Why Virtual Worlds are Designed by Newbies

[athon]

Fresh off the press from /.

http://www.gamasutra.com/features/20041103/bartle_pfv.htm

For me a lot rings true. Thoughts?

Athon Solo

[MaGn0lia]

Wow, a fellow gamasutra dwelling monkey :D I greet you.

I love Bartle he is so wise, and ancient, mostly wise. And he has some very good points, and I agree with him to the end.

Tho I think the current situation with mmorpgs is because there are just way too much mmorpgs, and nothing innovative, and if there is one (Neocron) it is not properly promoted and well there are alot of other problems too, like well yeah, newbies making the game ;)

But all in all, Bartle is god and we are not worthy.

[Velvet]

Whow!
Great ideas.
Should be a must read for all NC gamers.
My favourite:

Player: You don't have teleporting! How can I rejoin my group if I miss a session?
Designer: Well gee, maybe by omitting teleportation I'm kinda dropping a hint that you can have a meaningful gaming experience, without always having to group with the same people of the same level and run a treadmill the whole time?
Player: Are you NUTS? I want to play with my friends, and I want to play with them RIGHT NOW!
Designer: But how are you ever going to make new friends? How -
Player: Are you listening? RIGHT NOW!
Designer: (Sigh)

[Omnituens]

You speak Korean?

[J. Folsom]

Hah, I knew theme weeks would be a bad idea, they allow players far too much input! :angel:

[MaGn0lia]

I don't know what omnituens ment with his statement, but I think he ment the fact that korean players play in team much more often than we europen/american players.

I have played knight-online and lineage 2 on eastern servers (lineage 2 was korean and knight-online was malaysian) and they tend to team you more easily and want to share their experience more easily than in the western servers, here you are a leecher if you aren't the class that deals most damage nor a healer/buffer.

This needs to change if we are trying to get other mmorpgs than planetside more team friendly.

[athon]

Personally I would love to se a perma-death MMORPG. I certainly think it could work, if used in conjunction with other features. For example I think in a perma death game you would probably also need limits on who you can attack rank-wise.

I'm certainly not a supporter of the 'you have to be near capped to do PvP' line. My first op war in Neocron I wasn't anywhere near capped. I took a bog standard Assault Rifle with me on my rifle spy (best weapon I could use at the time) and altho I probably died extemely quickly once attacked, I still had fun.

Athon Solo

[Dribble Joy]

I support PD only to an extent.
I cirtainly do not support it in NC, simply because people are people and people gank, simply because they can and you cannot not stop it, even with the threat of banning.
People would see a high level player and gang up and kill them for the hell of it.

[Spermy]

Erm.. forgive me - but wasn't that just a glorified - people want everything and people want it yesterday rant? - or failing that a long winded - Can't please everyone speech?

A lot of it is common sense - although the instancing thingy is quite well put.

[joran420]

Personally I would love to se a perma-death MMORPG. I certainly think it could work, if used in conjunction with other features. For example I think in a perma death game you would probably also need limits on who you can attack rank-wise.

I'm certainly not a supporter of the 'you have to be near capped to do PvP' line. My first op war in Neocron I wasn't anywhere near capped. I took a bog standard Assault Rifle with me on my rifle spy (best weapon I could use at the time) and altho I probably died extemely quickly once attacked, I still had fun.

Athon Solo

that unmentionable game has perma death.....not sure if its a good idea yet tbh

[Vid Gamer]

Perma-death sucks.

I can't see a game with perma-death be successful in the long run.

[Dribble Joy]

It comes down to the way people get a feeling of identity and ownership with thier online possesions and how it can be removed.

[athon]

No, I don't think you could convert any existing game to perma-death. A perma-death game would have to be perma-death based, with a lot of features, the levelling system and speed, etc, etc revolving around perma-death.

Athon Solo

[Heavyporker]

While the idea of perma-death is interesting... It's a very difficult concept to really construct a workable and long-term-enjoyable game around it.


He puts it rightly - people would turn into cowards.

And MMOGs the creatures they are, lag is a critical issue. No one would let the game company permit their 50/50 character die to a 1/1 roach just because the server hiccuped and kept the character ingame 50 minutes after been logged off, thus letting a weakling mob kill a tough character.

[jernau]

Interesting article.

Too many subjective assumptions to give it much credit as presented but certainly an interesting POV.

I don't suppose you have a link to the "academic" version?