View Full Version : Better Neocron justice system
The punishment of killing allies is laughable. You are not really punished the SL loss is low and it comes back automaticly while you hide inside the city 8|
I don't think it is very real that you can go up and randomly kill fx a CA runner in front of an copbot. Its like going in town in front of an police officer and pull a gun and kill a person working for the guvernment. Then the police officer wouldn't react cause this is happening always.
The copbots damage yeah well its missing. Its like a beggar trying to kill a capped tank.
Right now in terra you will be able to witness pro city hunting parties swiping plaza 1 and killing any allied they see. Thats unreal and i will call it against the eccence of this game. There should be a better and more severe consequence for those actions.
Here are my ideas:
The faction sympaty should be used.
When you get bad faction symp the npc's of that faction should attack you cause you are enemy of that faction. In that case you can't fx kill a lot of biotechs and then go inside biotech HQ to wait for getting SL up again.
CA is the law enforcing power in neocron. So there should be powers to people with high faction symp. Like stopping attacks on copbots or other allies getting PK'ed for no reason (god SL getting attacked by bad SL).
Maybe there should be a court where allied killers can get judged and fined with a bill or even with community service (doing delivery runs). Not fullfilling his community service should result in a bill from the guvernment.
These ideas are to prevent the dissaperence of the roleplay from the server. Some PK'ers are of the opinion that cause they can kill you they are allowed too. Cause no one is stopping them.
I really hope you look into this. The power to CA i think would get the CA in their right element. All other factions are able to forfill their buisness cause of the new trade options. If you want real estate you go DRT if you need wheels you contakt NEXT and so on and so on.
I know i probably will be called whiner and carebear but tbh i don't care this are my opinions and i stand to them 100%. I was put on KOS list cause i stand up against allied killers over allied chat so i think i can take it.
Darth Slayer
09-12-04, 19:43
How about the Guards/Copbots automatically fire on anyone with a weapon drawn ? Somehow I doubt a fine or a few delievery runs are going to deter your hardcore idiot.
Scorpius.
Three Words: The Bounty System (http://neocron.jafc.de/showthread.php?p=1682080)
I also like the name "hardcore idiot".
Three Words: The Bounty System (http://neocron.jafc.de/showthread.php?p=1682080)
I also like the name "hardcore idiot".
Lol damn you -FN-, I was in the middle of searching for that link ;)
Darth Slayer
09-12-04, 19:57
Three Words: The Bounty System (http://neocron.jafc.de/showthread.php?p=1682080)
I also like the name "hardcore idiot".
Just read that thread can't believe I missed it, tis a great idea.
As for Hardcore Idiot well I have my moments not often but I do have em....... :D
Scorpius.
Well yeah bounty hunting could be an ekstra. But still the CA faction need something for their role. Their job is to keep a save envoirement with the tools they have right now they can't do nothing. The epic item is a joke tbh. The PA is only good for noob char and has no influence for the CA role. Well we can look like copbots but still are nothing.
What when the bounty system goes wrong and defending players have to kill a PPU in order to stop the PK'er?
I like the idea of rewarding more then punishing. High SL and High Faction Symp should confer more benefits. The FSM's are a step in the right direction, but we need more. Basicly people need a reason to stay friendly to their faction. If there's no reason to keep symp up, why bother?
One of many ideas partialy implimented and then abandoned was a faction council, in nc1. Each clan in a faction could elect one member to the council and then everyone in the faction voted who they approved of. The one with highest approval is council chairman. Tho granted the system had lots of problems, it had soo much potential. One of the suggested abilities was for the council to boot people/clans from the faction. Another was a faction bank account for resources to run events. Yea it has potential for abuse, but I'm sure checks/balances could be put in.
One of the things that made Venus great was that it was run by an involved staff of gm's, who were a regular part of the game. They even stepped in to boot clans that didn't play nicely. I don't expect kk to do the same, but giving the players the power would work just as well.
The reason i am more for punishment is the realism of game. In real life you will get punished for your crimes, but not in neocron. I said my opinion once over allied chat yesterday now i am getting literally herassed by players. They won't learn without consequences. They laugh at the SL system cause its no problem te get rid of bad SL. They will be getting rid of bounty quick too just hide 30 sec in safe zone or use a stealth that last 30 sec.
The faction council would be a good idea. Have seen it a bit in work on saturn it was great.
And btw today i got jumped by a 3-4 ppl allied killing team and lost my PA so i know how irritating it is when you don't want to lose SL or symp. Its a high price to pay.
One idea I heard someone mention was more safe slots. Higher the SL the more safe slots you have in your quick belt.
Also many people say they shouldn't lose anything for attacking back, but in my personal experiance - whenever I am ganked by allies, its always when they have an advantage, be it surprise, numbers, or just the fact its a totaly random attack that I wouldnt expect... therefore i usually lose. So this system would need to allow me to take revenge, although usually when i GR back and get some clannies down the guy(s) are hiding in an HQ (cityadmin hq anyone ? so many allied fights right otuside those doors)
A huge hunting party hit plaza last night and i was a victim of a surprise attack . They call my clan NIbs and say they are teaching us PvP if i wanted to learn PvP skills i will go to NF thanks .
They went on a spree of killing anyone and everyone who got in there way to the extent of getting red sl
4 aggie missions later back to green sl so the process starts again
go and kill more people -
well tbh i know many people who are leaving nc because it isbeyond a joke and when WoW is availiable to me i am thinking about playing id the situation doesnt improve
Wtf is the deal with our copbots they suck run into DoY city and see how long u last against there guards
whenever I am ganked by allies, its always when they have an advantage, be it surprise, numbers, or just the fact its a totaly random attack that I wouldnt expect... therefore i usually lose.
uhh surprise and "a totaly random attack that I wouldnt expect"
is the same ;x
I have to agree the current situation is very bad for community and gameplay.
Players are limited in their ability to control this KK need to sort something.
If Allied clans get together to rid NC city of these idiots then they still have to deal with Neg SL and losing shitloads from belts if they die.
Nevermind the general population thinking they are the allied gankers :(
Imagine a team sent to hunt down known Pk'er they find him gank him steal his belt as reprisal for his bad deeds yet people in local may be unaware they are the good guys and looks to them like an allied hunting party :confused:
Names get put on KOS lists, rinse repeat, suddenly spirals out of control.
so how can we combat this?
Maybe a CLAN called police city justice!
Made up of capped players who will simply patrol our streets venting justice and as their tags will show them as POLICE then people everyone will know :)
i know just an idea lol
A huge hunting party hit plaza last night and i was a victim of a surprise attack . They call my clan NIbs and say they are teaching us PvP if i wanted to learn PvP skills i will go to NF thanks .
They went on a spree of killing anyone and everyone who got in there way to the extent of getting red sl
4 aggie missions later back to green sl so the process starts again
go and kill more people -
well tbh i know many people who are leaving nc because it isbeyond a joke and when WoW is availiable to me i am thinking about playing id the situation doesnt improve
Wtf is the deal with our copbots they suck run into DoY city and see how long u last against there guards
Yup, I got killed on my PE by them, then when I went back with my PPU it took 2 APUs, a tank and a PPU to kill me. Gotta love chaincasted HAB, Shelter and n00b heal.
So then the rest of UnforgiveN turned up and sorted the problem. Took down 2 APUs, 2 PPUs and am not sure about the tank. Subsequently, I asked everyone in the clan to get 100 SL to help the allied gankers get ganked.
Oh, and w00t 1000 posts! :angel:
100% agreement.
Seeing some "green" or allies, turning round and beeing ganked. Thank you very much :mad:
Thats the reason some MMORPG companies decided against PvP. But the hardcore idiots (i like that one! :D ) alway yell for PvP until it is allowed. Then after power-levelling they say there is no content except PvP and start killing friendlies.
And don`t be surprised. There is a game to come (a fantasy one) wich is suffering from random PK :rolleyes: Some people camp levelling spots and killing neutrals.....
Doc Holliday
10-12-04, 15:22
who was it? this raiding team i mean
I know some more :x
and [ edited ] only kills allie killers, stop atacking us !
the tank didnt die btw.
Jesterthegreat
10-12-04, 22:46
naming people on the forum to bring negative attention to them is against the rules...
to fight whiners you must whine yourself...
PMing GM's / mods to edit posts
its not like not everyone knows us or anything
Ch1n Th3 M4g
10-12-04, 22:49
TBH
STFU NOOB
blah blah blah these peeps kill......
if u got a problem dm them...
dont go bitching 2 a croud that really dosent give a fuck......nib
jesus
ROFL !
mucho sexx0s @ u mag :)
Jesterthegreat
10-12-04, 23:30
ty nid...
continue discussion plz peeps
SL and faction sympathy penalties are worth bugger all to be honest. I've seen people at isolated gr's gr killing a symp whore for about 20 minutes non stop. The reason? He wanted to raise his faction sympathies so he could carry on pking allies later that day. It's not the first time I've seen this happening for this reason and I'm pretty sure it wont be the last.
Jesterthegreat
11-12-04, 12:24
update... check attatchment
fairly conclusive i think... a GM and a Dev saying it breaks no rules and there will be no GM action.
thread can be closed now as the only point in it staying open is further flamage.
Jesterthegreat
11-12-04, 12:35
more...
note:
constructive posts = good
whines = bad
TBH jesterthegreat its not your post. I don't think you just can decide let this post be closed. Yes there is flamege, funny enough from pople with same signature :rolleyes:
I was told of 2 GM that you are not breaking rules in game, but they also think that allied pk'ing is getting out of hand. They also could follw my point and my ideas. The resulotion they gave me was to make a post on the forum and maybe that would get KK to open eyes for the problem.
You call me whiner and noob and that i shall STFU. And i get edited for herrasment cause of mentioning names 8| . Ok fair enough didn't know that is herrasment to mention names of allied pk'ers in forum, but its gone now. What about attacking a player that is fed up with that random allied pk'ing? Its not herrasment to call people names and tell them to shut up or trying to get their post closed?
Englelke, this is an argument that has always polarised the community so try not to take it to heart. ;) Yes, it's your thread and only you have the right to ask for it to be closed, should you wish to do so.
N
well NC has all the retards in it from all the servers really we are missing nda to kick their ass :(
Jesterthegreat
11-12-04, 13:00
TBH jesterthegreat its not your post. I don't think you just can decide let this post be closed. Yes there is flamege, funny enough from pople with same signature :rolleyes:
I was told of 2 GM that you are not breaking rules in game, but they also think that allied pk'ing is getting out of hand. They also could follw my point and my ideas. The resulotion they gave me was to make a post on the forum and maybe that would get KK to open eyes for the problem.
You call me whiner and noob and that i shall STFU. And i get edited for herrasment cause of mentioning names 8| . Ok fair enough didn't know that is herrasment to mention names of allied pk'ers in forum, but its gone now. What about attacking a player that is fed up with that random allied pk'ing? Its not herrasment to call people names and tell them to shut up or trying to get their post closed?
did you screenie me calling you names if so abuse@neocron.com will help. if not stop throwing baseless accusations around.
and if im fed up with being killed by an enemy i cant call it harassment... nor couild i if its an ally.
the risk of removing LE
:edit: and i didnt demand the thread to be closed... so keep your pants on
Chill, it's Saturday morning, go watch Soccer AM or something. :p
N
Jesterthegreat
11-12-04, 13:07
Chill, it's Saturday morning, go watch Soccer AM or something. :p
N
its football...
and no :p
Darth Slayer
11-12-04, 14:05
thread can be closed now as the only point in it staying open is further flamage.
Sorry mate but it does appear your asking for the thread to be closed.
Anyways if your fed up being pked in NC by the Hardcore Idiots come to DOY we're all carebears............ :lol:
Scorpius.
Jesterthegreat
11-12-04, 14:07
Sorry mate but it does appear your asking for the thread to be closed.
Anyways if your fed up being pked in NC by the Hardcore Idiots come to DOY we're all carebears............ :lol:
Scorpius.
saying it can be closed..
neither asking not telling it must be closed :p
and hopefully our leaders will be ingame by the new year... we can start doin clan shit then :)
An idea would be that there should be some laws that players could affect through for example in HQ's. Let's say that some people think that pkilling should be generally allowed, there should be a possibility to vote ingame. After the votes are in, copbots for example reacts accordingly. I think some rules in the game should be decided by the players. Then we wouldn't be whining about the rules all the time. this way the RPG part of the game still keeps itself intact, and the FPS part still keeps it's own.
I am not all against PK'ing. But as its now its getting out of control and to mutch. The punishment you get now is nothing, SL is easy to get back. Even symp you get fast by killing a enemy noob you make and log by double loggin. I dunno if its legal but i know ppl do it i have seen it done before.
Jesterthegreat the abusive language was not mentioned to you but the post that is removed now from one with same name in signature as yours. But i dunno why you thought it was you.
I only came with ideas of better rules so there still could be roleplaying. It is hard to play your roleplay if you have to be prepared for attack everytime you see names in local cause it might be an allied killer or plain enemy. As it is now i dunno who to trust and who not. And my char is good SL and good faction symp and want to stay that way. Thats hard when attacked by positive SL allies cause then i have to get killed and will probably lose my QB. I could chose to fight back but then i don't feel i play as my char would react. I am a CA and i am there to service and protect the city not to kill the habitans of the city.
It is getting way out of order. plaza 1 is like deathmatch quake atm. Walking from plaza 3 to via 1 today I was attacked by 2 different pking groups. I won't go into details because I'm sure we all have hundreds of stories of being assaulted by "allies" in the city centre. Out of all the gaming communities I am a member of, neocron is indeed the worst for ally pking and general snotty-nosed lameness and I'm seriously considering closing both my accounts because of it. I'm beginning to feel that paying money to be annoyed by some arrogant lil kiddie (or adult with kiddie mentality) is a waste of my money and time. One thing I have noticed about these ally pkers... they never seem to join in when doy squads are raiding NC, they never seem to participate. I've seen some of these pkers saying how "gay" the attacking party is in alliance chat, but they never actually go there to pvp the enemy. On occassion I have been ganked by an ally pker whilst on the way back from fighting doy in pepper park tho :D
I don't know why others bought and play this game, I was looking for an RPG, and neocron seemed to be an RPG. I have proper fps shooter games already, and I am in 3 different FPS clans in different gaming communities.. so when I want to play real pvp I play dod or joint ops, when I want to rpg, I play neocron. When I'm out in the wastes I bump into doy runners and have good battles with them, when I'm getting attacked by allies I get far too angry at these people who fail to play within the spirit of the game and take no enjoyment out of fighting with them (even when I win). There are "teamkillers" in other games, who tend to get kicked or banned when intentionally teamkilling. For example, 1 intentional tk on my dod clan's server = kick from server. If they come back and tk intentionally again, they get a permanent ban.
Fair enough, neocron isn't proper pvp so should not adhere so strictly to these ban rules but there should be something in place other than a rather poor SL reduction which dropping off a few pre-made bps at faction hq or doing 2 aggie missions can correct.
A few of the ideas for stemming the pking include increasing incentives for high +SL like extra locked slots on the qb if they die, I'm positive that some people would think twice about pking allies if it meant they could safely carry more than 1 or 2 of their best rares without the risk of dropping them when they die. I liked the bounty system but I think KK cba coding that. One part of it would be easy to integrate into the current system though... if you kill an ally you are fined for doing so. After all, you get rewards for killing mobs, why not get fined for killing allies? If the players are clanned then why not fine the clan for the action of their members too? Or to take it to an extreme, reduce the SL of everyone in the clan (unworkable really).
With all the solutions there are side effects, I'm sure everyone has gone yellow in a cave or fighting off a raiding party when they accidently hit an ally who then gets ganked, but this is a very small price to pay for cutting down the ally pking that's going on.
I'm sure we can all talk very constructively about what KK could do to stop all the grief that's being caused by the minority of players who don't seem to respect other player's wishes, gameplay and reasons for paying for this game, but I think it's best if it's dealt with by the runners and clans themselves. After all, it's a role-playing game, and keeping NC safe is every pro-city runner's responsibility - all that is required is some co-ordination (alliance chat). For example, when there is an ally pker running around, it's always the same faces that I see hunting them down. It is good to see that happening, and I hope that more people actively participate in keeping NC safe. Many people track red sl runners on the ncpd shitlist, and I think more people should be aware of it, and use it accordingly.
Clans have a massive role to play in curbing the activities of ally pkers. Clan leaders should be vigiliant of what their clan members are doing, and dropping member ranks or even kicking players out of the clan for repeating offenses. Players should be reporting tkers to the aggressor's clan leader, giving a brief description of the situation and how many people were killed, and clan leaders SHOULD BE ACTING ON THIS INFORMATION. Fair enough, if you're in a clan you want to get along with everyone in the clan, and it is difficult to tell a friend how to behave, but at the end of the day that member is giving your clan a bad rep and bad reps can take down entire clans.
Another thing I do to annoy pkers is do absolutely no tradeskilling for them, or their fellow clan members. It's a bit harsh on the other members who may be having trouble finding a tradeskiller but generally, when you tell them why you won't do it, they tend to take it on board and report it to their CL (or should do anyway). And yes, I know clans have tradeskillers, but it is still effective in my experience.
With all of the above, it's easy to counter-argue any of the solutions.. many pkers are not in a clan, or can give their money to someone to hold whilst they pk, or can spend a day raising their SL to high lvls then pk, but in the end it will help reduce much of the pking going on in NC... and will leave only a few hardcore idiots with sad workarounds for any solution that is implemented.
That's about it really, feel free to call me a carebear, it turns me on. It gets me all horny.. oh baby
Jesterthegreat
12-12-04, 14:32
I am not all against PK'ing. But as its now its getting out of control and to mutch. The punishment you get now is nothing, SL is easy to get back. Even symp you get fast by killing a enemy noob you make and log by double loggin. I dunno if its legal but i know ppl do it i have seen it done before.
Jesterthegreat the abusive language was not mentioned to you but the post that is removed now from one with same name in signature as yours. But i dunno why you thought it was you.
I only came with ideas of better rules so there still could be roleplaying. It is hard to play your roleplay if you have to be prepared for attack everytime you see names in local cause it might be an allied killer or plain enemy. As it is now i dunno who to trust and who not. And my char is good SL and good faction symp and want to stay that way. Thats hard when attacked by positive SL allies cause then i have to get killed and will probably lose my QB. I could chose to fight back but then i don't feel i play as my char would react. I am a CA and i am there to service and protect the city not to kill the habitans of the city.
you want to RP... but you dont want us to play the game how we want...
if you dont like it there are multiple ways to avoid us.
HQ's, not plaza 1
TH, not plaza 1
LE
Appartments
or if you refuse to do any of this... just be aware of your surroundings! ffs its a post apocolyptic world... NC is a dictatorship... some people will form rebel groups. these rebel groups may get out of hand, but thats something you should deal with, not KK.
Darth Slayer
12-12-04, 21:07
you want to RP... but you dont want us to play the game how we want...
if you dont like it there are multiple ways to avoid us.
HQ's, not plaza 1
TH, not plaza 1
LE
Appartments
or if you refuse to do any of this... just be aware of your surroundings! ffs its a post apocolyptic world... NC is a dictatorship... some people will form rebel groups. these rebel groups may get out of hand, but thats something you should deal with, not KK.
H'mmmz now if you've got a good reason to pk an Ally so be it but my dear friend it seems your trying to justify some lamer actions there, which I thought was beyond you. Now if you Pk'd me I'd have a laugh about it with you after all we are opposing factions so fair play but to go around pking allies with no rhyme or reason that just sucks. Not saying your doing it but you do seem to be trying to justify it.
Scorpius.
you want to RP... but you dont want us to play the game how we want...
if you dont like it there are multiple ways to avoid us.
HQ's, not plaza 1
TH, not plaza 1
LE
Appartments
or if you refuse to do any of this... just be aware of your surroundings! ffs its a post apocolyptic world... NC is a dictatorship... some people will form rebel groups. these rebel groups may get out of hand, but thats something you should deal with, not KK.
HQ's well not mutch leveling there or gameplay i would say
TH well again same as HQ
LE yeah i would but i can't be in my clan or do any epics and epics are pure roleplay btw
Appartments well not mutch fun in my appartments unless you can get a GM to spawn some mobs there
Yes NC is dictatorship! The factions inside NC city are supporting the dictator. Yes there are formed rebel groubs the biggest and most feared and huntet of CA is actually a group called TG. So if you are roleplaying rebels there are a lot of factions to choose tbh.
For me its sounds like you say think of me and how I want to play the game, but do you ever think about other want to play the game? Right now there is a group of maybe 20 ppl that play the game your way! These minority pushes their game over the bigger part against their will. Don't you think other have to play their roleplay if they want? You can't play the full roleplay with LE so don't come with put LE in. Maybe KK should make a roleplay chip instead that denies allied killing.
completely ignored all you've said because it has to be said....
soccer am is better than the neo crack on a saturday morning. nice one niddy. ;)
but on topic - instead of the constant whining (not saying you are) and the reply that are just abuse (again not all or you).....pose a solution or an idea to solve the problem. i know the brainport doesnt get the love it should.
there should be a heck of a loss on the fs system for killing allies but there isnt. dont start the its rp in a way... there are bad people all over crap. we know - doesnt make it acceptable. :rolleyes:
It would make sense for CA (this is an example) who kills 3 allied nc chars to be ejected from the faction, as it would with any faction. there would have to be a time frame like a " 1 allied kill per 00.00 to 23.59 " ingame time or similar.
simply limiting the game for people that do not want to get ganged up on isnt fair and you cant expect that.
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