA at same time.
H-C PA is completly useless.
Will u guys realise that some of us are hybrid tanks ? Both Tank Hc and Mc PAs are just fine and useful.
HC tank lose a great deal of speed when welding a cannon I think it's like 30% or more so why do they need the -25 athletics nerf?
This argument is double edged. Why do they need a runspeed bonus since they already are slow when using their weapon ?
Btw, Tank PA gives you around +60 energy resist, which is far away from only +25ish of any Duranium armor. Those 37 points saved in energy resist are more than enough to allow you to deal with that small -20 athletics malus ; people telling you they can't be as fast using a HC PA than a no-PA user really don't have a clue how runspeed and points balancing work.
Not that far from a spy telling he's using Titan armor because Spy PA gives him an endurance malus :lol:
pff, overspec H-C and use melee PA.
Tanks got enought STR to cap cs, resist FOR and have some nice TRA at same time.
H-C PA is completly useless.
exactly...
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.