View Full Version : Bring Back Safe/Tradezones?
With all the discussion in another thread here, this idea has come up and I'd like to see it implemented on a smaller scale than originally proposed.
My suggestion is to bring back a small number of safe/trade zones within Neocron city. Neocron city is too beautiful and useful to not be used for trading and touring.
My suggestion is only for a few select areas that SHOULD be secure in an RP sense --Plazas and ViaRosso sectors. The Dome should stay unsafe because the Dome of York is in the beginings of rehabilitation and can't afford an organized police force.
To make this work, the Copbots have to be made to NOT attack Dome of York runners. When a citizen of an enemy country is visiting my country in real life, the NYPD does not open fire on them upon sight (and I've never heard of a country where this DOES happen), why then should CopBots open fire upon DoY citizens? Only RED SL runners should be fired upon. To vote on this topic go here: http://neocron.jafc.de/showthread.php?t=125339
Please post your ideas/suggestions/changes as well.
[TgR]KILLER
17-05-05, 17:57
we don't get any safezones in doy eighter do we !!1 no i can't really see why you need safezones. if you want to tour nothing is stopping you from doing that is there ? :/ and you got HQ's and TH as safezones to trade in.
KILLER']we don't get any safezones in doy eighter do we !!1 no i can't really see why you need safezones. if you want to tour nothing is stopping you from doing that is there ? :/ and you got HQ's and TH as safezones to trade in.
In Neocron, the guards and CopBots are stopping you. My tank would like to see the Neocron Zoo sometime... and my APU wants to visit the NCPD to report Neocron runners that mugged him of his pride ;)
Jesterthegreat
17-05-05, 18:03
nope not needed... LE + HQ's + TH
[TgR]KILLER
17-05-05, 18:06
In Neocron, the guards and CopBots are stopping you. My tank would like to see the Neocron Zoo sometime... and my APU wants to visit the NCPD to report Neocron runners that mugged him of his pride ;)
read the reply of nid in your other poll :p i gues thats the reason.
hell i want to see the zoo and stuff to but i'll just make an alt char on another server lol. we can't get to the city just as much as the city can't get to the dome. then again city has about 20 times as much guards :p
i think having the faction hq's is enough. most noobs i help get a lesson in the navray right off the bat, before i explain the weapon building and other aspects of the game.
In Neocron, the guards and CopBots are stopping you. My tank would like to see the Neocron Zoo sometime... and my APU wants to visit the NCPD to report Neocron runners that mugged him of his pride ;)
Then change sides. NC and DoY are at war, they're not just enemies. It's not that the nypd would shoot at an enemy if they came into the country, they just wouldn't ever get in (in theory) and would either be deported or arrested. And this isn't America, it's Neocron... capital punishment is the most used form of discipline.
Then change sides. NC and DoY are at war, they're not just enemies. It's not that the nypd would shoot at an enemy if they came into the country, they just wouldn't ever get in (in theory) and would either be deported or arrested. And this isn't America, it's Neocron... capital punishment is the most used form of discipline.
I am not talking about making Neocron like America. I just want a solid logic in the game. Either you want Safe/Tradezones in the city or you don't. Let's not change this discussion into something else. Please keep on topic.
We are not talking theory here, either in real life or in NC --With the secret entrances to NC, YES Dome runners WOULD be able to get in, much like it's REAL easy for a terrorist to get into the U.S..
*that's all I'm posting about the whole RL comparison thing. I'm not banging on the America drum so please don't assume I am. I am using my life experience as reference, please take it at face-value. Thank you.
Dribble Joy
17-05-05, 18:27
No, not only does it not make any sense why people should suddenly not be able to pull their guns out, but it doesn't contribute to the atmosphere.
On a similar note, I don't think there should be any safe GRs, at all. You want to travel quickly, you got to take the risk.
Copbots, gaurds and SL needs a rework anyway.
No no no
Reason I like no safe zones its what I payed for, you have the techhaven and many faction HQ's with everthing you need weapon parts lube etc. So why does plaza 1 need to be a safezone ?
I tell you what is needed and thats less gaurds or removing the stupid stun from copbot weapons. Parra is the worst pos in this game totaly unbalances PVP
make all the faction hq's back to how they were, ie not safe and then just have 1 safe zone in each city:
Plaza 1 for NC
City centre for DoY
Sector 2 in TH
make all the faction hq's back to how they were, ie not safe and then just have 1 safe zone in each city:
Plaza 1 for NC
City centre for DoY
Sector 2 in TH If they ever do make it possible to have a good inter-city raid lots of pvp then having a safe zone will only make people camp the zone line. Which is not very realistic and very frustating for people, we all do it if we are getting our asses kicked. But no one likes the whole zone line camping thing its better that one side loses the fight one way or the other, not this running out and rebuffing then running straight back in.
i would like Plaza 2 to be a safe zone, and thats it :)
i see it now, people fighting in p1 on the zone line, its pepper park and MB all over agian :)
It would be nice if they had another city which was divided in the conflict one side of it would be DoY the other neocron. It could have everything you would need in a city including lvling areas, but no safezones with a very small police force for gunning down low soulight runners. Then all the scum kind of like faction rejects, murderers etc that have nothing to do war can kill each other ^^
Or just use AB for people who wish to have freedom and make there own rules in there own little scruffy town
Digital-Talios
17-05-05, 19:19
how was it that they made MB a safe zone?
make all the faction hq's back to how they were, ie not safe and then just have 1 safe zone in each city:
Plaza 1 for NC
City centre for DoY
Sector 2 in TH Sounds good
Faction HQs should be made warzones if anything.
You got TH and your Apt to trade and idle in, cyber punk is supposed to be a scary place not a place where u can't even draw a weapon.
1*
NO
You have plenty of safe zones:
TH CM and all Faction HQs. Use them!
Of course I voted no.
PS You know, what would be nice would be for TH to have guards that only shot those with red SL. He he.
Voted No. Posting Why.
It's fine the way it is. HQs protect their runners and their allies. The city itself is reasonably safe, but any stealther or PPU'd team who puts effort into it can get in... just like DoY. Proposing that would require the same changes in DoY and I don't think it's really necessary, sorry.
No. Instead of adding another "force" to split the tradeskill-place it would be way better to add something which brings all the people closer together.
The main problem about Neocron is the player count. Having played AO the overall "feeling" about the trading places is better than in Neocron. AO has a pretty similar split of the factions like NC has, but they do have way more players to actually get it working nicely. This is not the case with NC, so there should be ways to allow players getting together.
I want to remind about the new players of this game. TH has been established now as the main trading place (at least on Terra). Unfortunately, you (a) may not know about it as a newbie and (b) you won't reach it without outside help (don't tell me you can do it, I'm talking about new players here :p). Basicly this means: They won't meet many players and will have trouble 'getting their weapons enhanced/modified/...' (read: build & modded). The help channel is not a cure for every problem ...
<insert all the other reasons of the previous posts here/>
But I have an idea. Every new player should get TH GR by default in the list. GRing from TH to a faction HQ and GRing from a faction HQ to TH should be very cheap, maybe you could scale it up with raising skill rank (up to the current fee for fully capped characters). That would allow low level players to meet with the all the others rather easily. They would have to visit their HQ first, though. This is not a downside, infact you get hinted to go there, anyway.
Maybe it can be varied, e.g. the GR can be added to the list for doing a small quest etc.pp., but the main concept counts. Naturally, this wouldn't be necessary if we had way more players ...
For all the higher level players I don't see much of a problem meeting in TH just for a chat, to trade, getting poked and so on (read: keeping it the way it is).
Digital-Talios
17-05-05, 20:56
From Neocron to TH it isnt that bad. One more then one occasion i ran up my 0/2 noob to there. Its from DoY to TH thats another matter.
I kinda like the idea of making TH a defualt gr location. When you GR to TH perhaps you could just make it 1k like when you gr to your apartment. This however probaly isnt needed at the moment. Id rather see those fabled power mechs, reduced bugs or Tokyo 2...
how was it that they made MB a safe zone?
prolly trying to compensate for the mass amount of guards nc has and the insane dmg doy guards do, imo its just like plaza3/pepper park 1 all over again
thats why i think they made it a safe zone, either that or logic would be that it was meant to be mb hq that was the zone intended to be safe and not the main gr :lol:
Vae Victis
17-05-05, 22:31
remove all safezones cept HQs and TH
Jesterthegreat
17-05-05, 22:36
remove all safezones cept HQs and TH
so basically make MB a real sector again... i'm happy with that.
god damn kk makin my home a safezone... i dont want that! i havent heard anyone suggest it or support it...
yet things that the community majority support have nothing done about them.
Part of me doesn't even want to get drawn into this argument. But you did say that if I voted no you want me to explain why.
1) People whined even more when they were safe zones. Back in the NC1 days, the number one whine, the number one crybaby whine, was about people hanging around the plaza cheating customers and trash talking and not being able to do anything about it. Huge overwhelming majorities voted to have them no longer be safe zones. I see no reason to revisit that decision at this late date.
2) City raiding is part of the game. If anything, it's too hard to raid enemy cities right now. Which brings up the next point.
3) They don't need to be safe zones, they're already something better: "safe enough zones." Seriously, how often do you see someone get killed in Plaza 1, or anywhere in Via Rosso? There just aren't very many places where either an anti-Reza runner, or an ally killer with red SL, can stand or move and engage in combat without getting para'ed all to hell and gone by the Copbots, and/or blown to hell by the Screaming Horse thugs. And if that's not safe enough for you, then ...
4) Put your LE chip back in, whiner. If you can't survive long enough to reach a safe zone or some other escape when you're attacked by surprise, it is way too early for you to have your LE chip out.
From Neocron to TH it isnt that bad. One more then one occasion i ran up my 0/2 noob to there. Its from DoY to TH thats another matter. ...No, it's not. From the TS exit in K_11 to the TH 3 entrance in F_08 is about the same distance as from the OZ Stn exit to TH 1. Maybe it's a trifle longer, but it's at least as safe. Your first few sectors will be desert sectors that are almost completely empty of anything but (allied) DoY bots, nothing else above a level 4 snake. Admittedly, when you get to the Steppes, you run a slight risk of running into a lizard, brute, or Warbot for a short distance, but it's only a slight risk (the last six times I took this route I saw a large hostile mob exactly once), and you see them from a very long way away, and none of them aggro until you get to fairly short range, so they're all easy to walk around.
Yeah, hiking from A_08 to E_07 doesn't run you past any Warbots. No, instead it runs you past at least one swarm of level 30ish dragonflies with infinite range and aggro range, at least one huge mutant camp, and I think at least two huge Anarchy Breed encampments.
So honestly, it's about the same either way, and either way the only dangerous part comes at the very end where you're trying to get around the occasional hoverbot without falling off a cliff and dying of a broken leg.
Voted No.
We have Tech Haven as a central trading place, and the HQ's as trade zones as well. Added to that recently is Miltary Base sector 1. (Which I'm not 100% is a good idea)
There is also the Subways and the Concentre(?), so NC has got way more safe zones than DoY.
NC2's usage of safezone is what NC1 should had been in the first place.
just say NO to the safezone disease!
remove em all.
i want them back myself. i think restoring some of what neocron used to be like would involve making them safe again. Tech haven as a place for trade really sucks. I hate tech haven (was right for the angels though).
remember plaza1/2 a place of trade? think of that and citycenter as commerce locations. not only would be great for new players (they see people around, theres people nearby for tradeskillers and what not) but also for old. some of the things that keep me playing is the ambiance of for instance the plaza especially. now walking around plaza is walking around a zone of 99% allied/neutral ganking, 1% sync whoring anticity "raids" (usually the same people).
i think the game would benefit from, angels recapturing Tech haven (as a second base ala canyon) and the same for TS (..BD..) regaining control of Pepper Park (1,2,3). bring back the old times of pepper fights. dont make (some of) the best zones in the game ONLY good for killing allies....
And this isn't America, it's Neocron... capital punishment is the most used form of discipline.never been to texas then i guess?
p2 and only p2, i miss sitting in p2 back in pluto and tlaking to peeps
TH is the tradeskill HQ. If your char isn't strong enough to get to TH, then you shouldn't be hawking your skills to others. I don't see any reason to convert NC or DoY's main city zones into safezones.
If you want a "better" environment for tradeskilling, push for a TH makeover.
i still stick to the idea that, why should truly some of the best designed maps in the game be condemned to being entirely dedicicated to allied killing idiots ?
and most of the people here disagreeing with that are a known member of the "group". and no i dont hold anything against however people want to play, in fact the way things are right now (plaza raids sucking, pepper park shitty/dull, no where to go to find any sort of fights unless you have 6 ppus per fighter) being a CM and running freely in all 3 cities sounds like the most entertaining choice you could have right now.. i dont think theres anything wrong with playing that way but the game just encourages it now, and practically makes you if you dont want to spend 99% of your time online searching for someone to fight rather then fighting.
There is also the SubwaysSubways aren't safezones. That was taken out in 130, 131, or 132.
why should truly some of the best designed maps in the game A well designed map doesn't have characters "dissappearing" because they went up a gravlift. Right now PL1 is unacceptable as a tradeskill zone for that reason alone.
I would like to see TH Sector 2 enhanced somewhat. I'd like a large, open level up above the existing Administrators level. I'd like a couple GRs, a few GGs, and some open spaces such that we're not all crammed up against the GRs and benches like we are now. I'd also like to see all those cubes set up in the lower level removed. :-/
Its safe as hell in plaza 1 and 2 if theres a problem with allied pking then leave that shit hole. The dome is not perfect its not clean its hard to find your way around at first but at least no one in the same faction is going to murder you. The dome is not even deserted anymore I have seen alot of new faces which is great more trade for you and easy work making the noobs there weapons.
So many old players whining about this game but I don't think KK gives a toss why ? because the new people starting this game are quite happy with it and I spoke to one today they said there liking it so far.
Subways aren't safezones. That was taken out in 130, 131, or 132.A well designed map doesn't have characters "dissappearing" because they went up a gravlift. Right now PL1 is unacceptable as a tradeskill zone for that reason alone.
I would like to see TH Sector 2 enhanced somewhat. I'd like a large, open level up above the existing Administrators level. I'd like a couple GRs, a few GGs, and some open spaces such that we're not all crammed up against the GRs and benches like we are now. I'd also like to see all those cubes set up in the lower level removed. :-/
the lift bug isnt that common even.. it doesnt happen to be very often, hardly a reason to not use it as a place of commerce. the likelyness of them modifiying the TH map at all is so tiny that its barley worth suggesting, however it could be a viable solution although one that still sticks everyone in an ugly zone.
Its safe as hell in plaza 1 and 2 if theres a problem with allied pking then leave that shit hole. The dome is not perfect its not clean its hard to find your way around at first but at least no one in the same faction is going to murder you. The dome is not even deserted anymore I have seen alot of new faces which is great more trade for you and easy work making the noobs there weapons.
So many old players whining about this game but I don't think KK gives a toss why ? because the new people starting this game are quite happy with it and I spoke to one today they said there liking it so far.
its just a cycle of new players.. 1/100 new players stays past reaching /20. a large amount leave well before then id say. I have helped so many players start and explained so much to them to have them leave the next day. i dont even bothor anymore, whatever i give them/help them learn/do their account will be canceled 2 days later so it doesnt matter. screw new players. we cant make new players stay, KK needs to. we at least try..
Dr Strange
18-05-05, 08:18
I'm all for more safezones
Does that make me a carebear or not really suited for the pvp aspect of this game? Yes and No.
On one hand, I don't consider flat out ganking of a tradeskiller whom has no skills or weapons to fight back with, a form of Player vs Player combat. It's more like Player vs Guy Standing There or Trying to Run Away combat
People quote the typical "keep your LE in" "stay in a safezone". Well if I want to be clanned on my tradeskiller(s) I gotta remove the LE (yes clanned tradeskillers have it better, more room to work with, and the pool of clan resources for tradeskilling). Staying in a safezone isn't always an option. Sometimes I need to run back to my apartment to grab a tool or more blue prints, since I don't often keep alot of cash on my tradeskillers. Considering I'm all Anti City and Anti City as proven is easier to kill inside of, once you have a genrep tagged inside (Doy has 1/5th the amount of guards the NC has...our main defense is in the desert).
If I want PvP I'm usually going to go looking for it. Now this doesn't always mean I hate "PvP" (very much in quotations there) when someone randomly kills me while hunting, alot of times I'll just get pokes or a rez and go after'em and return the favor ;p
I tell you what is needed and thats less gaurds or removing the stupid stun from copbot weapons. Parra is the worst pos in this game totaly unbalances PVP
I agree that stun effect on guards are really annoying, but look at it from this angle..
I managed to get an 0/2 runner from DoY to th via a car someone drove me.
I walked from TH to nc, through several OutZone sectors, and hid behind pillars and walls from the guards in Pepper Park, until I reached 2 problems.
1: I could either go into the subway jump into a subway hovercab.
Problem: There were so many guards and copbots at each station that the second i jumped out the hovercab I got insta-killed
2: I could go into Plaza 3 from Pepper Park 1.
Problem: There is a "hallway"/"alley" you have to reach the end off, there are 3 copbots that shoot on sight, and 4 or 5 guards that shoot after 2 seconds, all with stun.
So in a way an 0/2 runner can infiltrate neocron. but would be unable to freely roam the inner core of the city on his own (and its hard / (taking a lot of resurrections) even with a ppu).
And no, sectors were changed, no reason going back, as said before by someone else, there is everything you need in the HQs which already are safezones, and TH is a safezone too.
If you worry that much about getting ganked on your Trader-Char then keep him out of the clan, you can still work with a clan, even though you arent in it you know... and then keep the LE in your head, not in your apartment.
The apartment can survive on itīs own.
Jesterthegreat
18-05-05, 11:52
I'm all for more safezones
Does that make me a carebear or not really suited for the pvp aspect of this game? Yes and No.
On one hand, I don't consider flat out ganking of a tradeskiller whom has no skills or weapons to fight back with, a form of Player vs Player combat. It's more like Player vs Guy Standing There or Trying to Run Away combat
People quote the typical "keep your LE in" "stay in a safezone". Well if I want to be clanned on my tradeskiller(s) I gotta remove the LE (yes clanned tradeskillers have it better, more room to work with, and the pool of clan resources for tradeskilling). Staying in a safezone isn't always an option. Sometimes I need to run back to my apartment to grab a tool or more blue prints, since I don't often keep alot of cash on my tradeskillers. Considering I'm all Anti City and Anti City as proven is easier to kill inside of, once you have a genrep tagged inside (Doy has 1/5th the amount of guards the NC has...our main defense is in the desert).
If I want PvP I'm usually going to go looking for it. Now this doesn't always mean I hate "PvP" (very much in quotations there) when someone randomly kills me while hunting, alot of times I'll just get pokes or a rez and go after'em and return the favor ;p
so you made a choice. you removed your LE knowing the consiquences. if you didnt know them, thats kk's fault for not making such a gameplay changing implant not obvious enough.
you dont need to be in a clan, you could have used your buddy list... you could have used ventrillo... but no. you chose to remove your LE.
besides... with things like reqless stealths, tradeskilling has never been so safe.
TH and HQ's are safezones. Remove safezone from MB and make CM HQ safezone. No need for more safezones. If you want to be safe everywhere: keep your LE in. Period!
Jesterthegreat
18-05-05, 11:58
TH and HQ's are safezones. Remove safezone from MB and make CM HQ safezone. No need for more safezones. If you want to be safe everywhere: keep your LE in. Period!
exactly!
except cm hq... we are mercs, we live for combat... we dont want a safe zone :p
Vae Victis
18-05-05, 13:11
exactly!
except cm hq... we are mercs, we live for combat... we dont want a safe zone :pamen brotha
I'm crahn, i dont want any safezones at all, anywhere.
and I am blackdragon I don't need to have hired gaurds around the dome I'd much prefer to kill my enemys my self ..
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