View Full Version : Open letter to KK: please act !
nobody2004
12-10-04, 12:40
First I'd like to apologize for posting an english thread on your german forum
My german is not good enough for me to write in german, and I write this in english so (hopefully) most people will participate (if someone could/would translate it in german, I'd really appreciate).
I will post links on english and french forums to this thread, so that (hopefully) this post represents the whole community's view.
Now to the open letter:
Dear KK,
As you know, we (your community) like your game and for quiet a couple of us, have been with you for allready a long time.
We understand the launch of a new game (or new version of an existing game) is a challenging moment, and we do not intend this open letter to be yet a new challenge.
We understand that your resources are not infinite and that as a result you have to priorize your actions.
This open letter intent is to attract your attention to the community's reasonable expectations and to help you priorize your efforts taking into account those expectations.
By casting our vote to the attached poll, we member of your community, kindly ask you to take actions on the mentionned topic, because it is either blocking us in game, annoying to such a respect that we could think about leaving the game, or so disapointing that again we could think about leaving the game.
Please note as well that we, your community, are sadly missing any information regarding the status of those issues, and that we would deeply appreciate of you would be so kind as to let us know, from time to time, where you stand in your efforts at making the game better, because we are aware you are working hard on it, but unfortunetly we don't hear much about it ...
Finally, please note this is not a "whish list" poll, but a "must have" poll.
The members of the community casting the vote to this poll consider the following topic(s) as the minimum necessary to continue playing the game.
We thank you very much for your interest, and hope we hear from you soon.
well, your so f*cking right but as you are a long time member you should also know that it is KK's usual behavior...
btw. i vote for ceres :P
Even though it says my join date is recent, I've been playing since January '03. I've understand what your saying, and agree with a lot of it. We've all put up with various bugs, and god know what else 'cause this game (imo that is), is actually damn good.
But, I have to agree with your letter is trying to do, it IS about time that the bugs/memory leaks/etc were sorted
Chiefy
wheres the news in here ?
anyone really think KK is ignorin' the problems u listed here ?
Chief this game is far from being good, it is UNIQUE (in its combination of fps and rpg) because all other rpg's are point&click what makes them no choice for me and when KK lose's this adv. to an other game, which is maybe being developed right now, they will have nothing, just a wrecked peace of bytes :P
I vote for drohnes, cause thats tho only one people who are compleate unable to play the game while paying for it. (special at 1 slot server)
but i miss some options:
- work at you infopolitics
- work at your customer services
- give the community employee/stuff time to do his job
- fill up your team to be able to act
- give us back the alternative to change our charname like in nc1 (not every week but 1 time per account or 1 time in a year or one time per char/slot or so)
- give us a chance to understand why u handle the customers/community like u do :(
Sorry if my english is not perfect
I cant support this type of pool cause when someone make 11 patch in a week you cant say he ignore your asking.
I suffer for the drones bug like every drone people but it give me chance to play with my second slot and discover other think
This is a game and not social live so its not the end of word if you must spend few day out of the game waiting for the correctif patch.
I'm working and if every people make a fuss like you in the real live when something have problem, never electronics, computoring, car, plane and the like would have been construct!
KK have to gain money to pay to make patch and cant have a beta run for 3-4 years before release it. If you whant perfect world (like in brave new world) stop playing with computer game and act in real live
So kiss to everybody and enjoy one of the best online game without became [censured]
:angel:
nobody2004
12-10-04, 13:23
I vote for drohnes, cause thats tho only one people who are compleate unable to play the game while paying for it. (special at 1 slot server)
but i miss some options:
- work at you infopolitics
- work at your customer services
- give the community employee/stuff time to do his job
- fill up your team to be able to act
- give us back the alternative to change our charname like in nc1 (not every week but 1 time per account or 1 time in a year or one time per char/slot or so)
- give us a chance to understand why u handle the customers/community like u do :(
Agreed :)
Two reasons for this:
1. I wanted to limit the poll to "major" issues (ok, you'd tell me, but who am I to decide which ones ARE major :D), that's where we come to reason
2. I thought I'd be allowed to ADD options to the poll on the go, but it's technically not feasible :(
Sorry for that.
nobody2004
12-10-04, 13:25
Sorry if my english is not perfect
I cant support this type of pool cause when someone make 11 patch in a week you cant say he ignore your asking.
I suffer for the drones bug like every drone people but it give me chance to play with my second slot and discover other think
This is a game and not social live so its not the end of word if you must spend few day out of the game waiting for the correctif patch.
I'm working and if every people make a fuss like you in the real live when something have problem, never electronics, computoring, car, plane and the like would have been construct!
KK have to gain money to pay to make patch and cant have a beta run for 3-4 years before release it. If you whant perfect world (like in brave new world) stop playing with computer game and act in real live
So kiss to everybody and enjoy one of the best online game without became [censured]
:angel:
T'as rien compris Jorille :eek:
Mais c'est pas grave, t'es mignonne quand męme :D
Sorry if my english is not perfect
I cant support this type of pool cause when someone make 11 patch in a week you cant say he ignore your asking.
I suffer for the drones bug like every drone people but it give me chance to play with my second slot and discover other think
This is a game and not social live so its not the end of word if you must spend few day out of the game waiting for the correctif patch.
I'm working and if every people make a fuss like you in the real live when something have problem, never electronics, computoring, car, plane and the like would have been construct!
KK have to gain money to pay to make patch and cant have a beta run for 3-4 years before release it. If you whant perfect world (like in brave new world) stop playing with computer game and act in real live
So kiss to everybody and enjoy one of the best online game without became [censured]
:angel:
lol in my line of work if i released a system a buggy as NC2 or even NC1 for that matter i would be given a day or so to fix and would then be fired.
sorry but there are still issues in this so called NC2 that where arround in the beta in NC1.
many people have said for a long time now that all NC1 players where paying beta testers for NC2:BDoY seems they where wrong, we where actually paying beta testers for NC3, so are all you new people :confused:
I used to try and protect KK like you are now, but after seeing NC destroyed over the past few years i gave up, KK have had enough time to fix alot of things, and it seems that 10tacel joing with them hasnt changed top much.
Duncan Conroy
12-10-04, 13:41
*signs the letter*
my biggest problem: can't count the number of bugs, but there are many of them since nc1 retail -> DRONES!
KK are taking action on all the above topics. We've seen recently by sheer number of patches and fixes how much work they're putting in. Regardless of my opinions on whether or not KK should have held off releasing NC2 for longer, it is here now and KK are working extremely hard on it.
They will have an internal bug tracking system and will be prioritising bugs using a range of indicators along the lines of exploits, show-stoppers we know how to fix, show-stoppers that we think can be fixed quickly, etc.
I do not support the open letter because I trust KK to do the best job they can.
Athon Solo
I personally think the most important issues for the moment (That's from my point of view,which is a point of view which rarely has synchs or FREs), are possibly the new drone bug, and the crazy damage the mobs do in Hacknet.
If those were fixed, I'd be quite happy.
nobody2004
12-10-04, 13:54
Thread moved.
N
lol N, that's not fair !
And what about the german community now ?!?
Ok, I'll go and post a thread in german then ... :(
I the crazy damage the mobs do in Hacknet.
go stand befor a 60/60 mob in the wastes with no imps/armor/resis and you will find the hacknet damage is normal ;) we just need more hacknet only items. and for imps to work in hacknet
go stand befor a 60/60 mob in the wastes with no imps/armor/resis and you will find the hacknet damage is normal ;) we just need more hacknet only items. and for imps to work in hacknet
The 60/60 ones aren't bad, but if I have the highest level defensive software running I should not get killed by a two or three 20/20 mobs should I?
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 14:01
click 2 pay...
without it there will be no playerbase increase, and all bug fixes will still leave the game shitty.
#1 C2P
#2 item tracking
#3 mem leak
#4 drones
#5 player shops (yes number 5... its just not as show stopping as things like drones not waorking at all
then whatever bugs they find to fix
nobody2004
12-10-04, 14:04
click 2 pay...
without it there will be no playerbase increase, and all bug fixes will still leave the game shitty.
#1 C2P
#2 item tracking
#3 mem leak
#4 drones
#5 player shops (yes number 5... its just not as show stopping as things like drones not waorking at all
then whatever bugs they find to fix
Agreed as regard to clicktopray.
I didn't mention it because it is not game related (so there's nothing DEV's can do about it), but I agree that if they want to keep some player, they have to fix the click issue ...
The 60/60 ones aren't bad, but if I have the highest level defensive software running I should not get killed by a two or three 20/20 mobs should I?
=not tried the 20/20 yet but with 102 base hacking i can easily take out upto 6 60/60's more than 6 and have to run =)
KK are taking action on all the above topics. We've seen recently by sheer number of patches and fixes how much work they're putting in. Regardless of my opinions on whether or not KK should have held off releasing NC2 for longer, it is here now and KK are working extremely hard on it.
They will have an internal bug tracking system and will be prioritising bugs using a range of indicators along the lines of exploits, show-stoppers we know how to fix, show-stoppers that we think can be fixed quickly, etc.
I do not support the open letter because I trust KK to do the best job they can.
Athon Solo
I agree with you Athon, but, a lot of these bugs have been around for a while. Do you honestly think the game should have been released in this state?
Saying that, KK have done, and are still doing a damn good job, and I'll be playing for while still to come.
Chiefy
nobody2004
12-10-04, 14:44
Quote:
Originally Posted by athon
KK are taking action on all the above topics. We've seen recently by sheer number of patches and fixes how much work they're putting in. Regardless of my opinions on whether or not KK should have held off releasing NC2 for longer, it is here now and KK are working extremely hard on it.
They will have an internal bug tracking system and will be prioritising bugs using a range of indicators along the lines of exploits, show-stoppers we know how to fix, show-stoppers that we think can be fixed quickly, etc.
I do not support the open letter because I trust KK to do the best job they can.
Athon Solo
I agree with you Athon, but, a lot of these bugs have been around for a while. Do you honestly think the game should have been released in this state?
Saying that, KK have done, and are still doing a damn good job, and I'll be playing for while still to come.
Chiefy
I agree with you Athon, but, a lot of these bugs have been around for a while. Do you honestly think the game should have been released in this state?
Saying that, KK have done, and are still doing a damn good job, and I'll be playing for while still to come.
Chiefy
I DO KNOW KK IS ACTING, and my open letter is not about "bashing" KK I though I had made that clear.
My open letter is about helping them make the right priority choices so the community sees the progress made.
My open letter is also about, once more, asking them to talk to us and take our opinion in account.
Finally, my open letter is also about letting them know that there ARE players/customers who are NOT enjoying to play under the current conditions !
This is not to say that I AM HAPPY of this.
I wish no more but to be able to post a thread stating "Thanks KK, you've (finally) reached the state where the game is playable again. Congratulations for the good work !".
But I think it's worth having them know THIS IS NOT YET THE CASE, as per 83 customers/players vote so far, representing 90% of all votes indicating there ARE players considering the game NOT playable/enjoyable at present !
If if they still don't act/react, then so be it !
At least we have tried ...
FrontenStuermer
12-10-04, 14:46
Hi english community,
i translated the open letter for the german community and hope this poll will take effekt on KK to handle with this errors...
Because i think Neocron 2 should be selled as a Error Packet made by KK :D
nobody2004
12-10-04, 14:50
Hi english community,
i translated the open letter for the german community and hope this poll will take effekt on KK to handle with this errors...
Because i think Neocron 2 should be selled as a Error Packet made by KK :D
Thanks Front for the effort of translating it in german, but I must disagree with your statement.
The letter is NOT about "bashing" KK, and I disagree with what ever statement supporting that.
And I uderstand your statement is likely just of an "overreacting" statement :D :D :D
Me votes for Drohner,not easy this Poll..all importend Stuff,but thinks thats the most importend Bug he need fixed by KK!!!
Epic,memleak we can do it later,but Drohner cant play atm...thats very very crap.
regards wintah
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 15:52
Me votes for Drohner,not easy this Poll..all importend Stuff,but thinks thats the most importend Bug he need fixed by KK!!!
Epic,memleak we can do it later,but Drohner cant play atm...thats very very crap.
regards wintah
item tracking and C2P > drone bugs
and btw i am a *** ranked droner so im not bias against them
Ozambabbaz
12-10-04, 16:03
a wise order of approach would be
1: Memory leaks
2: stability
3: improve engine
4: 1 and 2 again
5: fix faulty skills/mechanics
6: class balance
7: establish content like epics, WoC etc
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 16:05
a wise order of approach would be
1: Memory leaks
2: stability
3: improve engine
4: 1 and 2 again
5: fix faulty skills/mechanics
6: class balance
7: establish content like epics, WoC etc
you think neither click2pay or item tracking should be a priority?
and you class WAY too much above the fact that the entire droner class in not usable...
Ozambabbaz
12-10-04, 16:07
c2p has nothing to do with the game persay, on that note however paybycash should be an option soon(tm) as per Jorgs post in the c2p thread
and yes, totally sucks to have all those droning malfunctions, but at least they *can* be used, and are quite up there in PvP dmg-wise even against PPUs
edit: item tracking, i dunno, cool feature, would prevent some minimum cheating but reworking class balance should be more of an priority indeed.
and the game engine speaks for itself
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 16:12
c2p has nothing to do with the game persay, on that note however paybycash should be an option soon(tm) as per Jorgs post in the c2p thread
and yes, totally sucks to have all those droning malfunctions, but at least they *can* be used, and are quite up there in PvP dmg-wise even against PPUs
edit: item tracking, i dunno, cool feature, would prevent some minimum cheating but reworking class balance should be more of an priority indeed.
and the game engine speaks for itself
c2p has nothing to do with the game... except the entire playerbase.
if no one can pay for the game, no one can play it. i dont want to play an empty game, do you?
item tracking is vital to stop any cloning etc, but also to track any lost items (KK can finaly compensate us for items that disappear in bugs)
drones are usable?
roll a droner right now. please. i want you to play a droner for a single hour and come back and honestly repeat that. as a noob leveling you lose more money on bugged / disappearing drones (note: not destroyed drones) than you can earn by droning.
as a capped char theres nothing more annoying than 10 weapons breaking and disappearing withing a space of an hour. how much did they cost? did you earn enough to cover them? fuck no
nobody2004
12-10-04, 16:43
Me votes for Drohner,not easy this Poll..all importend Stuff,but thinks thats the most importend Bug he need fixed by KK!!!
Epic,memleak we can do it later,but Drohner cant play atm...thats very very crap.
regards wintah
Thanks !!!
(I'm a droner myself :D ).
I was about to post a multiple choice poll, because I too think there are more than 1 options one should be able to cast his vote on.
I decided NOT to, in order to get a result as to how many people support the present open letter (which a multiple option poll would have biaised).
I chose not to as well, so potential DEV's reading this poll would get a clear indication as to WHAT should they concentrate on, case they decided to listen to their community/customer reasonable requests.
I, personnaly, don't think mem leak/FRE's are the most blocking aspect presently, allthough I DO THINK this is something which needs to be fixed ASAP.
I personnaly would like EPIC's, drones and Ceres fixed in that order, as these are presently the most blocking issues IMHO.
If the result of this poll would be that, listening to it's cummunity, KK would shift away resources from EPIC and/or drone fixing, to put it on the mem leak/FRE issue, I would welcome this decision, allthough it would hurt me personnaly, as a wise decision to please it's community.
And yes, such a decision would have me STAY in the game.
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 17:07
item trackijng...
I have no droner char..
but I voted for droners..
because to be quite frankly I donīt think itīs fair that anything getīs corrected whilst they are unable to do anything, because their only way of playing is only working a tiny fraction of the time..
fix the droners, then the epics, then the ceres, and then you can go on with whatever it was you werenīt fixing..
i voted for ceres, because im not a droner, and never have memory leaks because of my 1 GB ram i think.
but i know these 2 things are very imporant, too. omne friend is droner, and hates the game atm, he only can play with his second account... and some other have memory problems...
MfG
aatc
Hmm Droner Bug ... All other can play only droners are really Fucked Up 4 the moment !!!
nobody2004
12-10-04, 17:56
Hmm Droner Bug ... All other can play only droners are really Fucked Up 4 the moment !!!
Agreed.
As well as are newbies with EPICS :(
PS: Rate the thread if you find it worthfull ...
we need a "multiple select" pool ... :p
i couln't only select one answer while i could have checked at least 3 :)
As my french friend, my english is very medium.
It's right that NC has many problems and a "real communication way" will be the welcoming.
My avatar is capped but i voted for epic's that i think that is important to be Master. lol
And more for started the ceres skill we must be master.
FRE's / Memory leak / ...
Please...
It's funny, since I started playing NC2, I haven't had one FRE, but I do see instances of memory leaks.
However, I voted for Epic bug fixing ASAP as a top priority.
It's one thing KK wiped all the Epic items, but now we can't even get them back even if we wanted to is a kick in the nuts.
Hopefully the next patch corrects all the Epic problems.
nobody2004
13-10-04, 12:02
Dear KK,
226 players/customers wrote you an open letter, indicating that they were NOT satisfied by both the current game's playability and the (lack of) communication.
This is NOT a threat, but we now would like some kind of feedback from you as to whether or not you are willing to take our opinion in account.
So let us ask you some questions, we kindly as you to take the time to answer:
Does our opinion matter ?
If yes, are you willing to take into account our (reasonable) requests ?
If yes, do you consider the present open letter as a reasonable request ?
If yes, are you willing to take into account it's result (nearly 50% of the signees ask you to concentrate your efforts on FRE/mem leak, and then to concentrate the remaining of your efforts on Drones, EPIC, Ceres fixing in this order) ?
If yes, could you please give us a status on where you stand in the process of correcting above mentionned topics ?
If you do consider that the present open letter helps you decide which topics to concentrate your efforts on, may I kindly suggest YOU run such a poll from time to time, giving us the opportunity to participate by making sure our most important needs are taken into account ?
If you don't consider this letter helpfull, would you please be so kind as to explain us why ?
I let the community decide for themself, but personnally, I will interpret your answer to the present open letter (or lack there of) as a clear indication of the way you consider us players/customers.
Yours sincerely,
bobleponge
13-10-04, 12:12
Droner fix please, this class its no playable !!! :mad:
226 players/customers wrote you an open letter,They don't care. Letters like this are like Bart and Lisa asking, "Are we there yet?" every five minutes.
I voted for Epics, as that's something I think a certain unpaid support member can fix and hand off to KK to patch without much dev work, but I could be wrong.
Runners who did not vote for droners donīt know the tonns of dronerbugs and never were a droner before.
After 2 years of retail: Fix the dronerbugs, please!!!
Imho a droner ist not playable atm.
Some people are new her.
Some people choosed the droner.
For these people NC2 is not playable and if they tell that to other people a lot of people will know neocron2.
Ok only the bugs so they never want to play it.
And they will tell it to other peopole.
So why it was never solved in the past 2 years KK?
PS: Last week my LE new droner lost SL at MB. Thanks for nothing :wtf:
nobody2004
13-10-04, 12:42
They don't care. Letters like this are like Bart and Lisa asking, "Are we there yet?" every five minutes.
I voted for Epics, as that's something I think a certain unpaid support member can fix and hand off to KK to patch without much dev work, but I could be wrong.
Please, stop flaming !
Wait and see.
If there's no answer, you'll make your mind.
If they answer, please try to act accordingly, and give KK a chance for a new start in its customer relationship management.
nobody2004
13-10-04, 12:45
Runners who did not vote for droners donīt know the tonns of dronerbugs and never were a droner before.
After 2 years of retail: Fix the dronerbugs, please!!!
Imho a droner ist not playable atm.
Some people are new her.
Some people choosed the droner.
For these people NC2 is not playable and if they tell that to other people a lot of people will know neocron2.
Ok only the bugs so they never want to play it.
And they will tell it to other peopole.
So why it was never solved in the past 2 years KK?
PS: Last week my LE new droner lost SL at MB. Thanks for nothing :wtf:
I too regret drones didn't get the most votes :( :( :(
But I respect the poll's outcome (hey, that's what polls are about, no ? :D )
Drones should get next on the list (given the polls result).
And I agree, drones not getting more votes is probably largely due to the fact non droners just don't understand how bad it is at present :(
PS: Don't forget to rate this thread ...
Please, stop flaming !I'm not flaming, I'm pointing out that begging for fixes is akin to being a little kid asking, "Are we there yet?".
If they answer, please try to act accordingly, and give KK a chance for a new start in its customer relationship management.They already told you what they're fixing first. Why would they reply to a poll like this?
nobody2004
14-10-04, 15:32
Well, thanks for your answer KK, at least it's clear :)
Don't worry, I will not bother you again.
I got the point.
Previously, when I heard players just pretend it was not worth trying to talk to you, because you wouldn't answer/take our opinion into account anyway, I though they were flaming, and I was convinced that if we'd talk to you in a constructive way, you would listen to our opinion.
Well, either I wasn't constructive enough, or I was just wrong at the first place. :)
Many thanks to the community for having participated.
At least we tried ...
Well let's look at your issues:
EPICs - fixes were applied yesterday and more are on the way
Ceres - this was fixed yesterday
Drones - KK have made a statement about this also yesterday
FRE's / Memory leak / ... - FRE's are already vastly reduced in NC2. Memory usage has been improved in the patch yesterday.
Your nose (and ego) is just bent out of joint because no one posted on your particular thread, but all of the issues you have described have been or are being addressed.
N
nobody2004
14-10-04, 16:23
Well let's look at your issues:
EPICs - fixes were applied yesterday and more are on the way
Ceres - this was fixed yesterday
Drones - KK have made a statement about this also yesterday
FRE's / Memory leak / ... - FRE's are already vastly reduced in NC2. Memory usage has been improved in the patch yesterday.
Your nose (and ego) is just bent out of joint because no one posted on your particular thread, but all of the issues you have described have been or are being addressed.
N
Thanks N for taking the time to answer.
EPICs: NEXT is still bugued, as are other EPICs (have a look at the bug reports re: EPICs) but I'm happy if other issues have been corrected.
Ceres: can't check myself, because I can't finish my EPIC, but I'm happy if this has been corrected.
Drones: I'm happy KK made a statement telling "it's not last on their list", and I definitly hope something will be done for droners, rather soon than late because WE'RE stuck !
FRE's/Memory leak: I'm happy some of it got corrected. I personnaly still noticed both FRE's and memory leaks unfortunetly, but I understand this is a complex issue, and will have to be corrected step by step over time.
I don't think the patch released yesterday was an "answer" to this post, was it ?
(I hope not, because it was not this thread's intent to "get a patch", but you may not have understood that).
I considered it was released on a previously (to this thread's creation) mentionned (by yourself) schedule, am I wrong ?
And yes, I consider it a positive step in the right direction.
But the present open letter wasn't about "complaining about KK not doing anything", but you didn't get this either did you ?
I hoped that by concentrating it's efforts on truly blocking issues (so called "show stoper") KK could greatly improve the game's playability (and as a result, the players satisfaction) with maybe even less resources than they're currently allocating (that's what's called "prioritizing"), and I decided to turn to the community to tell WHAT was most blocking for them.
But obviously, all I achieved is nerve you, and some others, to (nearly) no result (who knows, maybe someone at KK still found it usefull to know what it's community is mainly looking for ...).
So be it.
As I said, I got the point.
And it is not worth the time I spent on this.
So SORRY for having raised known issues to your attention, and rest assured, I will not bother you again.
As to your personal remark, I will not answer it, but to say that your disapointing me more and more Nid :(
I'd like to see the memory leak fixed first.
But what i really want, is MORE INFORMATION. Whats going on? What are you working on? Whats the #1 priority atm? Whens the next patch? TELL US KK!
Let's look at the two action items you made in your opening post:
This open letter intent is to attract your attention to the community's reasonable expectations and to help you priorize your efforts taking into account those expectations.Unfortunately the letter was not really required as all of the points you have mentioned are known issues and are currently under investigation. Many of those issues were already in the process of resolution before this thread was posted. The second action item was:
Please note as well that we, your community, are sadly missing any information regarding the status of those issues, and that we would deeply appreciate of you would be so kind as to let us know, from time to time, where you stand in your efforts at making the game better, because we are aware you are working hard on it, but unfortunetly we don't hear much about it ...Communication in this area could definitely be improved but KK are make a convincing point by addressing it through regular patches. Both KK and the QA team contribute to discussions on the forums (as do I) and, as I mentioned in my last post, many of the issues described here are in the process of being fixed or have already been resolved.
If you feel that your points have not been addressed sufficiently then you should re-state them more clearly rather than posting a negative, fatalistic response that is not deserved.
N
Drones - KK have made a statement about this also yesterday
Ahh crap, how'd I miss that. Don't suppose I could have a link could I please Mr Nidhogg sir? *bows*
Jesterthegreat
14-10-04, 17:13
Both KK and the QA team contribute to discussions on the forums (as do I)
you do, although you tend to get abuse for it :p
Lupus does (he represent QA right?)
KK... well... there is occasionally a post from KK. and it tends to not be on the important issues. MJS posted on the C2P thread about trying to get a C2P person on the forums to talk to us. this is an example of when KK do come and talk to us on what is needed, however the majority of KK's posts is on things that amuse them (such as joking about my age, i have no problem with that, but i would prefer they answered real questions too).
Ahh crap, how'd I miss that. Don't suppose I could have a link could I please Mr Nidhogg sir? *bows*
There have been a couple of statements. Please use the search facilty to locate them.
N
nobody2004
14-10-04, 18:20
Let's look at the two action items you made in your opening post:
--- *** ---
Quote:
This open letter intent is to attract your attention to the community's reasonable expectations and to help you priorize your efforts taking into account those expectations.
--- *** ---
Unfortunately the letter was not really required as all of the points you have mentioned are known issues and are currently under investigation. Many of those issues were already in the process of resolution before this thread was posted. The second action item was:
--- *** ---
Quote:
Please note as well that we, your community, are sadly missing any information regarding the status of those issues, and that we would deeply appreciate of you would be so kind as to let us know, from time to time, where you stand in your efforts at making the game better, because we are aware you are working hard on it, but unfortunetly we don't hear much about it ...
--- *** ---
Communication in this area could definitely be improved but KK are make a convincing point by addressing it through regular patches. Both KK and the QA team contribute to discussions on the forums (as do I) and, as I mentioned in my last post, many of the issues described here are in the process of being fixed or have already been resolved.
If you feel that your points have not been addressed sufficiently then you should re-state them more clearly rather than posting a negative, fatalistic response that is not deserved.
N
First, thanks for again taking the time to answer.
Again, I do not consider the patch issued yesterday as an answer to the present thread (if I'm wrong, please correct me).
So I consider the present letter "unanswered", at least to the point where you jumped in.
I, personnaly, consider that an open letter signed by 276 players/customers is worth an answer, even if you'd consider it totally out of scope (but we'll come back to this).
So yes, I was disapointed to see neither KK nor one of the MODs found it usefull to jump it and give their opinion.
Ever heard the community complain about lack of interaction with KK (or did I just invent it) ?
What the hell shall we do if even a respectfull open letter is not worth an answer ?
Shut up ?
Ok. So be it.
I, personnaly, now understand KK is NOT interested in my opinion, nor my efforts, to try (but maybe not achieve) solve some BLOCKING aspects of the games playability, in order to restore (at least) the same playability as was available in NC1.
Ok, so be it.
This is not to say that they are not concerned by the topics, but probably (I can just guess here) that they better know themself what to do, and in which order, to please the community (because I assume they want to please their community, and not just nerf us).
What you don't (want to) understand is: I don't NEED to do what I did with this open letter.
Had it be usefull, I would have been happy.
As it obviously wasn't, so be it.
You noticed that the topics I listed are the same that KK informed us they are working on.
I'm happy you (at least) aknowledge that as far as the chosen topics, they aren't too much out of scope.
But the point wasn't about the topics themself !
You may have noticed that I read quiet some threads on the forums, so I KNOW KK is spending time on it. I even stated it in my open letter !
The open letter was about "Prioritizing".
Lemme give the definition of the word as given by my dictionnary (this is not intend to be "rude", I know you probably better understand what this word stands for, this is just to give what's called a "common ground" as to it's definition):
"to list or rate (as projects or goals) in order of priority"
This was the letter's intent.
So what you'd tell me ?
Well my point was that IF KK would be so kind as to focus on the community's priorities, they would/could please us with very little efforts.
(That's what's called being "customer oriented").
So what did the open letter poll tell us in terms of priority ?
No 1 by far: FRE/Mem leak
This has been worked on, and is still been worked on.
Great ! Good move !
(By the way, I was, and still am, convinced that KK did not allocate resources on this topic because of the present letter, but just because they very well know it's a high priority issue ...).
Then to number 2 (as per the poll): Drones
Was something done in this patch for drones ?
No.
Was something done in the previous patch(s) ?
No.
Has somemething being done in the last 6 month for them ?
Yes.
Previously we lost a drone from time to time.
Now we loose our drones every 3-4 shots.
Previously we owned a high tech level drone called "Punisher" very good at XP, now it's a "Faction item", impossible to find ingame.
(I've lost the 2 Punishers I had transfered from NC1 due to the above mentionned bug. I was very kindly offered a 10k/each compensation.)
I could add quiet some more to this, but it's not about MY feeling, and I think (hopefully) you got the point.
Droners are STUCK.
Then to the third item on the list: EPIC's
At least NEXT (and some other) EPICs still don't work.
I definitly think it would be worth spending ALL TIME required to fix it.
Remember we've been taken all our EPIC items ?
If you'd play, wouldn't you expect to, at least, be allowed to get them back by completing the EPIC's again ?
And if you NEED an EPIC (like the moveon in my case) wouldn't you regret that 2 weeks after the official game launch, and month after the initial beta start, EPIC's still don't work ?
(Before someone flames me, I know BT EPIC is doable.
Unfortunetly, I'm stuck in the middle of the NEXT, and I can't even cancel it ...).
Then to the 4th item on the list: Ceres
I'm personnally very happy Ceres have been fixed, allthough it represents less than 10% of the community's concern.
So let's make a little analysis here.
FRE/Mem leak correction is well on it's way, so the nearly 50% players/customers mainly concerned by that topic should be happy (I personnaly consider it playable for some time now, but I may not face some problems faced by other community members, hence the poll).
The 21 % community members concerned by drone issues have no reason to be happier than before, because nothing has been done for them.
Unfortunetly, they're the ones who are STUCK (sorry to insist on this word, but it's not about facing some problems, it's about not being able to PLAY as a droner today).
Part of the 17% of the community members concerned by EPIC's might be pleased today.
I can't tell, because NOTHING has been released as to what exactly HAS been corrected, I can't even guess. I know for sure that those involved in the NEXT EPIC are still STUCK.
And finally, 9.12% should be happy, because you inform us Ceres are (totally) fixed. As mentionned, I can't verify as I can't start my Ceres because I'm stuck at the NEXT epic).
So let's say half the EPICs have been corrected it means the last patch pleased 9 + (17/2) ~= 18% of your community (I'm not sure this is correct, because my guess is that still as many players are stuck as before, so the satisfaction has probably not changed here, and so less than 10% members have been pleased here, but that's just my guess, and I stand corrected if wrong) (not to mention FRE/mem leak).
Had you concentrated on the topics on top of the open letter list (Drone + EPIC), you could have pleased (21 + 17) up to 38% of your community (not to mention FRE/mem leak).
See a difference here ?
Get the point ?
But again, sorry if I waste you time.
-=BlackBeard=-
14-10-04, 19:01
totally agree matey *****
Jesterthegreat
15-10-04, 13:37
Nobody - the majority of the time i think KK is actually working on the major bugs that we want fixed. however KK do have a lack of communication.
KK have risen in my books of late (of course they would have had trouble sinking anymore :p) and im seeing improvement.
now if they can start fulfilling broken / delayed promises that would be another step in the right direction
nobody2004
18-10-04, 20:19
DISCLAIMER:
This thread intent is not to hurt anyone's personal feelings, nor to "bash" KK.
It is aimed at trying to help KK make the game better, and help KK interact with it's community.
--- *** ---
I would like to thank Lupus (and his team) for having made it possible for us to complete the EPIC's.
The temporary solution he decided to apply clearly shows a "customer oriented" focus.
I would like to thank him as well for having shown interation IS possible with us: http://forum.neocron.com/showthread.php?t=116440&page=1&pp=15
Now back to the present open letter.
It is my understanding, that all concerns BUT Drones have been adressed.
(My understanding is that EPICs, Ceres, FRE/Mem leaks have all reached a level where they're playable now. Please correct me if YOU still face blocking problems in those areas).
Drones represented the main concern for 22% of the 293 open letter signee, showing up as main concern directly after the obvious FRE/Mem leak.
Would it please be possible, in the same mood and with the same good will as shown recently, to give us a status concerning DRONES ?
The most recent "status" we have concerning drones, is the following:
--- *** ---
"Well as to drones, there are several bugs that need tending, some have to do with drones directly, others are to be found somewhere completely else.
They are not on the back of our todo lists."
__________________
Jorg "Iorghe" Floren
Neocron Development Team
--- *** ---
http://forum.neocron.com/showthread...ht=drones+patch
Where we undertand from the statement it obviously is not an easy task, we would like some informations as for the steps taken to correct it AND some time frame.
If the drones can't be corrected in some reasonable time frame, would you be willing to give us a skill point release, allowing us droners to, at least, continue to play an other char type ?
Also, you probably are aware the topics mentionned in the present open letter were just the most blocking ones.
Would you be so kind as to indicate us how you intend to make sure our concerns will be taken into account in the future.
We thank you in advance, and hope to hear from you soon.
--- *** ---
Have supported the present open letter: Voters: 293
Voter main concern are:
EPICs 49 16.72%
Ceres 26 8.87%
Drones 65 22.18%
FRE's / Memory leak / ... 131 44.71%
I don't have any problem / I'm happy with the game in it's present state 13 4.44%
I don't support the present open letter 9 3.07%
Jesterthegreat
19-10-04, 01:49
bump just to say what you have already said?
if they have fixed the other things to your satisfaction, and have recognised drones as a priority, you dont really need to bump a 4 day old thread about it...
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