View Full Version : Neocron 2 Op war - The future of war?
Guys was just chatting with one of the clan and was saying if ops had that little more to them things could be awesome during war.
Such as.......
Guard towers in the op which can be manned by tanks/hc pe's
NPC guards bought and maintained to patrol and defend your op.
Instant warnings on clan chat when an npc is agged by enemy.
The possibilities are endless. Maybe vehicles would be used more to bomb the towers and gaurds? rhinos to help in the ground battle?
All just ideas guys. But i think it would be cool if an op war was an all out war which took a couple of hours hard work using organsied tactics etc?
rather than people ninjaing every op when players aint on.
Some of these ideas have been thought of b4 but, the Devs seem to help alot more in NC2. Maybe they will listen to our voice?
whats your thoughts guys?
Good ideas, but if you look back at brainport posts for the last 4 years you will see that people have been suggesting cool outpost war changes for that long. So far we've had three changes - UG genrepping / removal of Gat 3 / Hacknet 4th layer.
The Outpost war is the thing that keeps me playing, I would love KK to develop it further because it is the end-game for many players. However, when or if this will happen is in serious doubt. If they ever did a theme week (year...) for Op wars then I'd like to see:
- New Outposts
- Redesigned Outposts
- Removal of DoY Bots near to North East Outposts
- Alteration / Removal of Hacknet's Role in Op wars
- City Outposts
- Balance changes to remove Underground Zone Whoring
- Faction / War System changes to encourage 3 way fights
In all the outpost fights I've been at, the best ones have been when two forces meet up outside the Op or between two ops, often by chance. I think anything that descends into a barrelling of the underground is lame for both sides.
Guard towers in the op which can be manned by tanks/hc pe's it will outbalance the defenders.
NPC guards bought and maintained to patrol and defend your op. patrol only.
Instant warnings on clan chat when an npc is agged by enemy. Message On Sight!
The possibilities are endless. Maybe vehicles would be used more to bomb the towers and gaurds? rhinos to help in the ground battle? Thats a commun tactics to use vehicles in opwars.
[QUOTE]rather than people ninjaing every op when players aint on.[QUOTE] ninja'ing ops, while only 1 person online, there will be no help, if u hire NPC's.
-
I really like the Idea of hired Patrols arround the op, the other options are too much outbalancing the sides.
Adding new dimention to op wars .....
First attack - neutralise heavy core of defences = Need vehicles to take out manned turrets.
Second wave move into the traditional op war realm, of PVP, Introduce a maot so the vehicles cant get into op, and a outter wall, so PVP would occur in the outer wall area away from Turrets (Watching the 3/4 entrances over the moat.
Well it would be nice ... also a cash sink ... turrets are destroyed so need to be re-purchased , but they are also tough and can be retracted but not repaired. (That occurs over time)
So op war occurs, clan come sout shooting (attackers), Defenders ready selves and pull out turrets, game on destroy turrets or vehicles, and then move in for the fight
Mechanicus
07-06-05, 14:25
thinking about seles "City Outposts" suggestion they should add an outpost to a not so used area of each city, like outzone in NC and i have no idea where in DoY, for some really differnt city fighting
I have seen loads of these ideas, like the mounted video cameras to coordinate your troops was last one i read afaik.
OP wars is the END GAME
Once you have all the MC5 chips you need, cst all the shit you need, sold all the shit you want too, its all thats left to do.......This is one area for a Theme month :rolleyes: .
There are currently different OP's with different bonuses but are essentialy the same to raid. The OP war you go to should be affected by the OP you attack, i.e. different defences, Hacking etc.
So each Op war at each OP is a differnet experience :D
Meh, OPs are kinda dumb atm. With the exception of mines, they are big, fortified structures, with walls, defensive positions, battlements etc. And what happens ever Op war ever? The attackers walk inside all this fortiication and start hacking, and the whole fight takes place inside the OP. Its become common tactics now for the defenders to come from another location rather than UG, so theoretcially the ATTACKERs could be using the OP's forifications, except they have to still watch the UG. On top of that, with PPUs buffing and healing, no matter how much fire you lay down, you are unlkiley to drop anyone running at an op - there are a dew solutions there 1. Weaken PPUs, 2. Set up a gang of revelles, 3. increase draw-distance, 4. Allow purchase of reveller-gun style turrets to be placed in OPs.
I've always liked the idea of turrets being controlled by runners (ala Tribes), either throught hacknet (spy only) or through RCL skill. Varied objectives like generators/computers being destroyed, making repairers valued in the field.
This would be a balancing nightmare though :p
Original monk
07-06-05, 15:26
i like to see manable turrets with air and vehiculerockets on top of OP's ... i would like to see mines being placed on OPground .. i would like to see controlable fences (lasersfences anyone? ... yust drop youre fighters in the OP with a doycarier if needed :) ) yust as a few quick examples i remember from previous posts :)
also about the removal of gatling MK3 turrets .. i never heard anywhere they got removed ... i never heard anywhere why they got removed ... current turrets arent worth placing ... everyone yust runs past em ... and stunsturrets do nothing ...
i would really like mk3 turrets to come back ... i seen pro aswel as anticity clans using em .. how do they get there ? fallen from the sky ??? O_o O_o O_o
edit: and if turrets really bother people, KK should add rare grenadelaunchers :)
edit2: manable turrets, asked in one of Tha Polls, option 10 (i found one back hehe) ... http://neocron.jafc.de/showthread.php?t=44928&highlight=rares ... also notice the disruptor, the revenge and the devourer ... 28th day of the first month 2003
[QUOTE=netster]it will outbalance the defenders.
isn't that what the ug does?? :lol:
it will outbalance the defenders.isn't that what the ug does?? :lol:
no, the UG for staying save, but dont say me, u can attack someone outside, when u're inside the ug... ^_^
no, the UG for staying save, but dont say me, u can attack someone outside, when u're inside the ug... ^_^
was making a joke about the zonewhores :eek:
Guard towers in the op which can be manned by tanks/hc pe's
Love it x 1,000,000 :D There are already tower models in-game - just add a gunner position like a vehicle gunner seat and viola. I'm thinking maybe 1 per Fortress (The combat bonus + multiple towers would be over-powering methinks) and 2 per other type of OP. This hopefully would add to the Tank/PE population (I'm all for anything that reduces the Monk Population :P) and would balance things for the clans that don't have 150-250 characters in them.
NPC guards bought and maintained to patrol and defend your op.
Instant warnings on clan chat when an npc is agged by enemy.
I asked for this awhile ago - a hireable (i.e. having this guard relieves you of any cash you'd get for owning the OP) 120/120 Faction Guard that you can buy to stand next to your UG Entrance. Once killed he can't be respawned until you re-hack the OP terminal or something. I'd love to see:
CLAN > Chester Lab Guard : I'm taking fire! I might need some back-up...
I totally agree though - OP War PvP is End-game and many players are at that point.
How about turrets can only be climbed onto through UG. So in order to Man a Turret, you zone in, climb into and zone out. It takes 15 seconds to zone out and 45 seconds to zone in again.
Turrets take damage and cannot be repaird, and 3 minutes to mount a new one.
Only select few places fo turrets and a Max of 4 turrets at any op, with a fortress having another 1 turret. AT least 3 of these turrets would have LOS of entrance and of UG.
A second zone point for undergrounds, making zone camping more difficult.
Who would design an opertions point, and then have only 1 exit / entrance. EU law states that there be an emergency exit incase of fire at main exit (Haw Appropriate, fire at exit).
These all favour defending team, so a few more incentives fro attackers need to be introduced.
Man Op wars would rock .... Ahh well, we can all dream on .. I wonder if the second theme week will be, well, a theme year ?
Transformer
07-06-05, 17:10
Guys was just chatting with one of the clan and was saying if ops had that little more to them things could be awesome during war.
Such as.......
Guard towers in the op which can be manned by tanks/hc pe's
NPC guards bought and maintained to patrol and defend your op.
Instant warnings on clan chat when an npc is agged by enemy.
The possibilities are endless. Maybe vehicles would be used more to bomb the towers and gaurds? rhinos to help in the ground battle?
All just ideas guys. But i think it would be cool if an op war was an all out war which took a couple of hours hard work using organsied tactics etc?
rather than people ninjaing every op when players aint on.
Some of these ideas have been thought of b4 but, the Devs seem to help alot more in NC2. Maybe they will listen to our voice?
whats your thoughts guys?
well, your ideas arn't REALLLY bad but they just sound WAYYY too much like star wars galaxies tbh.
adding guards to outposts would be worthless as you have turrets now, plus it should be up to the people that own the op to defend it. Not some NPCs.
trigger hurt
08-06-05, 04:20
- New Outposts
- Redesigned Outposts
- Removal of DoY Bots near to North East Outposts
- Alteration / Removal of Hacknet's Role in Op wars
- City Outposts
- Balance changes to remove Underground Zone Whoring
- Faction / War System changes to encourage 3 way fights
I've always wanted to see it this way:
-New/Redesigned outposts...There are some really nice places in some of the lesser frequented zones of the wastelands. Greycore, that bunker in the side of a mountain one zone north of Eastgate, the tower north of Cajun, the gaya mines. Why aren't their any underground labs or factories that can be taken?
-More than just pvp to hold an op. Sometimes your outposts should come under attack of more than just other players. There are still mobs around certain areas that could attack outposts. Perhaps you have to clear out an infestation of 120/120 warbots or DoY gaurds or Ceres soldiers. The warbots could be given an rp reason...some ancient sub-routine in their programming clicked on and made it group with other warbots and attack a specific target. DoY gaurds...should only attack NC sided outposts as would City Gaurds attack DoY sided outposts. Ceres soldiers...flashbacks to the ceres wars cause them to attack any outpost randomly.
-Attacking group has to drop security measures from hacknet. Make hacknet the first level of security. When an enemy faction enters the uplink that the outpost is attached to, they receive a warning that enemies maybe targetting their outpost. Any clan that has an outpost that is attached to that uplink will get a warning and will be able to prepare for a fight.
-Front gate on outpost. Only way into the front gate is to either hack it from the outside or to have the security dropped in hacknet. Both of these will send a warning to the clan that currently owns the outpost. If security measures are dropped at an outposts owned by city admin, all factions allied with city admin will receive a warning that the outpost has come under attack. Once the front gate is opened, the attacking clan can enter the outpost and fight their way to the hack terminal.
-If the attacking group is defeated, the clan that owns the outpost will need to restore all security measures. There are a few parts to this. First, if hacknet security measures have been dropped, then the clan owning the op needs to go in and restore the security. Perhaps a special, one time use tool can be created to restore security hacknet security. On operating system of sorts for the hacknet security system. For each reinstall, you have to buy the software from HEW or some other specialized shop. This tool should have an intelligence and hacking requirement to use.
Second, if any layers were dropped at the terminal, the hardware is damaged somewhat. The amount of layers determines the amount of hardware damaged. Terminal Layer 1 only, maybe just replace a hard drive or some ram. Layer 1 and 2, hard drive, ram and perhaps the input device. Layer 1, 2 and 3, all of the hardware needs to be replaced and the owning clan will have to purchase a hack terminal to replace the old one. If they do not replace the terminal, they will receive no op bonus, no cash influx, the gr/gogo would be taken offline and anyone could enter the UG. If, after an extended period of time, they still have not replaced the hardware or the complete terminal, then the op is seen as abandoned and any clan that places a terminal there will take possession of the outpost.
-No gaurds around outposts, but turrets such as those on the back of a reveler that are fixed in position but can swivel from side to side would make defending ops interesting.
I think outposts should be alot harder to take than they are now, by having a defence barrier, kind of like a force field. Only the owning clan can pass through it and the clans or factions they allow, the attackers would need alot of AOE but vehicals would be better for the job. A contol tower inside the op would power the defence wall and bombers could take that out allowing the attackers to get in and finish the job. I kind of get these ideas from what other games have, the control tower could power some turrets but would need some form of fuel. The turrets would need ammo putting in them, it would be harder to run the outpost but there should be some profit and reward.
Have factory ops produce weapon parts out of chemicals, mine outposts could mine the minerals needed to produce the chemicals and labs could turn those minerals into chemicals needed for the factory. Maybe the factory could produce vehicals weapons and everything for much cheaper you kind of get the idea. But of coarse this sort of thing is never going to happen people are too short sighted and only think on the lines of zerg vs zerg with lots of killing and lots of spamming trade after a fight.
Make outpost mean something.
I also think there should be alot more outposts by making the map bigger, infact I think that should be KK's next major upgrade bigger map. New areas new mobs and hunting ground plus lvling spots with maybe another city ^^ were any faction can live. Would be kind of like NC1 with the old plaza 1 or 2 gathering ...well what ever. The current op wars are just the same old shit having monks and tanks AOE the UG while the denfenders zone whore because they don't have a chance, its bullshit.
Mebbe introduce 2 or 3 supper ops, like TG canyon, Regents, and the place in the ocean, the island fortress.
Then you could introduce better advantagesto owning these, and make them the goal of larger clans. These would have great bonuses (not attack bonus, but on all tradeskills perhaps)
Allowing multiple defences to be set up. It would take several hours to take one, and if the attackers were defeated, owning team would take several hours to clean up.
You see? The ideas start flooding, people see the potential, the variety, the fun that could be had exploring these features....
...we might get one of these requests in 6 months. Sorry to flame, but based on the last 3 years that is how often you can expect something that effects the end-game for players.
agreed - infact the brainport chanel i pretty much for us to share ideas with each other - but the fact that they are never going to happen makes the channel pointless
trigger hurt
08-06-05, 13:50
You see? The ideas start flooding, people see the potential, the variety, the fun that could be had exploring these features....
...we might get one of these requests in 6 months. Sorry to flame, but based on the last 3 years that is how often you can expect something that effects the end-game for players.
if you go back about 2 years ago, most of the suggestions I made are variances on some I made and others made before in a similar thread. The additions to those ideas are the doy gaurds and hacknet seeing as those were not around during the first thread.
Also, some of my ideas come from anarchy online. When an org in AO enters a state of war, the entire server can receive a message if they choose to view that channel.
I've pretty much called it quits for pvp for a multitude of reasons. Yet another one is that endgame is boring and repetative.
Vae Victis
08-06-05, 17:07
Adding new dimention to op wars .....
First attack - neutralise heavy core of defences = Need vehicles to take out manned turrets.
Second wave move into the traditional op war realm, of PVP, Introduce a maot so the vehicles cant get into op, and a outter wall, so PVP would occur in the outer wall area away from Turrets (Watching the 3/4 entrances over the moat.
Well it would be nice ... also a cash sink ... turrets are destroyed so need to be re-purchased , but they are also tough and can be retracted but not repaired. (That occurs over time)
So op war occurs, clan come sout shooting (attackers), Defenders ready selves and pull out turrets, game on destroy turrets or vehicles, and then move in for the fight sounds good, if populations were better
Guard towers in the op which can be manned by tanks/hc pe's
it will outbalance the defenders.
it all depend on range, fireing arc, firepower.
first of all if it has his range less them a rhino everything is OK.
a usual turret is total uneffective against drones. just get a good spot and nuke it. same goes for bombers.
Other Questions is how effective is it against VHC.if its anti personal you can just drive in, press fire and nuke it from a tank.
if its VHC armoured just use a anti VHC weapon.
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