View Full Version : The inherent Problem witht the Dome of York
While brining the dome as a city into the game made sense, the implementation of it, in both RP and functional ways has made it somewhat a White Elephant.
OK, first off the functiona/aestheticl side:
The Dome of York is 9 sectors + 5 Faction HQs. This might sound small compared to Neocron City's vast 31 (admittedly 1 is blocked off), plus 6 faction HQs and a whole load of other installations (Pussy Club, 2 neofrags etc). However, Neocron is : A - more varied over the many zones and B - laregly concertated within 7 of the 10 inner-city sections. In addition to the variety, there is plenty IN neocron - you can't walk 10 metres without passing shops, HQs, Appartment lifts, strip clubs etc. In DoY you can walk an entire sector pasing nothing but grey concrete walls. The place just feels EMPTY. And while I can't deny that the place is nice and atmospheric for a ruined mega city, its also damn depressing. Its not somewhere I or many other people feel a desire to spend time in. The lack of a unified transport sytem makes getting around a real pain too. And finally, there is nothing like the variety or usefullness in levelleing areas on DoY - although NC's contigent is wayyy underused.
Now, from an RP point of view - none of the anti-city factions want to be in DoY. We have Twighlight Guardian and Crahn Sect, both of whom want to rule Neocron City, and couldnt care less for the shell they inhabit. We have Black Dragon and Tsunami, who just want to sell their wares - the population of DoY is far too small, and they come from and wish to sell to NC (population is small because only the people aligned with a faction would have moved - your average NC citizen (not runner) has no faction). Fallen Angels are at best content with their current location, but seem to have far larger plans in the works, and may want TH back.
So, there is no reason, either from functionality or RP to have any care for the dome, or the desire to defend it. Instead, peple hang out at cycrow, where the UG is nice and hunting is good. They raid the city cos its easy to get into and some Neocronian will come to drive them out because they do care about their city. While the dome might not be THAT large, it feel so because it is repeteive and there is NOTHING in it.
So, ultimatley the dome is a big waste of space atm.
Agreed - I very nearly rolled a different faction this time - purely because I HATE the dome - Gimme my flippin TH back.
Please? @_@
"the population of DoY is far too small, and they come from and wish to sell to NC"
there is NO population in DoY...
Page 91 of the NC 2 manual
"In a last minute effort of all of Neocron’s factions, their forces conquer the last heavily defended uplink post and gain access to the Dome of York’s network. The bomb‘s detonation codes are hurriedly entered
into the bomb‘s system. Shortly before launch, the bomb is exploded on the pad and a gigantic explosion wipes out all life in the Dome. The detonation also triggers the invasion of the Dome’s tunnels by the Techhaven-Alliance. The Alliance forces storm the tunnels wiping out any last resistance encountered and soon control all the entry points into the doomed city"
- this goes on to say blah blah blah the TH alliance kills every NC attacker cos NC suck...
... the amount of losses encurred by reeza during this shite storyline means that the city has lost roughly over 85% of its military capability and is nothing but a mewling state... all because TG/BD etc slaughter pro city's EVERY time they encounter each other.
oh and the FA have turned from being the ONLY good guys in the game (NC 1) to Evil masterminds that makes the ENTIRE worlds population their puppets, to be manipulated as they see fit (NC 2)
oh and tell me... why did DoY open negotiations with the anti city sides and invite tehm to live in the zone (all events in NC 1) to have this completely fucked over in NC 2?
who was yur writer exactly? another cocknocker with a hardon for the Dome
Agree 100% CMaster and Spermy.
A very nice and constructive post tbh.
The Dome is ugly/dreary, and it's just not a pleasant place to be.
Its easy to get lost, especially for newbies - because everywhere is repetitive.
It's time like this I wish more MMOs would release SDKs.
Imagine if we had a program capable of creating/editing our own levels.
Like FPS games (Counter-Strike) KK could use our maps to replace their own rather boring alternatives.
Gulinborsti
17-06-05, 15:48
IMHO all the sectors that aren't home to a faction or have a sepcific function should be removed from the Dome.
This would leave us 6 Sectors + Faction HQs:
City Center
Black Dragon + HQ
Crahn Sect + HQ
Tsunami + HQ
Twilight Guardian + HQ
Fallen Angels + HQ
Arrange them something like this, swap sectors as you want, doesn't really matter:
FA --- CC --- CS
0|00/00|00\00|
0|0/000|000\0|
TS --- TG --- BD
0|00000|00000|
0|00000|00000|
Exit000Exit000Exit
All these empty sectors between the main DoY sectors don't make any sense as empty and boring they are.
If NC ever gets more players it might even get a little bit overcrowed, which would add to RP backgroud of DoY: a refuge for all beaten and persecuted factions opposing NC and Rezza's administration.
[TgR]KILLER
17-06-05, 15:49
Fallen Angels are at best content with their current location, but seem to have far larger plans in the works, and may want TH back.
FA doesn't want to be in DOY lol every saw how doy looks compaired to TH ? i wanna get out of that dump and get back to TH :/ all the changes in the story to get DoY full of factions is all nice but it screwed up the standings that were good in nc1 this side to side thing is fucked up imho.
@ above why the hell you should remove sectors in doy thats a stupid idea that has no base on it at all. then you should remove half plaza via rosso all PP and OZ to since no factions live there.
Gulinborsti
17-06-05, 15:54
KILLER']
@ above why the hell you should remove sectors in doy thats a stupid idea that has no base on it at all. then you should remove half plaza via rosso all PP and OZ to since no factions live there.But NCs sectors are nice and have shops and add to the atmosphere, I really liked it as big it is back in NC1 before I was forced to leave for the dome with my faction.
Neocron IS the MAIN city, so it's ok that it's large and shiny, at least that's what I think...
there is NO population in DoY...
it has been already said before, the doy-population is gathered at cycrow ug :p
it has been already said before, the doy-population is gathered at cycrow ug :p
oh yea... sorry i seem to keep forgetting that ;)
IMHO all the sectors that aren't home to a faction or have a sepcific function should be removed from the Dome.
This would leave us 6 Sectors + Faction HQs:
...
All these empty sectors between the main DoY sectors don't make any sense as empty and boring they are.
This is a great idea.
Make the dome smaller, remove all the annoying empty sectors - they are dull and boring.
KILLER']...why the hell you should remove sectors in doy thats a stupid idea that has no base on it at all. then you should remove half plaza via rosso all PP and OZ to since no factions live there.
He doesn't mean remove them because no faction lives there.
He means remove them to make the Dome nicer, less repetitive (remove the dumb empty sectors).
Dribble Joy
17-06-05, 16:26
I don't find the Dome that repetitive, but more distinction between the sectors is needed.
ArthurDent2k
17-06-05, 16:36
Jap,agree...In NC you always know at least the Sector you're in, in DoY I couldn't even tell at which End I am without the Compass :D
Heavyporker
17-06-05, 16:43
This is all so amusing.
You don't like the place you're living in, so you petition to have it made even smaller. Heh.
The Dome is fine the way it is. It *is* a ruined city. Frankly, only thing I'd want is some sort of on-going minor improvements to the Dome as the populace surrenders to their reality and starts making their environs more comfortable. More shops with unique wares. New restaurants. New underground areas and streets cleared up and their contents discovered. Etc etc. The Dome has so much friggin' potential, but you're all just whining and kvetching because you want things to be the way they were, as in NO Dome, less new tech and items, hell, HackNet removed because it doesn't suit you.
I agree with none of the so-called solutions in this.
You do know that FA still nominally controls TH. There's nothing to stop DoY runners from coming into TH and making themselves comfortable.
Yeah more red and such is needed in the BD/TSU zones to make it feel like the pimps paradise PP was when they were there.
The zones are all very different just the way the dome is textured gives it that repetative feeling, what would be nice is to see more random stuff (like the crahn thing in Sec4(i think)) The VoTR gives some life to sec 5 but with No NPCs spare the gaurds it makes it seem abandoned perhpas the VoTR team could get some NPCs spawned there to make it a tad lively.
What would be nice i think is to see some mutated citizens of the dome although its said everyone was wiped out some dome citizens may have been outside of the city and came back to and unprotected and radiated city before FA got the radiation levels to something nice.
More random NPCs like the mutants an tramps in NC are needed for the dome, just something to make it feel alive this could easily be done as its the re-building of the dome to make it suitable for the factions living there, i.e. the annoucement system has been restored (Added) so why can other things not be added to the dome?
EDIT: It would be nice for KK to make Clan Residences possible in TH but for quite a sum more than usual apparments as the Peaceful scientists of FA (The storyline shows FA is some what 2 groups now with scientists staying and maintaining TH) wouldnt want war within their peaceful trade outposts but for a high price im sure they would be swayed.
No answer to the RP issue that no factions want to be there?
ANd yes, people need to remmeber that a splinter of FA still controls TH, and is still neutral to all.
@Heavyporker you post is arogant and ignorant.
Nobody here is whining, it's a thread suggesting a possible improvement to the dome.
Just because you personally may like it, doesn't mean everyone else does.
If you wish to be constructive and make suggestions, fine?
The idea about the restaurants is valid.
Although places like that are rarely used... not much RP.
I agree about the shops.
More shops, less smugglers.
@Tratos good suggestions, especially about the NPCs.
No answer to the RP issue that no factions want to be there?
ANd yes, people need to remmeber that a splinter of FA still controls TH, and is still neutral to all.
The factions dont want to be there but i assume they'd make the dome as suitable as possible if there going to be living there for some time.
Agreed - it seems entirely unreasonable to me that there isnt one appartment availble that has been patched up, and things like that - sureley after a few years in the dome, that would have happened....
Heavyporker
17-06-05, 16:59
*I'm* arrogant and ignorant?
I'm not the one suggesting the elimination of entire sectors because of their inconvience and "depressive mood".
All the factions in Dome are there because it suits their needs at the moment. Populations will grow naturally (that's the way lifeforms operate - they multiply). Markets will grow in time. BD/TSU aren't about completely forsake the Dome simply because it isn't as lucrative as Neocron would be. if there's a profit to make, they WILL maintain a serious presence to gather it and protect it.
And why less smugglers?! With increasing population, the demand for not-easily-obtainable items will only grow. Therefore, the number of smugglers will almost certainly grow.
And let's be frank - while some might expect an active repair of the Dome, why would you think people would start repairing apartments instead of streets, structural elements, etc etc?
trigger hurt
17-06-05, 17:02
The Dome has so much friggin' potential, but you're all just whining and kvetching because you want things to be the way they were, as in NO Dome, less new tech and items, hell, HackNet removed because it doesn't suit you.
I want hacknet removed because it doesn't work. It's added another level of complication that doesn't need to be there. Most everyone I've talked to that has spent more than a few minutes gathering blue prints from a database also acknowledges that hacknet is broken. Right now, hacknet is useful for two things. Camping dedicated hackers at choke points to negate any effort of ground forces outside of hacknet. Doesn't matter how good you are on the outside...if the opposing side has the entry points camped...you'll rarely see the op change hands. The other thing is travel. Skill 25 hack, equip hacktool and voila...bypass the more mundane forms of travel.
I agree with none of the so-called solutions in this.
I've never agreed with any idea you've ever had. What's your point? Do we need your approval before we come forward with our own ideas? Who died and made you king? Are you even playing the same game as the rest of us? I know it's difficult staying in touch with the outside world when you spend the majority of your time sitting in your "shop" pawning over-priced goods to the masses.
trigger hurt
17-06-05, 17:05
*I'm* arrogant and ignorant?
I'm not the one suggesting the elimination of entire sectors because of their inconvience and "depressive mood".
All the factions in Dome are there because it suits their needs at the moment. Populations will grow naturally (that's the way lifeforms operate - they multiply). Markets will grow in time. BD/TSU aren't about completely forsake the Dome simply because it isn't as lucrative as Neocron would be. if there's a profit to make, they WILL maintain a serious presence to gather it and protect it.
And why less smugglers?! With increasing population, the demand for not-easily-obtainable items will only grow. Therefore, the number of smugglers will almost certainly grow.
And let's be frank - while some might expect an active repair of the Dome, why would you think people would start repairing apartments instead of streets, structural elements, etc etc?
From an RP perspective...populations would increase. You are failing to grasp one key issue. New players are not massing at the login screen to get into the game. KK cannot artifically create population, it has to be done through people buying the game, paying for a subscription and sticking with it longer than a 10 day trial. Without REAL people to play the game, the population does not grow.
Second. It doesn't suit Tsunami or Black Dragon to be in the dome where the population is close to nil. Why? Well because Tsunami and Black Dragon are about money and power. Money comes from people buying stuff. Power comes from amassing large quantities of money to the point where you can pay to have your way. Black Dragon and Tsunami have no reason to be in the dome cause that's not where the populace is supposed to be. Remember...everyone in the dome was killed leaving only a few factions to repopulate...hardly a good business decision.
Guys, in an RP sense, Runners are a tiny fraction of the population - its the genric citizens, the ones who work at Garriot's and at the TT factory and so on - those are the population if NC. The only avergae people who have moved to DoY are those tightly aligned with a faction - and so there is hardly any money to be made for BD and TSU in DoY - NC has a minimum 10 times the pop of DoY.
Guys, in an RP sense, Runners are a tiny fraction of the population - its the genric citizens, the ones who work at Garriot's and at the TT factory and so on - those are the population if NC. The only avergae people who have moved to DoY are those tightly aligned with a faction - and so there is hardly any money to be made for BD and TSU in DoY - NC has a minimum 10 times the pop of DoY.
like i was saying tho.. the only population in DoY would be the ones brought there by their various factions as the anticity's have already committed genocide... so theres probably even less than anyone realised, unless the AB have taken residence.... which i very much doubt
I only go to DoY for my Clan Apartment.
@Heavyporker you post is arogant and ignorant
I assume baddass ment your - Attacking content and not person
*I'm* arrogant and ignorant?
Read whats said and dont take it personally (I did not read you post as some feel it is arogant and ignorant ....
Solution
NC has some sort of purpose
DOY is a housing establishment.
Its funny red light district satyed in NC ... TH still open,
If I moved to some crummy old shit hole from techhaven, I would blowTH up as I dont want enemy to find out anything about our operations. I would not make it a friendly meeting point for friends and enemies ....
TH is so not roleplay it is sick ... If someone wants to sell an enemy Arms and equipment, or offer a service, it should be in some dark ally ... whens the last time you Heard Of Bin Laden buying arms in the National Afrgan Parliment building, where he could openly view weapons on sale, and service, and then exchange cash .... TH is a sin against role playing
Its tiring having everything as a short cut ... very sad
This is all so amusing.
You don't like the place you're living in, so you petition to have it made even smaller. Heh.
It's a bit of a pain in the arse to have to put up with the constant travel, if you call it that - personally I think it's just a mindless wander looking at the same old scenery - although, what you suggest in a line or so would remedy this.
The Dome is fine the way it is. It *is* a ruined city.
Yeah - storyline wise 100% agree - but NC is a BIG city a megacity even - and you guys don't have all the meaningless shit that we have - you have a nice lively city - with nice sound announcements - not totally wank (ahem! bitrate sounds around 92 or summat!) excuses for slogans. Most of the meaningless crap in NC is locked away - and for what isn't you aren't FORCED to walk through it - you have a dedicated transport system.
Frankly, only thing I'd want is some sort of on-going minor improvements to the Dome as the populace surrenders to their reality and starts making their environs more comfortable.
Yes - Community input would be awesome - maybe via ingame questionaires as we saw in TH?
More shops with unique wares. New restaurants. New underground areas and streets cleared up and their contents discovered.
Yes.
Etc etc. The Dome has so much friggin' potential, but you're all just whining and kvetching because you want things to be the way they were, as in NO Dome, less new tech and items, hell, HackNet removed because it doesn't suit you.
Yes and no.
I wish the arrangement in the dome was more relevant to events that have transpired - as it is it feels like we've all been bunched in there slap bang, no thought. My problem - I don't necesarilly speak for other domers, isn't the update - just THE DOME. That is me speaking as a domer - and as an FA (and practically any FA worth his salt would want to move back to TH - look at our sector - live in it - can you say SHAFTED?)
I agree with none of the so-called solutions in this.
We need to put some noggins together both community and KK wise if consumers aren't happy obviously they aren't going to be able to force it down our throats - BUT from KKs perspective it would be exactly fair to have them redo everything they've just spent a lotta time doing.
You do know that FA still nominally controls TH. There's nothing to stop DoY runners from coming into TH and making themselves comfortable.
Yeah - But I do miss the old days of an Angels TH - especially on uranus when the UA was around it worked as it does now - save for a few minor scuffles which people weren't too bothered about and in somecases were happy to see. As it is now - it's a safezone - only made into a trading zone - not by the community as it should have been - but purely because a bunch of vendors have been plonked there.
I gave up my home in TH for that?
Pshh.
Anyhow - Agree with points - disagree - key point is people want to do something about it - so lets get some noggins together.
Oh - and for the record - I'm not kissing arse.
THIS
This is all so amusing.
Pisses me off. You always have this holier than thou attitude. Get rid of it and maybe people would actually LISTEN rather than bitch.
IMHO all the sectors that aren't home to a faction or have a sepcific function should be removed from the Dome.
This would leave us 6 Sectors + Faction HQs:
City Center
Black Dragon + HQ
Crahn Sect + HQ
Tsunami + HQ
Twilight Guardian + HQ
Fallen Angels + HQ
Arrange them something like this, swap sectors as you want, doesn't really matter:
FA --- CC --- CS
0|00/00|00\00|
0|0/000|000\0|
TS --- TG --- BD
0|00000|00000|
0|00000|00000|
Exit000Exit000Exit
All these empty sectors between the main DoY sectors don't make any sense as empty and boring they are.
A bit of rearranging might be a good idea, to shorten the ways between factions. I find the long distances in DOY annoying myself.
But don't simply delete the empty sectors. Instead, leave them as unused territory at the periphery, maybe with the occasional high level mob roaming the corridors ;)
My favorite fix.. make plaza/doy safezones, remove TH safezone - give back to FA as a second base i guess (like TG canyon). i think the citycenter would be likely used for DOY traders afk what not as P1 would be (and as TH is now). even let CA lose control of PP and have ts/bd move in as a second home (some RP reason for also remaining in the dome, its not stable there or something)
also stops probably the best zones in the game (NC city/plaza/VR) from being entirely an ally killing zone by design... i miss being able to actually be in the city without having to stay buffed...
how much much ambiance within the cities would this restore... personally i think this is a must in the path to fixing/repairing the game. most people against it are the ones who utilize it for ally killing, but comeon its not even good for that being empty 95% of the time now. let us make these great zones have a purpose again. (doy AND nc)
Excellent post Cmaster - on the subject of HQ's don't forgot TS and BD have their hidden HQ's in NC. Making the Dome smaller, erm not a good idea.
I don't mind TH being used as it is, but in the end I like to see it back under FA control. (Ie the players like in NC1) The fights in TH was also cool, ranging from raids by Dark to Julia(?) runing her Angels hotline and her mission from Crahn to clense the Angels!
Oh yes, the best part about NC1 and TH, was the Phoenix store!
Oh yes, the best part about NC1 and TH, was the Phoenix store!
This is one reason i think TH should have clan apps in it again (for a higher price as i stated above) or even better bring back the all access buzzer again which was in at the beginning of NC2 so people can make there own shops in the trading facility.
I've run several of the new player missions in DoY and NC.
Time to completion for the DoY-based missions is double that of the NC-based missions. Getting the Quad in DoY takes about an hour on a 0/2 character with 20 or so Agility/Athletics. Getting the Quad in NC proper takes half an hour, tops.
DoY is just too big and too empty to be worth standing around in. Add to that the rather obfuscated signage and Navray mapping and, well, why bother?
Heavyporker
17-06-05, 22:12
Um. Tratos...
Level 3 Th apartments have been around a long time now. Nothing stopping people from starting stores in TH.
I have contemplated it once or twice.
yeah do it! ill be there for sure ;)
Um. Tratos...
Level 3 Th apartments have been around a long time now. Nothing stopping people from starting stores in TH.
I have contemplated it once or twice.
Im well aware of that ;) but it would be nice to have Clans be able to base in TH or the all access buzzer to be back ingame to make people able to just wander into the store.
Freaky Fryd
17-06-05, 23:56
You do know that FA still nominally controls TH. There's nothing to stop DoY runners from coming into TH and making themselves comfortable.
There's even a guarded HQ there for the DOY runners to hang out in...
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.