View Full Version : An Idea For Balancing Out PK
This really applies to Pro-City, but I guess DoY has some PKers somewhere.
Ok, so the argument from the PKers is that when they play, and kill, they don't want to give people warnings due to buff's etc, and the Pro-City's are pissed off at the constant kills which arent necessary.
So, seeing as SL is obviously never going to work this is my idea:
The shoot-who-you-want system is changed. Pro-Cities can kill Anti-Cities without warning all they want, provided their LE is out of course. IF a Pro-City for some reason wants to kill another Pro-City, then a CHALLENGE option is usable in a similar way to TRADE with another player.
If a player accepts the CHALLENGE, i.e like accepting a team invitation, then they are "contracted" into a duel with whoever challenged them, and vice versa.
Now, once in this combat system, no outside influence can be used, such as PPU's, thereby levelling the playing field. Buffs may be used, but at the risk of the player using them, as all active buffs will be cancelled once the duel starts, and must be re-activated, once again levelling the playing field.
This method means PKers can go on killing sprees of enemy factions, thereby relieving their boredom etc, and if a genuine grudge is held against a friendly unit, the duel method is used, menaing everyone should be happy, hopefully.
Nice idea, a bit too carebear for me however, we have all been victim of a random PK or two and im sure we have all done it to some unsuspecting player. But its a cruel world out there and this being a cyberpunk MMO I feel that type of system would ruin the feeling of the game.
The city isnt supposed to be safe and just because people are allied there are always going to be disagreements between factions/clans.
I think the current combat system is fine how it is, although there should be a greater penalty in regards to soul light loss for allied pk'ing.
I think AO has a much better system, gas levels which control behaviour. Warzones are 0% so allie can attack allie (usin NC % not AO :p) Anarchy zones could be 50% where you can attack people, but only people outside your own faction, 75% for Controlled zones, where you can only attack hostile factions and finally Safe zones, where you cant even draw a gun. Op wars are still workable, and if TT wants to gank Bio, they can anywhere other than inside NC or DOY, hunting grounds will be 75% so you can still gank enemies.
Latent Entropy
07-01-05, 20:25
The pkers will just whine, cos its "restricting" the "i kill who ever i want" attitudes of players.
The problem is people dont respect each other anymore, and this is especially true in leveling areas, like MB, El farid(spelling), CRP and is now a major problem within city areas. Iv have only EVER meet one person whilst leveling who didnt attack me on sight, and this person was an enemy faction to me, so shame on you so called "allies".
Iv posted similar ideas like this before and no one seems to like it mainly because of the restraint on asking your ally if you want to be pk'd by them.
Well, maybe it could be changed slightly, so if you challenge someone and win, you keep your SL, regardless of friendly status, or you can gank everyone, and have a longer lasting SL deprivation, which cannot be raised by anything other than waiting it out.
2 hrs per kill with an instant -50 SL, and it stays at -50 for the two hours BEFORE it can even be started to be gained back? Put your own suggestions please, mine are probably too drastic.
Latent Entropy has got the point here.
It's not the soullight system that's borked. It's not the game. It's not KK. It's not the distribution of factions / safezones.
It's the people.
Respect for others has been mentioned also. There is no respect on Terra anymore.
The only way out of this hole that we are all digging deeper and deeper for ourselves, is if we could all take our MAIN char to a single slot international server. Pluto didn't have these problems. I'm not saying that ally killing didn't happen, because it did occasionally, but it wasn't as random and retarded as it is now.
People are bored because they have become spoiled. Spoiled for choice with all their wonderful alt characters on the same server. When we had just one character, we looked after that character. We took its stats, soullight and possessions seriously. Not to mention its reputation.
The dreadful realisation comes that, if ever a new server is born, we cannot transfer our existing characters (or the ones from the September 2004 snapshot) to the new utopia. Perhaps it is time to contemplate the future of the servers and their populations. Would the ability to port the same characters again to another server be such a detriment? I would gladly swap some of my good but underused alt characters for just one in a respectable community.
I can never be sure of some miracle solution. What i am sure of though, is that spoiled brats with too many toys get bored easily. The less we have, the more we treasure it.
R.I.P. Pluto
I personally wouldn't mind just starting afresh on a one-slot International server. I've just started out on Mars, and would do the same again, especially if I could understand what people are saying. :)
I'm sort of getting the hang of understanding German, just can't type/speak it yet.
Jesterthegreat
07-01-05, 22:48
too carebear for me however, we have all been victim of a random PK or two and im sure we have all done it to some unsuspecting player. But its a cruel world out there and this being a cyberpunk MMO I feel that type of system would ruin the feeling of the game.
The city isnt supposed to be safe and just because people are allied there are always going to be disagreements between factions/clans.
I think the current combat system is fine how it is, although there should be a greater penalty in regards to soul light loss for allied pk'ing.
100% agree
:edit: @ all above - i respect people i deem worthy of respect.
You only just thought of this? Its the system for dozens of MMORPG's - Takes the whole feel of NC away... freedom.
No offense cuz I'm just saying what I truly think about this post (or be offended as this is how I feel)
Pointless thread, egotistic un-original post. :angel:
You only just thought of this? Its the system for dozens of MMORPG's - Takes the whole feel of NC away... freedom.
No offense cuz I'm just saying what I truly think about this post (or be offended as this is how I feel)
Pointless thread, egotistic un-original post. :angel: It's just an idea. I hadn't seen it anywhere else. I just thought it would help even things out between the two ways of thinking, rather than have them bitching at each other all the time.
Anyways, in the event KK do decide to make an International one-slot server, and it does manage to reduce the Pking, I'll go there forever and stop complaining. Until then, I'll come up with my ridiculous ideas that will never be implemented.
Because if I listened to Pkers and stopped whining, it'd take the whole feel of NC away...freedom
P.S No offence taken.
How about if you are flatlined by a runner of an allied faction, gr'ing out would not incur any synaptic impairment at all, no belt drop if you were in an anarchy zone at the time, and "tentatively" no automatic backpack recovery fee. Death resulting from enemy faction doesn't change.
It seems to me that most complaints about being pk'd by allies comes from the grief and interruption that it causes the victem. SI, belt drop, "was trying to do an epic" , "Hey, I'm a tradeskiller with no weapon at all you allied pk'ing asshole!", ...etc. :(
Maybe something like that would prevent the anguish it causes....?
Someone embellish on that one please?
EDIT: Oh yeah. Area's designated as Hunting zones in game should be be respected more and incur harsh penalties for pk'ing of anykind. It's a mob hunting zone, not a victem hunting zone. And its mostly n00bs in there anyways
Dribble Joy
08-01-05, 03:11
Allied killing does not have any real, palpable effects that affect a runner's life in anyway.
Without it, the situation will either stay as it is or get worse.
We should not have to force people to not shoot first, second, third, forth and speak fith, but as the community has repeatedly shown, we have to in most cases.
Look at the faction relation change from NC1 to NC2.
The faction system in NC1 was rich and dynamic, it was not exclusively one side vs another, the factions all had complex relations with each other.
Yet the community ad shown that it was completely uncapable of operating within it and judgeing who was enemy or not.
So they changed it, simply because of the community.
The above is not (or rather, should not be) a reason to increase the penalties for allied killing, it should have been higher in the first place. The result of the community's immaturaty is proof of that need.
The whole SL system needs to be scrapped and the symp system made far more improtant.
Asurmen Spec Op
08-01-05, 03:26
I would perfer if they are allied double their SL and mines it from yours
if they are nutruel minus their SL
hostile is the same
How about if you are flatlined by a runner of an allied faction, gr'ing out would not incur any synaptic impairment at all, no belt drop if you were in an anarchy zone at the time, and "tentatively" no automatic backpack recovery fee. Death resulting from enemy faction doesn't change.
So the allied killer would be able to return imidiatly to contiue his buisness with no punishment at all :wtf:
I don't think that will work you yust might get more allied killers.
So the allied killer would be able to return imidiatly to contiue his buisness with no punishment at all :wtf:
I don't think that will work you yust might get more allied killers.
Well, its not meant to punish the allied pk'er. Its a suggestion to make it less of an inconvenience to the innocent and the moral who didn't ask to be killed by an ally. Hell, just make sure you have the gr's of the area you get killed in and you can just keep coming back for vengeance, or until they get bored.
the traitors exist from always from both the parts..
if u kill one allied ( sl > +1 ) u obtain negative sl... but is not a prob... just 2,3 mission and sl return positive...
think is just this the real problem... but neocron is not a true rpg... i see it as Multi Massive Online Shotter 3d person O.o
sometimes i and my clan fight against allied or neutral faction, but we agree it.
i hate allied when they kill me or somebody when lvling
N3v3rM0r3
I like the no belt drops from allied kills, unless your SL is low. Keep SL punishment still and any further improvements to that system.
some one has been playing a bit to much swg cause that is how the dueling there works unless u are so crapp profession or something
Nice idea, a bit too carebear for me however, we have all been victim of a random PK or two and im sure we have all done it to some unsuspecting player. But its a cruel world out there and this being a cyberpunk MMO I feel that type of system would ruin the feeling of the game.
The city isnt supposed to be safe and just because people are allied there are always going to be disagreements between factions/clans.
I think the current combat system is fine how it is, although there should be a greater penalty in regards to soul light loss for allied pk'ing.
I totally agree. Dont change the system, just change the penalty for ally pking. Make em go red in one kill. And they shouldnt be abled to run research missions from another char in a fucking safezone to get their SL back. Force em to do em out in the wastelands. Where they can get killed.
/edit
go play SWGDo you actually ever post something that makes sense and/or is not flaming?
hmm... u know i love it :D
and it wasnt a flame..
if u wanna change the PvP system then go play another game.
I know lots of ppl playing neocron cuz no other game has the same PvP mechanics as neocron (dunno bout WoW tho but im not gonna try that game)
on and the go play swg thing... it made sense... the system the threadstarter wants is almost the same as swg. or it has swg elements in it.
Well I was unaware of that when I started this thread. But damned If I'm gonna spend money on "Everquest in space with wookies". Heck, its not even a similar way of fighting in SWG is it?
1. make faction guards reactions are based on the faction sympathy - if it is negative (even at -1) than they should KOS the person, if its his/hers own faction he should get kicked out of it.
Make them also - as copbots - able to KOS red SL runners.
- place faction guards inside NC in the appropriate zones (next for P4, DRE for p3 etc, tangent and proto for via2 etc), not only in HQ. Swap those guards with the CAs who should be around plaza 1-2 only (pepper park also?).
- make more patrolling units around NC
- make guards/copbots actually do something more than 10 dmg to an self buffed player... :rolleyes:
2. Bind the missions with the person so no other person could use the mission bp. Or something like that, not sure how it would work really, but its a serious exploit and it needs fixing. Nowadays you can just get from -32 sl to 0 in few mins by doing tl 150 ress/cst missions.
Those are 2 major issues/exploits i can see here. One is easy replacable SL, the second is lack of any repercussions for having bad faction sympathy.
With faction guards and copbots killing red SL's it would be harder to escape to faction hqs. With faction guards kosing the runners who are neg on that faction sympathy it would be harder to regain the sympathy and the trust of certain faction.
Ah and the 'fixed' faction sympathy system is still not working very well. The penalty for killing the member of your own faction or an allied one is definitely too little. Basically, id like to see one to be kicked from the faction after 3 kills of his own faction member or get neg FS after 4-5 allied kills (in that faction of course). Now u can easily kill an allied runner 30-40 times before your sympathy get to neg values. That is wrong.
Jesterthegreat
08-01-05, 15:29
Do you actually ever post something that makes sense and/or is not flaming?
dont make me go through the hassle of finding your "Go play CS" quotes young man...
sork... become red with one kill is too....
listen what u have to do......
When one of your allies kills u, there's only one thing to do.... revenge...
N3v3rM0r3
theres no game that has the same PvP as neocron.
if u change it, im sure AT LEAST 30% of the remaining community would quit the game.
the only way to make Terra a good server, is that FF has to split in 2 clans, 1 anti, 1 pro.
hows thats for balancing the server / pvp, terra wise.
if the System Shock members woulda stayed Pro, im sure FF wouldnt hold so many Ops, and have so many people online all the time.
IF I ever go to cycrow to PK, the place is loaded with FF in 2 minutes, i mean thats even faster than I get there.
Why ever bother to go to Cycrow then? if its 2 vs 5, i can live with that but 2 vs 10+ (like always) is getting boring. (not to mention a Rhino inside Cycrow op :p)
also the pro city might wanna change their alliance chat attitude.
u think flaming at NCAT will help?
i dont see how that helps, it only makes us hunting u down and kill you, which leads to more pro city fights, and SL loss for us :p
there was a time where ncat would help the procity, we still do but flaming doesnt make it any better
(btw we dont pk randomly, just the ppl we dont like)
Nikabolokov
11-01-05, 14:03
SS changed servers iirc and to be honest think I am too. Lets see how you like it when Terra has 5 % pop..
Oh wait, then you'll simply move to another game...
Bugs Gunny
11-01-05, 14:07
Xcuse me, but half the time it's ncat or their alts starting the shittalk on allied chat. I even prefer them allied pking when they're bored than having to read that load of crap.
And as for the whole SS situation, i'm sure ncat had something to do with them going anti city. I recal someone saying.... "we're going doy so we can kill ncat without losing SL".
This whole ncat being holier than thou act just doesn't work when you ARE responsible for a lot of people turning to doy. It's a situation you have helped create.
Jesterthegreat
11-01-05, 14:25
Xcuse me, but half the time it's ncat or their alts starting the shittalk on allied chat. I even prefer them allied pking when they're bored than having to read that load of crap.
And as for the whole SS situation, i'm sure ncat had something to do with them going anti city. I recal someone saying.... "we're going doy so we can kill ncat without losing SL".
This whole ncat being holier than thou act just doesn't work when you ARE responsible for a lot of people turning to doy. It's a situation you have helped create.
bullshit... i defend ncat but tbh i think ill not bother in the future... leave the carebears to flame away. and if your that bothered mute us.
and people goin anti? doesnt bother me. all the best people i have encountered (the ones i consider bets of course) are pro city, and no they arent all NCAT before you say... for example i rate Kid Kapow (who seems to hate me due to ally killing now) as one of the best pistol spies. however i admit most of the people i consider best are ups / ncat.
I like it the way it is :lol: no need to change it, Why whine......just play the game. Adapt and overcome if you die.........just play the game.
Skill insufficiencies hurt more than allied pkers, sorry :(
You complain about FF beeing too big when it is NCAT and UPS who are *directly* responsible for the SS-FF merge... Not mentioning other clans (not mine actually) who left/move for exactly the same reasons.
Anyways, most people feel comfortable in DoY and dont want to go back, which means you're doing good job.
Lower pvp damage, remember nc1? how duels used to last more than 10 seconds, lower pvp damage would not only mke ganking from behind less fisabel, but it would cause pvp to rely on skill more and suprise less
Jesterthegreat
13-01-05, 09:21
You complain about FF beeing too big when it is NCAT and UPS who are *directly* responsible for the SS-FF merge... Not mentioning other clans (not mine actually) who left/move for exactly the same reasons.
Anyways, most people feel comfortable in DoY and dont want to go back, which means you're doing good job.
cos if SS left them they would benormal size... :rolleyes:
so NCAT and UPS forced you to find the biggest bandwagon available and leap on? i dont remember saying "you have to join FF!"...
it was entirely possible to just move to doy and stay independant... to not followthe big boys around 24/7... but no, you didnt do that.
Bugs Gunny
13-01-05, 11:10
They are just 4-5 people. One of the smallest clans in neocron if you don't count them by the amount of accounts they have.
Let them spam trade all they want. Let them feel "leet" because they win a fight where they get in the first 2-3 shots at an unbuffed target.
Don't even bother talking to them, as they will just enjoy the attention they get.
Load your guns, and drop each one of them whenever you can.
Nobody will care if they go on trade saying they got "allied killed".
They are making more enemies each day and as long as they don't become a big clan, they won't last long doing it.
As new leader of NCAT I say we move back to doy :p
if pro city would HAVE any skills they'd fight back, usually NCAT has (as all of u say) negative soullight so go ahead and kill us, plz.
just do something about us, not drinking thea and having meetings, that dont work. stand up to us.
i honestly dont know why ur doing this.
1) having meetings
2) whine on forums
3) complain
4) do nothing to get rid of the problem
if everybody moves to doy.. u think ncat wont go back to doy? u change server? np we change server also
Bugs Gunny
13-01-05, 12:15
As new leader of NCAT I say we move back to doy :p
Whic one was the first of you to quit neocron? One down, 4 to go?
if pro city would HAVE any skills they'd fight back, usually NCAT has (as all of u say) negative soullight so go ahead and kill us, plz.
Oh my, no more ppu's walking your footsteps to pick up that red sl belt?
just do something about us, not drinking thea and having meetings, that dont work. stand up to us.
Does this mean you won't be abusing that NAP as a shield anymore?
i honestly dont know why ur doing this.
1) having meetings The meeting was originaly about organising pro-city to fight doy.
2) whine on forums
Ficknosh Mcmaximus:"Why do you kill my unclanned ncat alt??? Why??? can someone tell me this? Explain it to me" .... for hours on end.
3) complain"Because we can, and KK doesn't stop us"
4) do nothing to get rid of the problem One mosquito can be realy anoying, but it's just such a small nuisance that there's no point in gassing the house. It will die in a few months anyway. Or if you happen to see it fly by, you can make the small effort of smacking it against the wall.
if everybody moves to doy.. u think ncat wont go back to doy? u change server? np we change server also
Don't let the door hit you on the way out ;-)
As new leader of NCAT I say we move back to doy :p
if pro city would HAVE any skills they'd fight back, usually NCAT has (as all of u say) negative soullight so go ahead and kill us, plz.
just do something about us, not drinking thea and having meetings, that dont work. stand up to us.
i honestly dont know why ur doing this.
1) having meetings
2) whine on forums
3) complain
4) do nothing to get rid of the problem
if everybody moves to doy.. u think ncat wont go back to doy? u change server? np we change server also
Not being funny but 'fight back' is exactly what you want - it doesnt seem to have crossed your minds that some players might just not be able to (not being high enough rank) or just might not want to PvP at that moment/at all - its really no different to ganking lowbies in the hope they go and log an high level alt to come and hunt you down (or get their clan to if they dont have an alt) it also doesnt seem to have registered that any new players will do get will probably join a clan really quickly (because MMORPG players are used to clans etc) and therefore take their LE without realising how much 'clan baggage' their character is about to inherit - they simply wont hang around the game long enough to level up and fight back if they keep getting killed just to 'provoke a reaction for their high ranked clan-mates'.
This 'play style' can be easily summed up as 'I need to make everyone think I'm an asshole so I always get some PvP action when I'm online' - get a life and realise the game doesnt revolve around you. Other people will be sat there thinking 'I wish these assholes would piss off and let me get on with what I want to be doing for a change' - I'm not suggesting your not entitled to that POV I'm suggesting other peoples POVs are equally valid yet you show no respect for that, as long as you get your kicks you dont appear to give a shit if anyone else is having fun (drive everyone else away from NC and then see how much fun your having!)
If you really want to fight that bad why dont you just go factionless Or better yet get your 'relentless PvP kicks' by playing Planetside for a change?
do other ppl show us respect?
no they whine and flame, thats why we kill those ppl.
@bugs, who the fuck do u think i am? smurfis? i never had red sl in the city or have a ppu up my ass.
and for the record we dont attack low lvls ones, if we hit one once its not on purpose.
btw, the situation now was better than the old saturn situation.
every noob there got ganked. live with it
Bugs Gunny
13-01-05, 14:10
[QUOTE=Kopaka]do other ppl show us respect?
no they whine and flame, thats why we kill those ppl.[QUOTE]
Ever heard that one usualy has to EARN respect?
I think we all know where your little clan is heading, and there's not many that will take in the leftovers.
do other ppl show us respect?
no they whine and flame, thats why we kill those ppl.
That's the reason why you'll never get respect ... you have to earn it without shoving ur weapon in their face. :rolleyes:
Jesterthegreat
13-01-05, 14:24
as i have said in another thread alot of us have alts in a bigger (PvP / OP orientated) clan... so even if NCAT did decide to disband its no probs.
and afaik none of us have quit since Akasha quit a while back.
a change in leadership does not always mean someone quit... and i can safely say that
1. 101st broke the nap by killing unclanned pro cities with no provocation
2. that with ice in charge i get a feeling there will be no more nap
oh and theres a difference between ficknosh saying "do you condone ally killing" and having to explain it as you seemed incapable of understanding that the runner killed was unclanned... and whining.
people bitching and whining are whining.
people having to explain how you can tell if someone is in a clan is not... and it shouldnt be needed either.
Bugs Gunny
13-01-05, 14:40
Xcuse me.
Stop pretending it is "your" NAP.
It was purple's NAP, and you somehow tried to hijack it :-)
If we broke the nap, i have yet to see evidence of it from other clans attacking us. In fact, i notice that we get along quite well with the other pro city clans. I wish the same could be said for your clan.
I know most of the alts you have in other clans, and i realy don't care about that, since it kind of forces you to "behave" on those alts. And in respect to the other pro city clans those alts will never be attacked by us.
And having 3 people spread out in other clans doesn't realy let you be "NCAT" anymore now does it. Because at the first sign of you starting interclan wars any smart clanleader would drop you like a diseased rat.
I doubt you will get out of purple's nap, as it would be too much heat for you to handle.
Jesterthegreat
13-01-05, 14:42
Xcuse me.
Stop pretending it is "your" NAP.
It was purple's NAP, and you somehow tried to hijack it :-)
If we broke the nap, i have yet to see evidence of it from other clans attacking us. In fact, i notice that we get along quite well with the other pro city clans. I wish the same could be said for your clan.
I know most of the alts you have in other clans, and i realy don't care about that, since it kind of forces you to "behave" on those alts. And in respect to the other pro city clans those alts will never be attacked by us.
And having 3 people spread out in other clans doesn't realy let you be "NCAT" anymore now does it. Because at the first sign of you starting interclan wars any smart clanleader would drop you like a diseased rat.
I doubt you will get out of purple's nap, as it would be too much heat for you to handle.
i dont see the majority of clans attacking us either... yet you said we break it...
wasnt that the whole problem? no one stands up to ally killers?
anyways im off back to work
Bugs Gunny
13-01-05, 14:50
Well, the whole point is, if we all unite against you. You'll probably move to doy, as being kos to half a server is not cool, especialy not if all your doy and unclanned alts are included in that list.
So the other option is that some people attack you, which makes it fun for you... A certain amount of fighting, that you can handle.
third option is to just let you go at it, killing you here and there as people remember names, and in the end you'll be a problem that goes away.
The whole NC1 strategy you had of "join us or die" has failed completely.
So now all that is left is for you guys to join other clans and let yours die an anonymous death.
Asurmen Spec Op
13-01-05, 15:57
As new leader of NCAT I say we move back to doy :p
if pro city would HAVE any skills they'd fight back, usually NCAT has (as all of u say) negative soullight so go ahead and kill us, plz.
just do something about us, not drinking thea and having meetings, that dont work. stand up to us.
i honestly dont know why ur doing this.
1) having meetings
2) whine on forums
3) complain
4) do nothing to get rid of the problem
if everybody moves to doy.. u think ncat wont go back to doy? u change server? np we change server also dont go to doy, we like it here good people no allied gankers its nice.
you dont noob gank!?
a 35/20 Hacknet spy isnt a noob!?
wtf
And having 3 people spread out in other clans doesn't realy let you be "NCAT" anymore now does it.
name me the 3 clans.
and during the nap we didnt get any respect, id say we earned it during the nap. that didnt work apparently, so shoving a weapon up ur face is really the only way to do it.
or tell me another solution.
even i (yes Jester, ME.. iCe`) think that we need less allied killing, altho i'd love to see some ppl dead.
@Asurmen.. allied noobs.. red noobs ask for it :)
if ur procity, gimme name and location and the name who killed u
Well, the whole point is, if we all unite against you. You'll probably move to doy, as being kos to half a server is not cool, especialy not if all your doy and unclanned alts are included in that list.
So the other option is that some people attack you, which makes it fun for you... A certain amount of fighting, that you can handle.
third option is to just let you go at it, killing you here and there as people remember names, and in the end you'll be a problem that goes away.
The whole NC1 strategy you had of "join us or die" has failed completely.
So now all that is left is for you guys to join other clans and let yours die an anonymous death.
1) we wont move back to doy cuz pro city are attacking us
2) we cant handle every1 in the city? bring it on biznatch
3) join us or die? ncat never had over 12 different players, small clan
and during the nap we didnt get any respect, id say we earned it during the nap. that didnt work apparently, so shoving a weapon up ur face is really the only way to do it.
I think you're mistaking notoriety with respect :wtf: ..... most people I've heard have nothing but bad words about NCAT's allied pk'ing.
Most of the clans in the NAP aren't getting into a war of words with NCAT because of the security blanket the NAP provides them which prevents NCAT members from attacking them. They don't want to lose the control the NAP has over NCAT.
Don't like what I say then that's fine ..... telling you the truth whether you care to listen or not.
Jesterthegreat
13-01-05, 21:31
instead of argueing and bitching lets just wait and see instead.
Asurmen Spec Op
13-01-05, 23:57
its just Ironic that you did hide behind the NAP, I know your a new leader and all but I highly doubt any pro city clan takes you serious.
[ edited ]
Jesterthegreat
14-01-05, 01:55
its just Ironic that you did hide behind the NAP, I know your a new leader and all but I highly doubt any pro city clan takes you serious.
[ edited ]
damn... and i was hoping you would like us :(
:edit:
btw learn to spell censor
:edit2: and its censored... not sensor really... if you wannabe grammatically correct
we didnt hide behind the nap, and im not even the fucking leader so shove it
Jesterthegreat
14-01-05, 02:07
the only ones hiding behind the NAP are the people in it who flame NCAT (much like the majority of this thread's posters)
I used to be forced to take NAPS in 1st grade, right around 2 o'clock the teacher would tell us to break out the lil blue mats and find a space on the floor...boy I used to hate it.
NAPS are useless atm, no one really follows the pro-city nap or help....well I seen Phaze do some nice back-up, but that is about it.
There are more allied killers in the city than just a few NCAT players, what about the so-called neutral CM's that come into our home and pk as well? I dont quite understand the fetish with people putting NCAT on the tips of their tongues....maybe it's envy? dunno... Jealousy....rage....anger from the loss of belts. No one will really ever know, and the pro-city atmosphere will never change.
:p
bugs gunny name me the 3 fucking clans u were talking about.
if u say something back it up with something valid. (yes this coming from me)
ill say again cuz some mod apparently deleted a post...
as far as im concered there never was a NAP.
NCAT got attacked during the nap when we were following the rules of the nap.
as for the Phaze/NCAT issue..
Phaze started attacking us, not the other way around, oh no shit.. we're the bad guys ONCE AGAIN.
its been settled with Phaze tho, altho I like to see other members (*cough* daemonX *cough*) dead.
oh yeah thats what I forgot.. any Phaze PM me with Shogun Assassins alt names, or mail me ingame or direct me ingame: Black Heart
(not Smurf like u lot think, im not smurf.. anymore..)
Hes the only person in Phaze that stays KoS, anyone have a problem or PPUing for him... well dont
Firstly Smurfis blocked alot of clans from falling under the NAP (Non-aggression pact in case you forgot) ...... resulting in alot of pro-city clans not in the NAP, wondering why a pro-city meeting to end allied killing was called in the first place. That's the first mistake.
Adding a separate KoS clause regardless of faction or clan was the second mistake. Pro-city clans who weren't in the NAP but were trying to get in, felt that fully negated what the purpose of a NAP was. In the real world if you attempted to kill citizen of an allied country, they'd be pissed and wouldn't consider you allies. Same applies to NAP that the clan falls under. If you have a problem with a person get the clan leader to sort it out.
Failure to inform non-NAP clans about the goals/rules of the NAP was the third mistake. Plus add to the fact the members of the NAP were saying different things about the NAP frustrated the heck out of pro-city clans not in the NAP.
Fourth mistake was clans not adhering to the NAP. Mostly due to individuals but as members of a clan, you are a representative of that clan and thus any actions bad or good reflects what is the perceived image of that clan.
Fifth mistake, no attempt to rectify breaches of NAP. There was no diplomcy after the NAP was first "officially" done. There was alot of finger pointing and no one admitting they screwed up. Also people tried to solve problems by killing them back, thus creating a never-ending cycle. Grow up and accept responsibility o_O
Sixth mistake, a few major clans not showing any sort of clan solidarity in terms of policy. Alot was left up to the individuals and hence that's where all the crap starts. If you have no control over a member, kick that person out or reprimand that person. There was alot of "turning a blind eye" to the crap that was perpetrated by individuals.
Now after all these major mistakes you wonder why people have no faith in the NAP anymore and why some clans in the NAP don't have the "respect" they think they deserve. :rolleyes:
Jesterthegreat
14-01-05, 14:14
Fifth mistake, no attempt to rectify breaches of NAP. There was no diplomcy after the NAP was first "officially" done. There was alot of finger pointing and no one admitting they screwed up. Also people tried to solve problems by killing them back, thus creating a never-ending cycle. Grow up and accept responsibility o_O
now now... when i discussed the breach of nap with bugs i got flamed then he posted on here i was whining...
Bugs Gunny
14-01-05, 14:37
I'm looking forward to you guys leaving the nap, realy i am.
now now... when i discussed the breach of nap with bugs i got flamed then he posted on here i was whining...
OK some diplomacy was tried but it was one way :P :D
Jesterthegreat
14-01-05, 14:40
OK some diplomacy was tried but it was one way :P :D
as you can see from bugs' comment its clearly only going to be one sided...
we ally kill, we get abuse.
we nap... we get abuse.
im unsure what we are expected to do tbh...
This really applies to Pro-City, but I guess DoY has some PKers somewhere.
Ok, so the argument from the PKers is that when they play, and kill, they don't want to give people warnings due to buff's etc, and the Pro-City's are pissed off at the constant kills which arent necessary.
So, seeing as SL is obviously never going to work this is my idea:
The shoot-who-you-want system is changed. Pro-Cities can kill Anti-Cities without warning all they want, provided their LE is out of course. IF a Pro-City for some reason wants to kill another Pro-City, then a CHALLENGE option is usable in a similar way to TRADE with another player.
If a player accepts the CHALLENGE, i.e like accepting a team invitation, then they are "contracted" into a duel with whoever challenged them, and vice versa.
Now, once in this combat system, no outside influence can be used, such as PPU's, thereby levelling the playing field. Buffs may be used, but at the risk of the player using them, as all active buffs will be cancelled once the duel starts, and must be re-activated, once again levelling the playing field.
This method means PKers can go on killing sprees of enemy factions, thereby relieving their boredom etc, and if a genuine grudge is held against a friendly unit, the duel method is used, menaing everyone should be happy, hopefully.
New idea, LE's basically set a rule in the game:
If Law = 0 then player may be attacked by other runners
If Law = 1 then player cannot be aimed at or harmed by other runners.
Thus to solve allied pk'ing add in:
If Law = 3 the player may not attack runners in the same allience.
first off.
Bugs, u said something about 3 different clans... NAME ME THEM FFS
oh wait u cant, theres no 3 different clans
Weazle..
u think u can do better? from what ive seen u doing really do anything to stop the PKing..
and when u flame ncat all the time dont u think its retarded to think ur still napped with them?
Bugs, again...
there is no NAP, stop whining about a NAP, next time i see a 101st, hes going down, just cuz u keep whining on about a NAP.
and yes, thats how I handle my affairs. u know a better way tell me, only way to get u paying attention is by killing 1 of ur clannies..
anders dringt het niet door in die botte dikke kop van je, daarom >_<
cos if SS left them they would benormal size... :rolleyes:
so NCAT and UPS forced you to find the biggest bandwagon available and leap on? i dont remember saying "you have to join FF!"...
it was entirely possible to just move to doy and stay independant... to not followthe big boys around 24/7... but no, you didnt do that.
a little explanation then
1. SS had quite a lot members (around 50)
2. It wasnt about me or DS Inc, i was talking about SS, System Shock (former TT clan) who moved to TG and merged with FF
3. DS Inc has moved to FA and is staying there as an independent clan
So... as i've always said... read first, try to understand, post later
first off.
Bugs, u said something about 3 different clans... NAME ME THEM FFS
oh wait u cant, theres no 3 different clans
i bet he's talking about the uPs/NCAT/Venom zerg !
Jesterthegreat
14-01-05, 21:51
a little explanation then
1. SS had quite a lot members (around 50)
2. It wasnt about me or DS Inc, i was talking about SS, System Shock (former TT clan) who moved to TG and merged with FF
3. DS Inc has moved to FA and is staying there as an independent clan
So... as i've always said... read first, try to understand, post later
yeah i noiced your sig after i posted... but i was in a net cafe at lunch time and time was up... had to rush back to work :p
but thanks for the patronising comments... glad i could boost your E-ego
I don't like the idea at all.
The beauty of neocron is that anyone anywhere is a target, issuing a challenge is a little too queer for my liking, other mmo's have it and it fits well, but not with neocron.
1) F6 does not necessarily determine your enemies.
2) Your enemies are not always anti your faction.
3) Freeplay.
4) LE.
5) Neocron is more than an RPG its a FPS too.
Jesterthegreat
14-01-05, 22:11
I don't like the idea at all.
The beauty of neocron is that anyone anywhere is a target, issuing a challenge is a little too queer for my liking, other mmo's have it and it fits well, but not with neocron.
1) F6 does not necessarily determine your enemies.
2) Your enemies are not always anti your faction.
3) Freeplay.
4) LE.
5) Neocron is more than an RPG its a FPS too.
damn right...
sup O? not seen you in time :D
damn right...
sup O? not seen you in time :D
Been hiding under an assumed identity :)
Jesterthegreat
14-01-05, 22:15
i see... well look me up ingame if yousstill play :D
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