View Full Version : My one issue with the grafics
Asurmen Spec Op
10-02-05, 01:43
Dear KK, heres me just getting something off my mind.
Now first off, I acually like the models new stuff etc.
However the problem is that they just dont fit with the background, Im sure you guys are working on it but for example, stand next to a launcher and it looks like two diferent games are being compared. I belive that if KK gets some more time it would really help to update mobs and ground.
The new Buggy thing is cool as hell, but it looks like it was superimposed to the screen, it just doesnt fit.
Now KK im sure your well busy right now, but just an acknoledgement would be be great
KKeeper of teh faith
Asurmen
:P
I can understand the work and time pressure of KK, but there certinly haven't been ANY notions what-so-ever that there will be any sort of rework on NC1 NPCs and mobs.
the art dept are hitting us with great eye candy, but just changing the model of the cryton like NPC, would mean a change the looks of atleast 300 NPCs scattered from crytons, dre, tt, next... wastes... doy....... that would certinly be a noticable change in this game, and would be easier than the quad skin\model, which does look great... but won't be driven by more than 30 people on the terra server because vehicles are a nerf to any serious player.
Asurmen Spec Op
10-02-05, 05:58
I can understand the work and time pressure of KK, but there certinly haven't been ANY notions what-so-ever that there will be any sort of rework on NC1 NPCs and mobs.
the art dept are hitting us with great eye candy, but just changing the model of the cryton like NPC, would mean a change the looks of atleast 300 NPCs scattered from crytons, dre, tt, next... wastes... doy....... that would certinly be a noticable change in this game, and would be easier than the quad skin\model, which does look great... but won't be driven by more than 30 people on the terra server because vehicles are a nerf to any serious player. well maybe not just the mobs first, I dont care about the mobs as I do the textures, if you look at the quad SS it looks like it was photoshoped in there its alot nicer then the background it sits on
I actually prefered the olf nc1 models to the newer nc2 ones, maybe they just seemed to fit into the game alot better then the new ones do. The thing about the upgrade from nc1 -> nc2, is that they seem to only have "upgraded" half the models, the player ones mainly and some new city textures. This can seen gping from plaza 1 -> ca hq, plaza 4 -> viarosso 1.
Once again, bring back the old models and spell animations... and the way people hold/fire their guns :D Like say the laser/raygun/plasma rifles look out of place to me now :rolleyes:
I sort of understand what this is getting at.
I'm quite dissapointed in the fact that 'better' graphics haven't improved the game at all...and alot of people hate em conpared to NC1.
The graphics are even a gameplay issue now due to the spell casting amination 'needs' to finish before casting again if it fizzles etc.
I don't like the new models they lack what the NC1 models had, detail and some sort of uniqueness.
I could also go into the RPOS as well...which ages ago we discussed and were getting the old one back as a choice? That seems to have been brushed under the carpet.
No doubt the international release will be quoted as a reason why...but thats fine we ain't paying for all these features are we? Oh wait we are...I dread to work out the percents of features we actaully got when we upgraded against the promised features.
Well, new textures wouldn't be too much of a problem timewise - The only thing that'd take time is to download large amounts. But IMO it'd be better to sort out bugs before adding new content.
I dont understand why KK doesnt involve the community in certain stuff like
this, i mean, it's free of charge, people will be more then happy to contribute
and show off etc and it would help the KK - community relationship aswell.
I mean, ok, not everybody is a photoshop expert, but there are plenty of
talented people on these forums that would be more then happy to lend
a hand.
The Art Dept could hold contests for this, and the winners could get something
ingame, nothing big like free MC5s for life, but just a small token of appretiation(sp?)
that people can show off with.
Pride and Ego. They don't seem to want to admit that a lot of the visual changes made for Neocron 2 were poor, and took the game backwards. The RPOS and character models are just atrocious, not to mention the fact that the game is bugged and everyone is bald or doy boy headed.
This is just one of the hundreds of things wrong with the game. The things right with the game keep us playing, but for how much longer? We will soon be approaching 2 months of complete inactivity from KK (Plan file Holger?), and WoW is one week from launch in Europe...
Original monk
10-02-05, 15:54
ingame, nothing big like free MC5s for life, but just a small token of appretiation(sp?)
that people can show off with.
free mc5's for life ? go get yourself a droner, they seem to like mc5 lately :lol: otherwise yust buy one ... prices gone shit since droners made it there new spot .. nah, i know what you mean, an item like a medal or sumthing special like a red or blue flashlight orso :) maybe somekind of title behind the rank, like the palladin would supposed to be :)
but ontopic, youre right retron, people here could contribute a great deal to the game, as an example the neocronlauncher pro of bramtops and he's bro ... and shujin's tons of skins yust to name 2 .. (daamn i want my old croshair back lol)
but the same tools and knowledge used in improving the graphics can be used by not so clean people o_O to alter the game in the way they like emselve most ... yes cheaters, hackers and exploiters ... a videogame's worst nightmare ..
not that ya didnt know all this but still :/ the small group of corrupt people spoils it for the big group of honest people ... like usual ...
im a graphical person myself, i loved reading the gfx forum ... but i can understand why they shut it down :/
but the same tools and knowledge used in improving the graphics can be used by not so clean people o_O to alter the game in the way they like emselve most ... yes cheaters, hackers and exploiters ... a videogame's worst nightmare ..
Yeah i know what you mean, but they dont need to give out those kind of tools,
for example, lets say neocron has a \skin\ directory, now, the original files are
located somewhere else, but in this skin dir you can put custom skins.
When NC is loading, it loads up all the default skins, but it then does a check to
see if there is a replacement skin in the \skin\ directory.
KK could also control this by only allowing certain skins to be changed, for
example, when they patch something, they include this feature in, and
only allow people to change the Agressor Cpt. skin, no other non-default skin
is loaded, NC only checks for a replacement skin for the aggie.
In the same time the Art Dept. announces a contest for skinning a new Aggie
Cpt. and gives the correct filename to be used aswell as the original skin, so
ppl dont have to dig around loads of files.
This way, those that want to would be able to test their skins ingame, and not
be able to change anything KK doesnt want them to change, without cheating
wich is probably possible anyway.
I hope you understand what I mean. To sum it up, KK could control what skins
can be altered, and give the community the opportinity (sp?) to design skins
or any other sort of textures ingame.
Once the winners have been announced, and KK feels the skin is good enough,
they implement it ingame and remove the option to alter the Aggie Cpt. skin,
and do another contest.
Original monk
10-02-05, 16:41
sounds like a very nice idea yeah but the initial goal of making the skins was to make it lots easier for KK if the community took over/participate in some work ... the idea youre telling here brings up some nice extra work for KK i guess, dunno im not a programmer :)
think practically it would stay the same cause we have a very simpleminded community hehe, for example: when kk says: yes you can alter these skins (f.e.: the aggyskins they provided) then the community only reads: "yes you can alter NC2" with all consequences :) then its alot easier to yust make anything GFX/NCrelated illegal to alter ...
still the problem stays the same ... the few rotten apples spoiling it for the rest ...
atleast the rules are clear now :) no changing files whatsoever ... wich i can understand cause its mainly an mmorpg and no fps ... but then they miss out on all the wonderfull things a community can create :/
like for example counterstrike, BFV, DoW, etc etc with there custom mods, maps, models etc etc etc
I dont understand why KK doesnt involve the community in certain stuff like
this, i mean, it's free of charge, people will be more then happy to contribute
and show off etc and it would help the KK - community relationship aswell.
I mean, ok, not everybody is a photoshop expert, but there are plenty of
talented people on these forums that would be more then happy to lend
a hand.
The Art Dept could hold contests for this, and the winners could get something
ingame, nothing big like free MC5s for life, but just a small token of appretiation(sp?)
that people can show off with.
I could have sworn that i suggested the same sort of idea only last week in a thread entitled Community initiative for game improvements [No:1] (http://forum.neocron.com/showthread.php?t=122422) but the response wasent official, basicaly the forum community said that KK would never do it and their was no response from KK themselfs (meaning that the reply to my thread had answerd the question).
sounds like a very nice idea yeah but the initial goal of making the skins was to make it lots easier for KK if the community took over/participate in some work ... the idea youre telling here brings up some nice extra work for KK i guess, dunno im not a programmer :)
think practically it would stay the same cause we have a very simpleminded community hehe, for example: when kk says: yes you can alter these skins (f.e.: the aggyskins they provided) then the community only reads: "yes you can alter NC2" with all consequences :) then its alot easier to yust make anything GFX/NCrelated illegal to alter ...
still the problem stays the same ... the few rotten apples spoiling it for the rest ...
atleast the rules are clear now :) no changing files whatsoever ... wich i can understand cause its mainly an mmorpg and no fps ... but then they miss out on all the wonderfull things a community can create :/
like for example counterstrike, BFV, DoW, etc etc with there custom mods, maps, models etc etc etc
Yes, but it's not like that atm. I mean, you are allowed to alter neocron.ini
for example, that still doesnt invite you to alter any other file(s).
I mean, it wouldnt be altering really, since the default files would still be there,
untouched, it would just look for a replacement file (a new file) to load up,
and only that certail file.
I mean, if your into altering files, you can do it allready, and if your stupid
enough to do it if they said you can make a new skin for an aggie, then you
damn well deserve to get caught and banned.
@boneybob: sry dude, didnt mean to steal your idea, must have missed that
thread.
Dribble Joy
10-02-05, 22:36
Pride and Ego. They don't seem to want to admit that a lot of the visual changes made for Neocron 2 were poor, and took the game backwards. The RPOS and character models are just atrocious
Matter of opinion frankly.
I much much mcuh prefer the current RPOS over the old one. NC1 RPOS was boxy, boring and dull, AND I find the new one easier to use.
The NC (the city) textures are higher res and (again in an opinion) grittier, and give a better feel for the city. They said that Via wasn't finished though.
I like DoY, it feels like a real city in many ways, with actual buildings, rather than doors coming off a few streets.
The character models (imo) are in improvement over the old ones, and not just res/poly-count. The old ones had one model for the entire body, now we have individual body, legs, head, hair and presumably accessories.
The face textures do look a bit too cheers full, but otherwise the rest looks better than the old ones.
But again, it's preferance.
Well, new textures wouldn't be too much of a problem timewise - The only thing that'd take time is to download large amounts. But IMO it'd be better to sort out bugs before adding new content.thats not exactly correct Dominus, KK has managed to, in the past, slip us many models with new textures, and we certinly didn't notice a thing.
Matter of opinion frankly.
I much much mcuh prefer the current RPOS over the old one. NC1 RPOS was boxy, boring and dull, AND I find the new one easier to use.
The NC (the city) textures are higher res and (again in an opinion) grittier, and give a better feel for the city. They said that Via wasn't finished though.
I like DoY, it feels like a real city in many ways, with actual buildings, rather than doors coming off a few streets.
The character models (imo) are in improvement over the old ones, and not just res/poly-count. The old ones had one model for the entire body, now we have individual body, legs, head, hair and presumably accessories.
The face textures do look a bit too cheers full, but otherwise the rest looks better than the old ones.
But again, it's preferance.
no the problem is in people like Selendor, which said NC1 graphics were crap, the models aswell. when someone put effort into making it better, they go "the ones before were better, the new ones are shit." the day he says something constructive, or atleast show a sign of appreciation twoards KK, I'll spam it on trade.
@retr0n:
I think not having replacements would be a better idea. because of only 1 reason. you never had the original files, I mean you did but they were compressed. someone working on a new model\skin would forever loose the original, unless he made a backup of the pack file. that, imo, would be really useless. I mean, how many modifications, not for NC but in general, have you downloaded and NOT liked? this would be an irreversible process, and thats why I think it would be best to leave it as it is. also, I don't think it would be easy recomposing a compressed file, it would be time and memory consuming. It's best left as it is. also, the checksum of the files would change. thats not a big problem if it's KK supported, but if you replaced something with a custom, non KK supported thingie, you'd get a checksum missmatch.
@retr0n:
I think not having replacements would be a better idea. because of only 1 reason. you never had the original files, I mean you did but they were compressed. someone working on a new model\skin would forever loose the original, unless he made a backup of the pack file. that, imo, would be really useless. I mean, how many modifications, not for NC but in general, have you downloaded and NOT liked? this would be an irreversible process, and thats why I think it would be best to leave it as it is. also, I don't think it would be easy recomposing a compressed file, it would be time and memory consuming. It's best left as it is. also, the checksum of the files would change. thats not a big problem if it's KK supported, but if you replaced something with a custom, non KK supported thingie, you'd get a checksum missmatch.
I think your misunderstanding me. I'll explain further.
Imagine you NC directory as it is now... Ok, now add a new dir in the root of
it calles \skins\ or whatever else.
Now KK puts it in the code of NC to look for a new skin of an aggie cpt in the
\skins\ dir, and that filename is agressor_cpt.bmp.
At the same time they release the patch, Art Dept. announces a contest,
design a new aggie cpt. and they give you the original skin, or put it up
for download.
Then you get to either modify the original skin, or simply create a new one.
When your done and you want to try it out, you simply put the skin in the
\skins\ dir and name it agressor_cpt.bmp. Now when NC is launched, all the
default skins are preloaded, but then it does a check and sees that you have
a new skin for an aggie, so it loads up that one.
All other files (besides agressor_cpt.bmp) are ignored, so ppl cannot change
what they want, KK controls this.
When the contest is over, and KK approves of the new skin, they implement it
as the default one, and remove the skin check for aggie cpt.
Rince repeat with other skins.
You dont actually have to look through .pak files, and if your skin was to
look like crap and you want the old one, you just delete the file aggressor_cpt.bmp
in your \skins\ dir.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.