View Full Version : Getting to 4th layer of op?
I tell you, I've been asking loads of people, I've searched the entire forums, and yet still no one can give me the definitive answer. Someone PLEASE help me out with these two things:
- After the 3rd layer is hacked at an op, how do you get into the op's Hacknet area to tag the 4th layer? People tell me any hacker from the clan can get straight there but when I hack the hackterminal nothing happens. Equally, when I go to the genrep for the op and hack that, it send me back to my faction home. Is this all a myth, do you always have to run the whole way in hacknet?
- As a PPU is it worth carrying defensive software into hacknet, is it enough to survive the 4th layer tag run without being a spy with really high specific hacknet skills?
If anyone can help me I'd be really thankful, there is no damn manual for this kind of thing :mad:
the last hacker or hacknet spy just has to go to the OP in hacknet and rightclick the pedastool that represents a hackterm and the op is yours. And if you have a hack of 100 or higher you can easily traverse hacknet and survive to get to the OP in hacknet. But id watch out for the Uplink mobs they may be 30/30 but they hurt as if they were 120/120 (think they are bugged still) so just spam heal software on urself and make sure your shields are up.
Dribble Joy
24-01-05, 23:10
Wha he means is, someone has to sit by the HN terminal throught the hacking process. This adds an aspect of the game where you will need to defend in HN as well as the real world.
Wha he means is, someone has to sit by the HN terminal throught the hacking process. This adds an aspect of the game where you will need to defend in HN as well as the real world.
Well, at current I think its more a case of how long can you last whilst stuck in sync, which isn't too bad if the enemy hacker is at the other side of the map, but when they have 2+ hackers its not quite as easy as it looks.
I remember fighting FF for ages in PAIN at Cycrow, and on the occaisions that we won, we'd spend and equal time sending hackers into HN to get the last layer as both sides had spent fighting in total. I think eventually it came down to everyone who could get into HN did, and everyone ran to the lecturn thingy to tag it before Volvo killed us all :lol:
Probably didn't help that by the time we got through the zoning and syncing, he was already in front/behind us.
Wha he means is, someone has to sit by the HN terminal throught the hacking process. This adds an aspect of the game where you will need to defend in HN as well as the real world.
yeah thats what i said :lol:
Wha he means is, someone has to sit by the HN terminal throught the hacking process. This adds an aspect of the game where you will need to defend in HN as well as the real world.
What it also means is that one pure hacker can fight off a whole army by just camping the ops hacknet zoneline. :(
KK really gotta sort this shit out.
Dribble Joy
25-01-05, 00:34
Surely a pure hacker(s) vs a pure hacker(s) fight is what is intended?
Perhaps hackers should randomly spawn in OP HN zones?
Surely a pure hacker(s) vs a pure hacker(s) fight is what is intended?
Perhaps hackers should randomly spawn in OP HN zones?
Perhaps a pure hacker should be able to take a few more hits then 3-4 at 105 ROF then hacknet fights might be remotely enjoyable instead of who long synchs first or who gets to shoot who in the back first...
I have a pure hacknet spy and what really pissed me off and turned me off to the OP and hacknet thing was when I was in hacknet camping the OP podeum thing and some guy came in and through me attacking the crap out of him he just spammed heal on himself and crawled past me and right clicked the OP.....then died, after he took the last layer.
IMO i think there needs to be some kind of skill involved other than right clicking the last layer if KK wants the last layer to be hacknet. B/C a non hacknet character that can use a 0.3 heal and sheild can just walk up in there and right click the stupid thing. 8|
From what I've gathered, the 3rd and 4th layer have to be of the same clan, any of the previous 3 hackers can do the 4th layer but, they can't hack the hack terminal to get into hacknet, they'll have to go the long way =/
From what I've gathered, the 3rd and 4th layer have to be of the same clan, any of the previous 3 hackers can do the 4th layer but, they can't hack the hack terminal to get into hacknet, they'll have to go the long way =/
Correct, however the hacknet layer is sort of on the dumb side as anyone with at least 100 hack can use v0.3 heal and sheild software which is good enough to get them where they need to go in HN to take an OP since you have to just right click the last layer and the thing is right near the entrance portal.
Perhaps a pure hacker should be able to take a few more hits then 3-4 at 105 ROF then hacknet fights might be remotely enjoyable instead of who long synchs first or who gets to shoot who in the back first...
Hehe, if you only can take 3-4 hits, then you should change your occupation. Havnt really tested, but I can prolly take 5-6 hits with capped 0.3 attack. But then you have heals running and you are also moving around so its not nearly this bad. 10 hits wouldnt be that hard if the other guy didnt hit every shot. But on the other hand, my enemies never survive long enough to hit me 10 times.
I have a pure hacknet spy and what really pissed me off and turned me off to the OP and hacknet thing was when I was in hacknet camping the OP podeum thing and some guy came in and through me attacking the crap out of him he just spammed heal on himself and crawled past me and right clicked the OP.....then died, after he took the last layer.
IMO i think there needs to be some kind of skill involved other than right clicking the last layer if KK wants the last layer to be hacknet. B/C a non hacknet character that can use a 0.3 heal and sheild can just walk up in there and right click the stupid thing. 8|
Spammed heal? Well, you cast heal and then its there for 15 secs no matter how much you spam. I never have this problem coz noone can survive long enough to get past me (if they are alone). Btw, I hope youre not standing inside the OP? You need to stand in the uplink since KK did the really "smart" move of putting the terminal just inside and made it require just a click instead of a real hack.
I remember fighting FF for ages in PAIN at Cycrow, and on the occaisions that we won, we'd spend and equal time sending hackers into HN to get the last layer as both sides had spent fighting in total. I think eventually it came down to everyone who could get into HN did, and everyone ran to the lecturn thingy to tag it before Volvo killed us all :lol:
Probably didn't help that by the time we got through the zoning and syncing, he was already in front/behind us.
Wanna hear something fun? You'd never get any OPs today due to the runspeed nerf. Finally you dont teleport around on the screen all the time. ;) But it was kinda good anyways since I learned some hacknet tactics during the fights against you guys. :D
Orion']Hehe, if you only can take 3-4 hits, then you should change your occupation. Havnt really tested, but I can prolly take 5-6 hits with capped 0.3 attack. But then you have heals running and you are also moving around so its not nearly this bad. 10 hits wouldnt be that hard if the other guy didnt hit every shot. But on the other hand, my enemies never survive long enough to hit me 10 times.
Spammed heal? Well, you cast heal and then its there for 15 secs no matter how much you spam. I never have this problem coz noone can survive long enough to get past me (if they are alone). Btw, I hope youre not standing inside the OP? You need to stand in the uplink since KK did the really "smart" move of putting the terminal just inside and made it require just a click instead of a real hack.
yes i know all this and yes the dude was spamming heal as in crawling really slow and constantly clicking heal as i was laying into him. He died as he clicked the terminal hence him getting the op and yes i chased the dude from the uplink and into the hacknet OP.
Orion']Hehe, if you only can take 3-4 hits, then you should change your occupation. Havnt really tested, but I can prolly take 5-6 hits with capped 0.3 attack. But then you have heals running and you are also moving around so its not nearly this bad. 10 hits wouldnt be that hard if the other guy didnt hit every shot. But on the other hand, my enemies never survive long enough to hit me 10 times.
Spammed heal? Well, you cast heal and then its there for 15 secs no matter how much you spam. I never have this problem coz noone can survive long enough to get past me (if they are alone). Btw, I hope youre not standing inside the OP? You need to stand in the uplink since KK did the really "smart" move of putting the terminal just inside and made it require just a click instead of a real hack.
With a heal running yea i can take more hits, but after zoning, if ur there 9/10 times im dead before im outta black screen... If not then i get to see myself die while im yoyo'ing and cant cast anything -_-
Bugs Gunny
25-01-05, 10:41
Tomorrow i'll participate in my first op war on my hacknet hacker. (if there are any going on lol).
Just 12 more lom pils to take (i forgot you need runspeed in hacknet, and you cant be both droner and hacknet hacker)
Freaky Fryd
25-01-05, 11:22
It's absolutely silly that it only takes one person to prevent an OP from being taken.
Hmm, well thanks for you responses, but I don't think anyone has actually answered my first question. This is also what happened when I asked people in-game :mad: I'll try again:
Is there any way to get DIRECTLY to the Outpost zone of the Hacknet when you are taking an Op, without having to run all the way from your Faction DNS?
If so:
- Who can do it?
- Is there a time limit?
- Can more than one person do it?
- Can the defending clan do it too?
This one issue is driving me completely loopy, because I still can't find anyone that has the definitive answer! There are definite hints around the forum that you can hack directly in for the 4th layer, but I've tried it and it didn't work :mad: Argh etc :lol:
So, someone from FF has kindly pm'ed me this info:
--------------------
3 People Hack the Hackterm for Layer 1+2+3
One of these 3 People hacks the Hackterm AGAIN after the 3rd layer ... this gets him into Hacknet directly in the Op ... then you have to run all the way up to the thingy you have to click (You spawn where the Logout-GR is ...)
So theres 2 ways ... Hack 1+2+3, get into Op-Hacknet and maybe fight a enemy Hacker inside the Op-Hacknet ...
Or send a Hacker tru Hacknet that just comes from the uplink to tag the thingy ... (Advisable if the Uplink is friendly to you)
---------------------
Does everyone else agree with this? Are there any limitations to this rule, ie does it have to be one of the previous 3 hackers? Do you all have to be in the clan?
Bugs Gunny
25-01-05, 12:00
One time i was on my hc pe at cycrow and i went in to hack a layer during the fight. Turns out it was thid layer and .... after the hack completed i synched into the op's hacknet thingy.
Volvo was waiting for me, and a hc pe with no software is a sitting duck i tell ya :-)
So my guess is once you hack third, you automaticaly warp into hacknet.
You can however have attackers in place beforehand.
yes i know all this and yes the dude was spamming heal as in crawling really slow and constantly clicking heal as i was laying into him. He died as he clicked the terminal hence him getting the op and yes i chased the dude from the uplink and into the hacknet OP.
Then I'd suggest you exp some more so you can kill them before they can go there.
Freaky Fryd
25-01-05, 12:02
Same thing happened to me tonight Bugs...
I was told the team at the OP needed a hacker, so I showed up. Next thing I know, I'm synching...then I appear dead in hacknet...my only thought was "WTF?!"
It's absolutely silly that it only takes one person to prevent an OP from being taken.
Is it? Think about it for a moment. Hacknet is something completely different than outside. In here you are similar to a 0/10 outside hacknet. Im willing to bet that you can protect something against an army of 0/10s outside hacknet. Theres no way I could protect against a couple of decently highlvl in hacknet, just like you can outside.
This is gonna sound silly but: "Dont send a child to do a mans job"
Bugs Gunny
25-01-05, 12:08
Hehehe, well, that volvo guy will be waiting for you on the central platform, facing the logout point. Once he sees you synch in, with low health and no hackpool btw, you will drop before even seeing hacknet.
There is a way to go in fully buffed and with a heal running, so he won't drop you in two shots.
I suggest next time pro city goes for an op, the clans have their hacknet hackers meet beforehand, to travel to the location and take the anti city hacker out as they enter the zone.
Bugs. I never stand still in one place all the time. That would be stupid. But I must say you are on the right track now. Instead of just complaining like most others are, you are thinking of ways to handle it. Good.
Freaky. Yes, that was me.. Felt good. There you go for stealthhiding beside the npcs in FA sector, forcing my hybrid to go red SL to kill you... ;)
Freaky Fryd
25-01-05, 12:35
Apparently my point was entirely missed.
OP fights should go back go needing a greater skills/numbers combo to win AND protect an OP...not be where it's at where only one person is needed to keep the OP.
EDIT: And to clarify my "WTF" post, it was just like Bugs where it was completely unexpected. I'd never been in that position before, and didn't expect to be warped somewhere. I wouldn't have even hacked, if I had of known I was going to be warped into hacknet.
Apparently my point was entirely missed.
OP fights should go back go needing a greater skills/numbers combo to win AND protect an OP...not be where it's at where only one person is needed to keep the OP.
EDIT: And to clarify my "WTF" post, it was just like Bugs where it was completely unexpected. I'd never been in that position before, and didn't expect to be warped somewhere. I wouldn't have even hacked, if I had of known I was going to be warped into hacknet.Yes, as it is now, one (pure) hacker is usually just used to prevent the attacking clan from taking over the op, completely avoiding a "real" fight cause they might loose/dont have the numbers or he just delays the final hacking so the defenders got time to get more than enough people ready to fight. o_O
At least thats how i`ve seen it happen so far. No fights in hacknet, its just a fucking pain in the ass shit idea KK never really thought about the consequences.
At least thats how i`ve seen it happen so far. No fights in hacknet, its just a fucking pain in the ass shit idea KK never really thought about the consequences.
Ive been in loads of fights in hacknet. Even nice and fun ones. Its really simple, when a highlvl hacker protects, what do you do? Keep sending people that cant even use software inside? No, you send another highlvl hacker there. And then it ends up with a nice and fun fight in hacknet.
Orion']Ive been in loads of fights in hacknet. Even nice and fun ones. Its really simple, when a highlvl hacker protects, what do you do? Keep sending people that cant even use software inside? No, you send another highlvl hacker there. And then it ends up with a nice and fun fight in hacknet.
A nice 1 vs 1 fun fight in hacknet thats probably gonna be over in less than 10 seconds. While theres 20 people standing at an op doing absolutely nothing. Funny shit.
Not everyone got a hacker. I got chars that can hack yeah but i`m not gonna lom over to pure hacking just to be able to fight some other guy in hacknet once a while we`re taking an op. No fucking way.
The whole concept is stupid. 4th hack in hacknet should be an option but not the fucking only one.
Tidus_Origin
25-01-05, 15:38
IMO, you should be able to hack the 4th layer both in Hacknet and in the 'real world'.
That way, even if you don't have any hackers that were 'made' for hacknet, you can still hack the 4th layer. To balance it out, you should be able to reset the OP from the Hacknet OP terminal, but only by hacking it (at a difficulty level similar to an OP's 3rd layer)
A nice 1 vs 1 fun fight in hacknet thats probably gonna be over in less than 10 seconds. While theres 20 people standing at an op doing absolutely nothing. Funny shit.
Not everyone got a hacker. I got chars that can hack yeah but i`m not gonna lom over to pure hacking just to be able to fight some other guy in hacknet once a while we`re taking an op. No fucking way.
The whole concept is stupid. 4th hack in hacknet should be an option but not the fucking only one.
Yeah, I bet its really annoying for those 20 people to wait that fully 10 secs.
Of coz not everyone does. Its your own choice. But if noone in clan does, then you better stick to ninjaing. Coz this is how the game works. Just coz you personally dont wanna adapt to something doesnt nessesarily make it stupid.
Like most things in Neocron, I don't think this is going to change any time soon. So we must adapt and learn to win by KK's rules. In fact I've been pm'ed all the good info I needed so I'm happy now. And by our enemies no less. Good form, sirs.
Bugs Gunny
25-01-05, 16:02
Sadly, every clan that wants to op war now needs a "nerd" in it.
This "great honour" was bestowed upon me, and i now have on 99% of the time useless gimp running around :-)
To coin a phrase, clans either 'zerg ops' or 'nerd ops' :lol:
Looks like all us stupid Gen Tanks and Religious Monks need to go to the library and get out some IT books before we become obsolete ;)
Orion']Yeah, I bet its really annoying for those 20 people to wait that fully 10 secs.
Of coz not everyone does. Its your own choice. But if noone in clan does, then you better stick to ninjaing. Coz this is how the game works. Just coz you personally dont wanna adapt to something doesnt nessesarily make it stupid.
No, it`s annoying if no one shows up for the "real" fight cause they can easily defend the op with one or 2 people camping the hacknet zoneline. Thats fucking stupid.
And how do you make a highlevel hacknet char? Cap a spy, then lom over. Great fun. And all that shit for one purpose, absolutely worthless.
I`m not against it, at least not if they change it. (when there finally will be another patch, next month or so :()
KK were like "Ok, hacknet needs content! - OH I KNOW, LETS MAKE IT SO OEN POOR FOOLS HAS TO GET IN THERE TO TAKE OVER THE OP WTIHA STUPID CLICK OF A MOUSEBUTTON!!!1 AND FORGET BALANCE , WELL PATCH THAT NEXT YEAR!"
o_O
Ozambabbaz
25-01-05, 17:46
lol, thx Kid
And how do you make a highlevel hacknet char? Cap a spy, then lom over. Great fun. And all that shit for one purpose, absolutely worthless.
Maybe get into HN and kill some? :P
you lvl super fast there when you are about xx/20
KK were like "Ok, hacknet needs content! - OH I KNOW, LETS MAKE IT SO OEN POOR FOOLS HAS TO GET IN THERE TO TAKE OVER THE OP WTIHA STUPID CLICK OF A MOUSEBUTTON!!!1 AND FORGET BALANCE , WELL PATCH THAT NEXT YEAR!"
o_O
Ah right... so why did KK make it that 3 lonesome fools with some hackskill need to go to the op and do some stupid clicking minigame? and forget balance...
uhm.. oh wait there is attackers coming.. maybe we need more than 4 ppl and maybe those other ppl attacking us do the "balance"
owww... why not bring some "real" hackers and get that hacker that sits inside HN and kills your tank, rifle/pistol spys, monks, pes...
ah right.. i forgot those hackers are boring.. as they only serve one purpose 8|
to fight in hacknet :rolleyes: 8|
This "great honour" was bestowed upon me, and i now have on 99% of the time useless gimp running around :-)
Wait till the Hacknet-Rares come, you will be a wanted (and maybe very rich) person ;)
...must...level...my...hacker...
Orion']I learned some hacknet tactics during the fights against you guys. :D
Does this include the gravilift trick?
I remember a fight at Jeriko where i decided to camp hacknet just to see what went on. Encountering the enemy, i shot him to near death before he zoned out and zone hopped a couple of times. Zoning back into the OP zone, i watched him appear to go down the gravilift (at least on my screen), but as i ran to follow, i got shot from behind. Turns out he was there all along :p Needless to say, i got owned but it was a fun fight while it lasted.
From what I've gathered, the 3rd and 4th layer have to be of the same clan, any of the previous 3 hackers can do the 4th layer
Yeah, i wondered this too. I tried an experiment the last time Jeriko was taken from City Admin by FF. A running account of the battle was being given over alliance and we knew we wouldn't win the fight as we were heavily outnumbered.
For curiosity, i wondered if a 4th person from a different clan could just camp hacknet and click the terminal at the right time. I asked on alliance for an update as soon as the 3rd layer went down. When it did, i clicked on the terminal straight away. I got the message: "Updating outpost security settings" but nothing else happened. Shortly afterwards, a ppu from the attacking clan zoned in from the GR logout point and came up the lifts to click the terminal. Attempting to shoot him before the runspeed nerf was a joke as he seemed to warp all over the zone, shots that should have hit just didn't and after a few seconds of being frozen in front of me, he just disappeared off my screen. Looking down, i just saw the white mist as he zoned out to the GR almost instantly.
I have noticed similar gravilift problems outside hacknet too. People who have just used them appear to stand motionless at the top or bottom of them even though they tell you they're right next to you. Go figure :rolleyes:
grav lifts have been like that for long long time
trigger hurt
26-01-05, 00:46
as fun as hacknet is, it's bugged to shit.
I don't care what runspeed nerf supposedly did, people still warp around. The grav lifts are even worse than the ones outside of hacknet and I get the rubberband bug a lot more often than I do outside.
I gave up with my fulltime hacker almost 3 months ago, I guess. It was pointless. A clan has only to load up the zone with pure hackers and they already have an advantage.
2 hackers on a safe platform at the uplink to the outpost
2 hackers inside the outpost network. 1 at the gr spawn point, 1 at the zoneline spawn point.
if you zone in anywhere near these hackers and they spot you, you are garunteed to be dead before you get out of sync. I've gotten lucky once and killed volvo a few times before he could get to me, only to have someone else waiting just on the other side.
One guy can't hold off 2 more guys. You send in a few from each access point. He can't be in more than one place at once. The problem is that there is nothing beneficial about being a sissy on the outside world while you are only partially a sissy in hacknet, so very few people have full time hackers and those that do, prefer to play their other chars more often.
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