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View Full Version : Trial to Account: some notes on retention.



nemesys
13-12-05, 02:01
'allo. I've heard of nc before, found the trial on fileshack (good idea, whomever gave it to them), am rather hooked etc. :).

Some issues, which i post here as of possible general concern re: player retention from trial to full account:

* manual. Wow, lots going on, lots of info, lots of random crap in my inventory. Not everyone may have played system shock 2 and similar so the slew of "random widget 25a5c" and suchlike might be intimidating. Ingame p2p help is great, but requires people be awake and talkative when you are. Also that you figure out how to ask on it without being able to ask on it :D .

Found an old link to the english manual as a pdf. it is a broken link. Can this be reinstated or included/made part of the launcher ("online manual") or even linked locally in the program group that has the website link in it?

* Language.
Oh man. Like, wow. There are some issues here with translation. I can't speak a word of German - well okay, a few words - but there are places too numerous to keep track of where the English needs a TL500 repper.

now, bear with me a moment, because i know there are serious code issues to be fixed... but...

I could go on for hours about this but i will spare us all and say simply: any number of bugs, errors, and other "works in progress" can be forgiven by a smooth, immersive environment that *seems* like it's got it all together. Don't believe me? Ever hear of Microsoft? :cool:

Seriously, some of the dialog is very badly b0rked. More importantly, some missions and other vital NPC speech is written so oddly as to render it nearly useless. Yes, you figure it out eventually. No, spending an hour doing nothing but running around losing your mind before realizing something's broken is not much fun at all.

* an ingame notepad or other 'log' of the n00b popups you get:

Ties in with the last point. We need basic info on usability, on the interface, on where stuff is and what happens when you get there!

THIS IS VITAL. Please read.

The first mission i got was broken; the NPC target didn't exist. However, navigation and mission text and info is *so vague* i literally spent *hours* running around the city looking for it, assuming i'd missed it, was doing something wrong, was a lost noob, etc.

Finally i sent a petition and a merciful GM in shiny red armour confirmed the lack of NPC. Had it not been my first bloody mission, maybe i would have realized the lack of a "pointer sign" meant he didn't exist, but...

I would imagine that for many new folks wandering in, especially on trial, spending much of the first day doing nothing but attempting things that turned out broken would be a major, huge, massive turn-off. It was extremely frustrating to say the least. I beg of you, don't turn your backs on this issue because you worry that it's pointless because all the bugs won't get fixed overnight. Instead work with what you can control, and beef up informational systems so such things are a lil less painful, and easier to avoid.

Frex, if the mission text would be more than a strangely-written sentence or two, one can know if it's one's own noobish fault or if there's something actually broken, drop it and move on to something fun. :angel:

I'm thinking of all the "had to be told on HELP>" information that should be part of tutorials, of ingame help text, or otherwise presented as part of the process. There was a lot.. some of the more obvious are


Stats. No mouseover text. Much debate over what they do...
NPCs you're looking for will have a 'pointer box,' not just the noob mission from Info Manager.
Missions are incredibly vague, or devoid of into entirely. The const missions, frex.. they say NOTHING! Accept one from a cityterm, you will be lost until some merficul soul tells you to get back to faction HQ.


Why are these things important? You guys need time to work on the broken stuff, and I'd imagine that time can be bought more easily with more accounts. Things need to be fixed in "noob order;" if the longtime, diehard, going-to-stay-a-while addicts scream and shout, remind them that they need people to play WITH ;) . And that the game needs to turn a profit!

Bottom line: if the entry experience is confusing; gives the *appearance* of being waaaay unfinished or outright broken; provides a frustrating first-day of gaming; or is in other ways proving to be a bummer; people won't stay, and more people won't come.

Final point: i'd like to put your money where my mouth is :D . Forums are all about telling other people what they should do, without ever being in danger of having to do any of it. Therefore, I, being a geek of moderate calibre with a concentration in "nerd hermit," would be more than happy to take great gobs of English ingame text, clean it up, and send it back. Seriously. I will gladly sign a contract to the effect of "this work was done as an independant contractor for compensation to consist solely of some ingame in-character mention somewhere in the back of the newspaper maybe at KK's discretion if we feel like it and the work doesn't suck."

But whatever you do, please don't ignore these points and plow on. I'm going to stick around when the trial ends 'cause i gotta see how it all turns out, and no other mmog i've found has been as remotely interesting, but these things still worry me.

Thanks for reading this far!

</rant>

joran420
13-12-05, 02:03
nice post :)

nemesys
13-12-05, 02:04
fast reader :D
and thanks!

SovKhan
13-12-05, 02:17
some very good points from a fresh POV. the points you mentioned are not anything i would even think about. most of the noobie stuff i just brush over and get to leveling or in case of a mission i have memorized the location or npc's. NC has a huge learning curve which is both the best and worst part of the game IMO.

kurai
13-12-05, 03:35
All excellent points .

(that, incidentally, have been made by many people many times. This absolutely doesn't mean that they aren't worth making again. You never know - one day someone at KK might actually take them seriously and do something about it :D )

I'd love to see some "exit poll" type stats/feedback - I am willing to bet cold hard cash that a monstrous percentage of account cancellations happen in the early days of playing because of the whole poor `noob experience`.
If someone perserveres past the first week I strongly suspect that the `retention` of the account would be significantly long term - and of course in the MMO world `retention` means revenue. Revenue means survival and resources - which means more staff to eventualy get around to coding fixes for the `big ticket` bugged stuff.
I'd imagine KK loses 75% of players without ever recieving a single payment from them.
Any marketing operations you might undertake are just money down the drain if you can't keep the people you tempt in through the door.

[Believe it or not the `noob experience` *has* received some attention over the years - the whole MC5 area, the Mr. Jones starter missions etc etc - but they have been mostly half arsedly implemented, so are somewhat self defeating.]

So, Dear KK - in summary :- pay some attention to the `low hanging fruit` *easy* stuff that just gets left broken for ever and you might have some chance of staying viable or growing enough to be able to afford to do more of the big stuff.

You'd also, incidentally, have a much happier non noob `veteran` player base. We could forgive an awful lot more of the every day minor irritations and major annoyances if there were simply more people running about the place.
Neocron is a *so* much richer environment when there are plenty of other people to interact with.

james_finn
13-12-05, 03:51
some very interesting comments there, I have to agree that it has all be said before, the while learning curve of the game is a very hard one, and it does rely upon people being kind and talking on Help! If im not too busy I always have HELP> unmuted to help noobie people, as I was once *shock horror* a noob too!

But its nice for you to take the time to post this, and I hope that KK listens to what you have to say - as I agree it is an important part of the whole gaming experience!

- Delphi

Rabiator
20-12-05, 23:30
What, no rating function in this forum? This thread deserves *****
Bumping instead ... +1 ;)

S0lo
21-12-05, 11:25
Aye this is too important for KK to miss. If I didn't start playing Neocron with a friend who was in the beta stuff then i doubt I would have continued it. You kinda get dumped in the world in some shitass desert without a clue. Perhaps some pop up screens (tutorial style) when you get in Mc5 would be handy for the starters. An npc at the beginning instructing them to slay a spider and promise them a reward, Set an arrow to an area where there are a coupla noob spiders. So simple but it does give them a starting goal. Then a lil' screen informing them of the option to keep hunting in mc5 or head for the genrep so they can teleport to their app. You really gotta take the noobs by the hand or it'll be a crap on a stick experience.

I seen it firsthand when I tried to get some friends to play NC cause I started again, but their initial reactions were kinda like. "gawd this is weird, wtf I gotta do. Experiment gone wrong? mmkay.. out the door.. another door.. Big desert, taliban around? I shoot this guy, crap he kills me. Okay try again.. damn he kills me again.. What now.. *wanders around poking some creeps with his knife* boring.. where is everyone.. bah.. I'ma play some WoW *logs off*." :(

Anyhow stuff been said before but like james_finn and others have said, if KK does not use it to improve their game, then its useless. So take note damnit!

Nidhogg
21-12-05, 11:41
Thanks for a very constructive and well thought out post. I'm going to give you a fuller response once I've checked a couple of things but I wanted you to know that I had read it and appreciate the comments put forward.

N

Riddle
21-12-05, 13:01
Its good to get a fresh perspective on the game especially from a new runner. Having played for a fair while now i don't remember the last time i did a noobie mission or even a mission lol.

Stuff i wouldn't spot because i look over it :eek: I'm all for retaining new runners <<Logans Emporium>> Works hard to furnish new runners with Outstanding weapons and some advice when i can! :angel:

So again thank you for the input and lets hope KK take it on board.

Foo
21-12-05, 13:55
Great Points , was nice to read that some 1 new isnt just going to hit cancel and disapear w/o saying a word .

KK should take a little leaf out of SWG's book imo (Now dont jump to conclusions just yet) , if any of you have played SWG then you know what im talking about , it is very helpfull to newbies at the start , so much stuff you learn in the first day, pop ups ,Missions, In depth class/prof help . They dont teach yea everything , but what it did teach me made me wanna play more. i truely did take my hat off to them for that , cause it helped a awfull lot in learning the game mechanics (tho the game has gone down hill , im talking about that learning curve , yea it might not be as steep as NC but still).

So yea , listen to ppl like the thread starter, this kinda stuff could realy help the new guys stay and make a much better game for us all :).

CMaster
21-12-05, 14:00
Hmm - delivevy missionbs should be removed - their XP is negligible and most of htem don't work/send you somewhere in the other city/distant wastes. As for the game having a lot of "Engrish" - definatley.