View Full Version : Roleplay in Neocron.
/Note - Please don't move this to the Roleplay forum, Mods. I know it's to do with Roleplay, but it isn't written In Character so I don't think it suits that forum.
Bad language (For me, anyway) and incoherent rant dead ahead. If you don't want to be subjected to that sort of thing, don't bother reading through this thread.
Anyway.
As I sit here waiting for Scikar to get his arse on MSN, and looking for a decent European-based Enemy Territory server (Which doesn't kick Modem users because they had the audacity to...[gasp]...go above 80ms with their ping), I decided to write this little guide to Roleplay. It's bitchy, elitist, biased and I'm sure as hell not going to waste time defending it against those of you who don't care about the subject. But, quite frankly, I don't give a toss what people think of all that. If you can happily flame Reakktor under the guise of "concern" then I can quite happily flame non-Roleplayers under the guise of wanting to help them.
Roleplay is pretty much dead in Neocron, and what's left is mostly a pile of inconsistent, wobbly crap. So without further ado....
1.) There IS a part of you inside ANY character you Roleplay. Don't try and argue otherwise. From that effluent streaked Ghoul I played in Fallout PnP, to the paper-work obsessed bureaucrat I have in Neocron, they're all products of my mind and personality. That "psycho killer" you play isn't part of you?
Bullshit.
You came up with the concept, you are playing him and you have breathed life into the guy. There ARE parts of you inside him, how else could you have come up with the concept? Even if you "got the idea" from someone else, it's still YOU playing him and it's still YOU developing his personality using your own experience to help. That, dear Sir, is putting a little bit of yourself in the character.
If there wasn't anything of you in him, you wouldn't have even come up with him.
2.) Be consistent, otherwise don't hide behind storyline and canon. If you keep flicking between In and Out Of Character "modes" when it suits you, you have NO right whatsoever to hide behind established canon when it's in your favour. If you honestly think that using "it's a dark, Cyberpunk world!!" without reinforcing that through In Character actions, you can fuck right off.
No, it's not a "dark and Cyberpunk" world if you're not a Roleplayer. Simple as that. It's a computer game set in a "dark and Cyberpunk" world. Roleplayers breath life into that setting, give volumes of depth to the history and character of the world.
What do the majority of the non-Roleplayers do? Piss about pretending to be anti-social Anarchists (Or other bullshit archetype) when it suits them, only to immediatly run back into the safety of "it's just a game" when they can't handle the repercussions.
As I said above: If you're not consistent in your actions, bugger off and don't even think about calling yourself a Roleplayer.
3.) Not all Player Killers are arseholes, not all illiterate flamers on a forum are morons and not all Roleplayers only Roleplay tea-drinking people that spend all their time in fucking resturants. If you think that then, dear Sir, you are a moron. Get rid of those damn stereotypes when you Roleplay.
Accept that conflict, death, loss and strife are all part of Roleplay....but only when they're actually Roleplayed through (No "pwned, nib" does NOT count thank you very-fucklymuchly).
You want examples of Roleplay that ISN'T just sitting around and talking? Get the Book of Vile Darkness, get the Book of Exalted Deeds, hell...just look at any Battletech book that's out there. Actually, screw that....get involved in a decent Pen and Paper Roleplay. You will be proven so wrong it would be absolutely hilarious. Random Player Killing without consistancy is not Roleplay, chit-chat in a resturant without consistancy is not Roleplay.
Get. Used. To. It.
4.) I don't care how "dark and dangerous" Neocron's world is. Putting together another "mass murderer" is pathetic, lazy and laughable. If you want to be just another two-dimensional stereotype, then so be it. Just don't be surprised when proper Roleplayers dismiss the concept. Either get your arse into gear and put some effort into giving your character a believable personality, backstory and emotions or don't bother at all.
5.) Go all the way or, frankly piss off. Decent, involving Roleplay requires commitment. If you want to be one of those bullshit "part-time" Roleplayers then go ahead, I won't stop you.
But neither will I waste more time than is neccesary on you.
-------
Anyway, that's all I can really type before the calming music in my MP3 collection kicks in. Running out of steam, flame's dwindling; so just read through and comment, m'kay.
I'll be snacking on some Monster Munch.
now you flame me, allow me to return the favor..
You have no right to come in here and tell everyone to piss off, unless they play by your rules !
A lot of people here have tried Roleplay.. YES REAL ROLEPLAY.. guess what they got for the trouble..
A belt, a backpack and a big FUCK YOU..
You know why roleplaying is hard ?
You know why people are being moronic murderers ?
You know why people are still ingame ?
all these 3 questions go back to 1 single thing...
DEATH
When you roleplay, you are infact capable of dying, if you die, you dont return, you are dead.
You very much return, you lose a few items, mostly nothing that cant be quickly replaced.. and you can quickly get a few implants drilled back into your skull.. big deal, back to the meat grinder.
Again, murdering without any major risk... whatīs to stop them from killing you ?
Whatīs to stop you from killing them ?
If they die.. theyīll just come back..
If you die... youīll just come back..
endless loop, welcome to hell, oh sorry youīre early..
you donīt die till you cancel, and when you cancel you return
You are not 1 person, you are 2-4-8-12-16-20 persons..
So what if you die, you are still the second guy, and the third guy, and the fourth guy and the twentieth guy..
We all are, and so are you..
Donīt come here telling me that every living breathing second that you are ingame, you never leave character even for a second..
If you roleplay you never break character.
And I donīt give a flying fuck who you think you are, but you are not better than anyone else on this forum, not even by an inch.
and last..
Why are people still ingame ??
Because they can die, get killed, slaughtered, murdered again and again and again, and they can still play, because they didnīt lose much when it happened..
SO they canīt make death permanent without losing people all the time, and it wonīt get better the way it is...
Ok ?
Do you understand this post I just wrote..
Until you perfectly understand what I just wrote, I wonīt call you qualified to say "FUCK OFF" to everyone else in the game.
No one has the right to do that, and no one ever will, because we are all people, and no matter who you are, what youīve done, you still have the same rights as anyone else.
Some day.......... it WILL happen to you.
Death is already covered by the game. Not a perfect explanation, but workable.
And to answer your second point: No, no I don't break character. I keep OOC chatter to private messages and on the OOC channel. I don't go changing aspects of my character's personality just to suit me.
Done.
/EDIT - For those who didn't catch on: No, this isn't an attempt to come across as superior. This is my attempt at putting those "part-time" Roleplayers in their cliche ridden, world-forsaking place. If you play the game "as a game", then more power to you.
It's those who only claim to Roleplay that piss me off.
Death is already covered by the game. Not a perfect explanation, but workable.
And to answer your second point: No, no I don't break character. I keep OOC chatter to private messages and on the OOC channel. I don't go changing aspects of my character's personality just to suit me.
Done.
Listen to my words...
You never break character.. on any character for any reason.
ooc is unknown to a roleplayer..
by the help of others i managed for a week or two to do it on 1 char alone.. and even that wasnīt perfect roleplay..
we slept at night, we hunted at day, we took field trips and ate flesh from the dead animals.
we had non le characters in a warzone..
people killed us for the mere pleasure..
have you done that ?
I dont think you even want halfway there..
and I will repeat myself :
How dare you pass judgement on those that donīt do rp, when you donīt even yourself.. beceause I donīt believe you even fully understand the word to roleplay.
And you most certainly canīt roleplay when you donīt understand it.
and death is far from covered by this game..
death is a time sink instead of an end
pardon me Idola...But uhh.....Who gave you the right to judge what "roleplay' is. just because someone doesnt RP 24/7 doesnt mean they arent a RPer. There is RP of different degrees.
I agree with alot of what you said Naimex.
Edit: I have more to say but I'll hold it back till I see it as needed. :)
Richard Slade
12-10-04, 00:37
Naimex speaks for me too in this matter..
Naimex:
Living out in the wild is not the only way to Roleplay (And yes, I have done that actually: Character name Valentina. Soullight was at -100, lived out up at Tescom), and communicating through OOC is neccesary when not everyone Roleplays. It's that simple.
And death is covered; you haven't bothered delving into the canon, it would seem.
BunkerBoy:
Everyone on this forum tries to tell others how to do something. Why should I be any different?
BunkerBoy:
Everyone on this forum tries to tell others how to do something. Why should I be any different?
not everyone does. And if you do the same as those who do try to tell people what to do , doesnt that just mean all your doing is following the crowd and not being an individual and going by your own beliefs?
Dribble Joy
12-10-04, 00:42
Be prepared to get some stick for that.
That did come over as extemely elitist and snobbish in places, no offence.
I for one distinctly don't like RP 'pureists'.
You, I, nor anyone else can tell others how to play thier character or to. what level of depth. It could be seen that saying that you must go all the way with your characters but that they are allways you in some form, is somewhat hypocritical and also attempts to destroy the notion of escapism that people play these games for. Doesn't mean I see it that way though.
Staying in character at all times is also not required, nor advised, many people do and will use NC to discuss RL events/matters/issues and forcing them not to is simply not going to sit well with the population or produce a relaxed atmosphere. Having mods patrol the trade/faction channels sending out warnings will never send any form of positive message.
Yes KK reserve the right to ban you at any time for any 'offence' but banning people for not staying fully in character at all times will not do any good.
For those that 'hide behind' the fact this is a game, that in some cases and to some extent is a valid argument.
It is not clear cut, this IS a game, but people are playing it and opinions and feeling will get inflamed over it and the way others act, but getting overly offened and worked up is noones fault but yours.
Niether can you hide behind RP. As you seem to argue, yet also argue against, you cannot use RP to excuse ganking/'murdering' yet you also also cannot have all RPing to be calm, softly softly 'tea drinking' activities nor assume it to be so.
The key issue here is the dreaded 'B'-word.
Balance.
Everything needs to be taken into perspective.
The place where that point of balance may be to one side or the other, but having it at either end is neither desired or healthy.
Dissect away.
//edit:
One line was just beautiful in it's... awefulness.
don't be surprised when proper Roleplayers dismiss the concept.
Laughable.
Naimex:
Living out in the wild is not the only way to Roleplay (And yes, I have done that actually: Character name Valentina. Soullight was at -100, lived out up at Tescom), and communicating through OOC is neccesary when not everyone Roleplays. It's that simple.
And death is covered; you haven't bothered delving into the canon, it would seem.
let me just show you something...
and communicating through OOC is neccesary when not everyone Roleplays. It's that simple.
see this part ??
you just failed roleplaying 101.
There is no out of character..
you are your character..
you are not max the farmboy that lives in wisconsin and has a pet pig named sue ellen..
you are max the inhabitant of neocron, a cyberpunk world, destroyed by radiation and war.
and the second you even think of becoming max the farmboy, you have failed your roleplay.
And death is covered; you haven't bothered delving into the canon, it would seem.
what canon ??
oh and... uhm.. i think i said it earlier..
death is not covered..
if you can come back to life after getting torn apart by 200 plasma shots, 500 psionic attacks, 1000 clips of uzi and an energybeam through your skull, then death is not covered.
Be prepared to get some stick for that.
That did come over as extemely elitist and snobbish in places, no offence.
I for one distinctly don't like RP 'pureists'.
Welcome to the thread. Now read the first paragraph and you'll understand this is how I knew it would come across. :p
Anyway, I think what you've missed, and what a few others decided to skip over, is that this thread is aimed at the people who only Roleplay when there's something in it for them. As I've also said, go ahead and play the game "as a game", just don't act like an arse then hide behind Roleplay to justify your actions.
Gah, 11:45pm now, off to bed for me. I'll catch up with this thread tommorow morning.
Final one for tonight.
Naimex:
Yes, Roleplay is about assuming a role, but in MMORPGs, using OOC at times is vital when dealing with some people. Hell, you recruited that "clan" of yours through OOC means so you can't claim the higher moral ground on that one.
Secondly, there's plenty of canon there. I won't lead you to it; it's there to be found, and death has already been explained as I've said twice now. Maybe you should read up on the concept of the GeneReplication system some time.
Final one for tonight.
Naimex:
Yes, Roleplay is about assuming a role, but in MMORPGs, using OOC at times is vital when dealing with some people. Hell, you recruited that "clan" of yours through OOC means so you can't claim the higher moral ground on that one.
Secondly, there's plenty of canon there. I won't lead you to it; it's there to be found, and death has already been explained as I've said twice now. Maybe you should read up on the concept of the GeneReplication system some time.
well hello mister smartypants..
read my post again..
i said and even we didnīt roleplay properly..
i opposed to you, never claimed to be a roleplayer.
I claimed that I had attempted.
so please.. stop telling facts about me that is in complete opposition to what i write..
it makes you sound.... desperate.
Maybe you should read up on the concept of the GeneReplication system some time.
ok this is pissing me off.. let me just explain IT TO YOU :
GeneReplicators, when activated they store your dna for later reassembly in the case you are dead..
yet when you go through them, you dont return to the state you were when you last activated it..
meaning that if i had activated it as an 0/2... im not becoming an 0/2 from gring to it... meaning its not working as it should..
its just a time sink..
once again death is less than a booger stuck in your nose..
"I shall walk through the valley of the damned, and death shall have no dominion"
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 01:05
everyone who posts more than a screen worth in 1024 x 768 should post a summery at the bottom for people like me who have been up for about 24 hours without sleep...
so ill randomly guess what the topics about and say "let people RP to whatever level (even down to none) that they want. if kk were to attempt to enforce RP they would have even more people leaving".
greets
At the risk of putting myself in the firing line I thought the original poster summed things up quite nicely
I'd just like to pitch in on one issue though
You know why roleplaying is hard ?
You know why people are being moronic murderers ?
You know why people are still ingame ?
all these 3 questions go back to 1 single thing...
Answer:
Because most people think that NC is Quake/Counterstrike/[insert fave FPS here] with levels and that PvP/PK is the be all and end all of this game (as opposed to it being 'one element' of the game)
Uuuh, the ultra leet pen and paper rolaplayer came, saw and put us in out place. Well, let me tell you here missy, I RP my chars to the extent they need to be. I have two other charates I interact with the people that can't just stand the crap, and I believe all can agree that should be the case.
I play PnP alot, infact I was just playing this weekend, and it was a fun session, to play with friends, face to face, I know my friends and have had alot time to get to know their characters and personalities. If someone just pops out of a bush in NC and says "hail to thou, I will smite ye with my mighty sword" and starts swingin, my first impression is "wow this guy has some issues" so you have to excuse me if I feel uncomfortable to RP with people I don't know what they are like and so on. I RP more with my clan mates, and with faction friends than with random PK in the desert. Roleplaying means interaction, and there is hardly any verbal interacting in a gun fight, sorry if I don't go all middle earth on his ass.
I do it for friends and that is enough.
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 11:08
i play this game solely for the PvP...
show me combat thats based on your skill to setup a char, your skill fighting and your equipment that is comparible to this, but is an FPS not an MMORPG/FPS and i will go play thet. until then ill play this game however i like.
and before anyone gives me shit about me not knowing what an RPG is i have played countless RPG's (both single player and MMO) so dont bother
i play this game solely for the PvP...
show me combat thats based on your skill to setup a char, your skill fighting and your equipment that is comparible to this, but is an FPS not an MMORPG/FPS and i will go play thet. until then ill play this game however i like.
and before anyone gives me shit about me not knowing what an RPG is i have played countless RPG's (both single player and MMO) so dont bother
The agreement is made.
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 11:25
i have played:
PnP RPG's
Fallout
Fallout2
Baldurs gate
Baldurs gate 2
Final fantasy 6 - 11 (including 10-2)
Deus Ex
DAoC (european and US, infact i played on an RP server for a while...)
AO
EQ
UO
NC beta - NC retail (inc NC2 closed beta)
and alot more i cant think of right now... i know how to play a RPG :)
Naimex & Idola....get a room you two :lol:
PS. I feel for Naimex a bit more to be perfectly honest... just for the records.
i prefere to play my role as the guy who runs up behind you pulls CS and ganks you before you know wtf is happening.
followed by me Joy emoting all over your body :D
my style of roleplay rules
THE_TICK!!!!
12-10-04, 12:53
i think the gankers and griefers..add an element of danger and fun that would be lacking without them...yes even THEY have a place in MY game of neocron..i enjoy the game..i mean i REALLY enjoy it...ive missed it terribly while ive been in iraq..its my SPECIAL place if you will.. :) Ill be the first to admit..i know DICK about RP...ive tried it and feel kinda silly doing it..well no..i take that back..i had a GREAT TIME at a gm event when in RONINS...we had to interagate a prisoner..and find out if he was telling the truth..it lasted hours..and was great..but as was said earlier..everyone was rp'n so it didn't feel weird..was great fun...but on average i feel silly tryin to rp..I just try and be me..on screen i guess...niamex..you takin this REALLY hard m8..he is intitled to his opinion as are you...but man...i thought I was agressive :P well folks im not proof reading this ramble..so take what you can get out of it and run with it..see ya later.
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 13:59
let the carebears have fantasy RPG's... this is a dirty mean cyber punk world :p
As TICK said, Im not that good at RP and feel stupid doing it, but I do join in when someone engages in RP with me.
Im also not great at PVP and die quite frequently, but tbh being attacked / attacking someone is what I love about this game (I never have 1 stable charector) there again im from a fps background.
tbh I like being randomly attacked more then I like op wars.
All being said some of the reasons (over dm) why i've been killed are totally fucking stupid and alot of people try to use RP as an excuse.
which I find amusing since I didnt mind dieing so much in the first place o_O
If you dont RP dont lie just say " I killed you because it was fun"
That would be fine by me :)
I agree on this point only, but apart from that dont tell peeps how much they should RP because they dont give a toss about what you think an will kill you if they feel like it, its there NC given right :lol:
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 14:10
damn right... the last thing KK wants to do is enforce RP and lose the majority of the playerbase...
besides, would it be up to the GM's what is considered roleplay?
what if i went on a random PK spree and said someone reprogrammed a implant in my brainm and made me do it? would i get banned or is that RP? in a way it is, but in another way its an excuse.
enforced roleplay = bad
ive missed it terribly while ive been in iraq
You home now ??
if you are, welcome home... you been down there a while..
niamex..you takin this REALLY hard m8..he is intitled to his opinion as are you...but man...i thought I was agressive :P
Yes he is entitled to his opinion, but not when he tells everyone, that doesnīt play the game as he does, to fuck off.
and thatīs the main reason that I enraged a warrior at him.
and also I disagreed on quite some crucial elements of the perception of the game..
not that my perception of it is better than his, but he says it as if there was only 1 way to do it right..
and I might have written my posts saying my way was the only way, but that wasnīt intentional..
but god damn he made me angry.. I was really neutral yesterday, up until this thread...
greendonkeyuk
12-10-04, 15:53
i think the thread starter was tryin to get across the point that in order to have a dark cyberpunk future, we are going to NEED a few roleplayers. I mean now with the safezones removed (well almost) it makes for a much more nervy experience, the potential of city raids at any time, the potential to get blown away by a supposed friend. All this creates political intrigue and subterfuge (sp?). I mean id love to see nc more like that than Blam blam haha pwned! as tbh after a while the smack talk gets dull. Ok his style of writing might be on the aggressive side but tbh if you dont take the aggression personally then i think he has a very valid point.
The rest of you guys should take things less personally. Its just words on a screen man, no need to roast your jets over it. What ever happened to peace and free love?
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 15:55
What ever happened to peace and free love?
the same that seems to be happening to free war and hate :p
Awww it seems you dont like dieing (pulls out his small imaginary violin).How can you justify RP sometimes like who the fuck can RP a real estate agent. OMGZ something you can do in real life kewl maybe a future calling in a job. RP is in game but maybe different from what KK intended .
Ive played Final Fantasy and Zelda and so on ect (pulls a list of rpg's outta his ass). One thing that remained a constant in them games was 1.The Hero 2.The Nemisis 3. The Girl . 1 and 2 are solved in Neocron we will always have our hero's and nemisis's . ATM i could RP Either a battle Hardened tank Fighting for the good of reeza andthe city admin against the evil soldiers of the dome of york or a bad as crahn monk fighting the tyrant that is reeza and the forces of the city.
As i play these roles i play a number of roles in the process, a leader/politician/strategist soldier it goes on . The only thing is sometimes i dont RP in the way the game intends me to but its still fantasy still RP. Example back in NC1 our clan grew so big we controlled the whole map all factions turned against us they felt so strongly to get rid of us we were the skurge of the server the nemisis to all ,our allies inside the faction and out were trying to kill us. Hero's most certainly were made during this fight to bring us down.
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 16:31
Awww it seems you dont like dieing (pulls out his small imaginary violin).How can you justify RP sometimes like who the fuck can RP a real estate agent. OMGZ something you can do in real life kewl maybe a future calling in a job. RP is in game but maybe different from what KK intended . flame
Ive played Final Fantasy and Zelda and so on ect (pulls a list of rpg's outta his ass). One thing that remained a constant in them games was 1.The Hero 2.The Nemisis 3. The Girl . 1 and 2 are solved in Neocron we will always have our hero's and nemisis's . ATM i could RP Either a battle Hardened tank Fighting for the good of reeza andthe city admin against the evil soldiers of the dome of york or a bad as crahn monk fighting the tyrant that is reeza and the forces of the city.
spam
As i play these roles i play a number of roles in the process, a leader/politician/strategist soldier it goes on . The only thing is sometimes i dont RP in the way the game intends me to but its still fantasy still RP. Example back in NC1 our clan grew so big we controlled the whole map all factions turned against us they felt so strongly to get rid of us we were the skurge of the server the nemisis to all ,our allies inside the faction and out were trying to kill us. Hero's most certainly were made during this fight to bring us down.ego
that aint ego, thats the truth ;)
hes a newb from uranus ezza he wouldnt understand all he need know is my CS is bigger than his and being a saturn player im a bigger cunt than him .
Hell-demon
12-10-04, 17:02
Its just a game people can do what the hell they like, and they cant be persuaded otherwise. If they wanna be a mass murdering ass hole then fine let them be a mass murdering ass hole.
And as for constant roleplay, its just oppressive to yourself. Sometimes you just got to act yourself and role play when ever :rolleyes:
hes a newb from uranus ezza he wouldnt understand all he need know is my CS is bigger than his and being a saturn player im a bigger cunt than him .
Thatīs racism boy...
... why donīt you apologize to him, and every other uranian you just insulted..
We donīt go around calling everyone from whatever server youīre from for newbs, and calling them simple minded..
So why do you ??
What is it about you that makes you feel so much above everyone else ??
Cut your chest up, look at your entrails.. Weīre all the same.
No matter who we are, where weīre from, what color our skin has, what server we play on.
So cut the crap please...
and apologize for youre racial discrimination towards the uranians..
I think we deserve it, at the very least.
EDIT : Nice choice of words Jest, but I donīt think it helps the situation...
Jesterthegreat
12-10-04, 17:12
hes a newb from uranus ezza he wouldnt understand all he need know is my CS is bigger than his and being a saturn player im a bigger cunt than him .
i couldnt care less what server your from. i have my opinions aboiut saturn "elietests" but id rather not start another flame war.
whether its true or not its still an ego boosting post. (as is the one im quoting this time, not to mention its 100% bovine excrement)
oh and this "noob from uranus" had at least ** chars on each english server, he was part of at least 3 of the biggest / most influencial clans on the Uranus and is known to the majority of Uranus.
whether you see me as a noob or whether you need to enlarge your E-penis by posting that your better than everyone has nothing to do with this thread. please take it to another forum
:edit:
i have also arranged and hosted both KK sanctioned ingame events (i arranged and lead the first MC5 hunt on Uranus with about 50 people and GM's) and RL events (i arranged and hoted the second UK international neocron gathering). i beta tested NC1, i played since then without quitting, i was in the cloed beta of NC2 and i prolly know more about this game than a hell of alot of the players.
dont give me shit
Redd Harvest
12-10-04, 17:47
And as for constant roleplay, its just oppressive to yourself. Sometimes you just got to act yourself and role play when ever :rolleyes:
Yup, making a specific character that you play daily is like making a rod for your own back. I'm suprised these self-professed true RP'ers don't know this. If you want the opinion of a good RP'er on it, ask almost any pro actor who's been playing the same character every day for a good while and they'll tell you they loathe them as they are restrictive. The ones who don't think that way are probably the ones who have less personality IRL than their characters and so relish every opportunity they get to be them. Now, you can be elitist about that if you really want... 'cos us regular players like a giggle. :D
Yup, making a specific character that you play daily is like making a rod for your own back. I'm suprised these self-professed true RP'ers don't know this.
Perhaps we enjoy the challenge or the added depth it brings - guess you'll never know since youre just one of the 'regular players' :-)
Personally I cant think of anything worse than not imposing 'limits' on my approach to game play - playing a skitzo and having to come up with something different everytime (with the express aim of not doing something I always do) seems much more 'restrictive' to me
You do realise though that we dont play every character the same way dont you (certainly not multiple characters in the same game)
Hell-demon
12-10-04, 18:04
Your not skitzo if your out of character, just shows your a real person and not acting out a fantasy for a better sense of escapism. People who role play constantly might just aswell be one of those NPC's who stand about talking random story stuff. o_O
i have also arranged and hosted both KK sanctioned ingame events (i arranged and lead the first MC5 hunt on Uranus with about 50 people and GM's) and RL events (i arranged and hoted the second UK international neocron gathering). i beta tested NC1, i played since then without quitting, i was in the cloed beta of NC2 and i prolly know more about this game than a hell of alot of the players.
dont give me shit
I dont give a shit what you have done so your a bigger NC nerd than me and you missed what i was saying completly
I wasnt posting that i was better than any one else i was stating some saturn history and what happened . Some of the roles i played at the time just an example of what happened but at the time in said clan i was a soldier the clan afterwards i helped lead .
One of the earliest memorys i had of neocron wasn't organising some stupid next market ( i was next ) but was helping the city mercs fight the elite and very big TG PRO at the time . It was one of the Times i truly RP'd they were my one great nc1 enemy to who there has been no match to this day.
Oh and if you werre in 3 of the most influential clans on Uranus how about you post some experience of what you have gotten outta these clan's the RP envolved in being a part of one leading one ect. Instead of slating what i was saying
To me, MMORPGs that aren't strictly controlled, and the internet in general, is an open invitation for people to act with abandon and generally be rude.
I think that Neocron started off with some strong roleplay two years ago, people were rarely changing factions, and your faction enemies really were scum (for instance, TG raiding the NCPD, CA had to respond to defend etc). However, this changed, not through mis-management by KK per se, but more from a lack of new content, and players basically learnt all there was to know about the game, destroying the mystery and hindering roleplay potential. People say they roleplay crazy murderers, but you can't have a game FULL of these types, which is what Neocron 1 turned into. It disappoints me that KK are not changing the underlying structure of Neocron 2 to try to bring this out. In fact the only 2 big changes (no safezones in city streets, 2 cities at war red=dead kind of thing), to me will actually limit possibilities rather than help them.
I think roleplay is a very touchy issue with some people though, so expect this thread to spiral downward rapidly.
Your not skitzo if your out of character, just shows your a real person and not acting out a fantasy for a better sense of escapism. People who role play constantly might just aswell be one of those NPC's who stand about talking random story stuff. o_O
After reading this thread earlier, I decided I had to reply. And Hell-Demon has said more or less what I would have said, but I'll say what I was going to say.
Those on Terra are slowly learning, that a) I'm a Roleplayer, b) Phoenix is a RP clan. The rule in Phoenix is always *try* to play your character, but like all humans we like to talk about real life stuff, like Football for example, and we also slip out of character without using ooc - even I do it. One thing I don't do to my members is ramming down their throat that they must roleplay 100% all the time.
Doc Holliday
12-10-04, 19:05
personal opinion a truly successful rp game needs just one player. the person playing it. once u introduce multiple entities in to the equation ie other players then it gets complicated. not all will agree to the rules. not all will try to roleplay. some will try to be anti roleplay because they are kids at heart. 7 yrs of age or less and hell bent on being bad. lol. ok a joke but u get the point. without a fucking lot of enforcement there will be no roleplay in a computer game played online unless its cooked up by a small group.
Each group is responsible for its own style of roleplay and shouldnt be forced or governed to roleplay when seen fit by others because thats getting dictatorial. thats why p and p games and table top games ( warhammer quest anyone? ) were perfect as it was an event designed for a group of people to gather up with a specific purpose. Neocron and any other game like it has too many variables ( the kids again ;) wanting too many different things too make a solid rp world )
live and let live guys but dont flame the fuck out of each other for stupid barbs when it seems alot of people miss the point entirely.
this post is made after reading the first page. i dont care for the rest of threads anymore as i have gotten used to the first page being informative and the rest of it descending in to he said she said my dad is bigger than your dad blah blah blah. gets old and boring and people still do it. Bit like the sun newspaper for the uk readers. the page 3 is great and the rest is bollocks till u get to the back for some sports action.
Completely agree with what mr Brammers said - it's a very simple and obvious matter anyways.
and commenting on the more off-topic issues - morons are morons, there is no need to speak with one because everyone knows that such talk wont make any change. I've just come back from some meeting with some government representant for the PHARE program and we were involved into some 'deep' discussions concerning some local strategies. I've spend 2 hours talking to some complete brainless idiot, trying to convince, negotiate, discuss some pretty important matters and after 2 hours i've finally gave up as he really wasnt even remotely interested in our discussion. So finally i've said he's a stupid moron and we may talk only if - next time - he shows me some certificate from a psychiatrist that he is able of basic interpersonal communication... Jesus Christ i'm pissed so much...
I just wish we could have an enforced RP server. It is absolutely correct that we can't dictate how people should play, but the majority of MMORPGs realise that there are different types of players and have different server rules accordingly. Some of us would like an environment where everybody roleplays, the way to do that without forcing it on other people is to do it on a separate server.
Also, a lot of people don't realise that RP isn't difficult, and it doesn't mean you have to decide beforehand what your character is going to be like. Most of the RP I do, I just put myself where my character is. So ingame, I act mostly as I imagine I would if I was really there. It's not exactly difficult.
I just wish we could have an enforced RP server. It is absolutely correct that we can't dictate how people should play, but the majority of MMORPGs realise that there are different types of players and have different server rules accordingly. Some of us would like an environment where everybody roleplays, the way to do that without forcing it on other people is to do it on a separate server.
Also, a lot of people don't realise that RP isn't difficult, and it doesn't mean you have to decide beforehand what your character is going to be like. Most of the RP I do, I just put myself where my character is. So ingame, I act mostly as I imagine I would if I was really there. It's not exactly difficult.
Its a nice idea (and one I'd support) but you'd only get morons joining the RP server just to piss over other people game play (at least then there would be no argument that they were griefers though......)
Hell-demon
12-10-04, 20:24
After reading this thread earlier, I decided I had to reply. And Hell-Demon has said more or less what I would have said, but I'll say what I was going to say.
I love you Brammers because you are a socialiser and thats what I like :)
Role play can get very tiresome. Sometimes you just need to talk to someone with their real life personality and not one falsified for the sake of roleplay.
Its nice to go up to someone and say "Hey whats your interests?" and theyll say something like "football and girls...etc etc".
Where as a hard core roleplayer will say " My interests are thwarting Rezas evil regime and waiting for the return of our lord and master Crahn who will smite you and urinate on your remians..blah blah"
Its better to have friends based on social interests and not friends based on role play.
Also Brammers Im on Terra...so look out! >=)
Where as a hard core roleplayer will say " My interests are thwarting Rezas evil regime and waiting for the return of our lord and master Crahn who will smite you and urinate on your remians..blah blah"Those guys aren't good roleplayers, no person would ever have their only interests as that. A really good roleplayer would say they'd enjoy going to occasional Neofrag match or perhaps on a good warbot hunt. ;)
QuantumDelta
12-10-04, 20:44
I varyingly agree with most of what you said, bar point five.
Simply:
I, more so than DJ, Hate, RP Purists, at least, while they're being sticklers for rules and constraints as some of your post is suggesting.
Rules, Regimes, strict guidelines, and the constraint, pure RP isn't fun for me.
When I am with friends that I have known ingame a long time, I will slip OOC.
When I am attacked personally OOCishly, I will either ignore, or reply OOCly.
I do not bother with "OOC:" Because partly, I'm lazy, other part, again, I have strict guidelines and constraint.
However, all of my chars when IC are different, they all have different tendancies and tones, but they are not extremely different, since they are all in the same faction (Except my PE, QD, he is a epic trawler and does want to become a paladin, couldn't care less about the epic items), and tend to be in the same clan (never been in a different one, just not always all actually in one, obviously).
They all have a history, and reasons for responding to faction and enemy decisions as they do.
//
Disclaimer;
None of this applies to the Syndicate War, as it was so personal it was impossible for ANYONE to stay or play IC Ž.Ž
Whats kinda amusing about most of the posts in these threads is how most people can only see their side of the equasion (I'm not implying that I'm less guilty of this than the next guy)
Its all very well you all agreeing on various levels of RP tolerance/intolerance but what you dont _appear_ to realise is that other people have the same view of PvP/PK tolerance/intolerance - this door swings both ways
Ok so you only RP with your characters 'this much' (or not at all), but I only PvP/PK with my characters 'that much' (or not at all). Interestingly the dialogue _usually_ ends up at this point with the following lines being quoted by one side of the other
Its an FPS/PVP based game!!!
Its a MMO R.P.G!!! (my emphasis)
I think the lesson to be learned here (by every MMORPG that allows PvP) is that the two extreme views (not so much the people more on the middle ground) are _never_ going to agree and one group will invariable be left less happy with a game (usually due to dev changes that appear to favour the opposite direction) than the others (another good example is why most PvP players dislike SWG).
I'd personally suggest that the most of 'true' RPers left NC a long time ago - and while those people on the other side of the fence may initially _think_ thats a good thing ('carebears' etc. who try and 'ruin my game') ultimately (as a couple of people have pointed out) you are left with a half-assed FPS with no 'soul' and you wonder why you arent playing UT or something similar - in addition (on the single char servers anyway) since PvP/PK become the only focus of everyone game play (and certainly given the purchase/construction changes in NC2) you dont have anyone prepared to make a tradeskill character (more difficult in NC2 anyway because of FS reqs.)
I love you Brammers because you are a socialiser and thats what I like :)
Easy Tiger!
Role play can get very tiresome. Sometimes you just need to talk to someone with their real life personality and not one falsified for the sake of roleplay.
Its nice to go up to someone and say "Hey whats your interests?" and theyll say something like "football and girls...etc etc".
I just come back from seeing Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow. It looks look a 1940's Sci-Fi B movie, and I mean that in a good way, as it's meant to look like that! The plot, well it's a little flakey....Anyway going off topic slightly.
Where as a hard core roleplayer will say " My interests are thwarting Rezas evil regime and waiting for the return of our lord and master Crahn who will smite you and urinate on your remians..blah blah"
Its better to have friends based on social interests and not friends based on role play.
My characters have their reasons for not liking some of the factions or Characters. Does Brammers trust Crahn....well a true Fallen Angel probably wouldn't. However why does Brammers not trust City Admin, and this was before the big bang... And which member of TS wants to kill Brammers, and why? Hmm am I slipping into the hard line RP'er?
Also Brammers Im on Terra...so look out! >=)
I know you are on Terra - you been spotted under a new name! You know your character has managed to shop my dogtag twice to the enermy? :D
I roleplay F6 I think I really enjoy being a ...cunt ! but only because they fuel me with stupid shit like "I bet that made you feel big " or " I bet your an arsehole in real life" . Of coarse this is not true I'm just a 23 year old bloke who goes to work in the morning etc etc I can get along with anyone never had any RL enemys. We can play this game how ever we want it really pisses me off when some people get all worked up in the forums and tell us it reflects how we are in real life if we PK other players BULLSHIT!!
EDIT
I never really tryed true roleplay its not my thing tbh it is very hard to do to RP you must play that character from start to finnish in character you can't slip and thats what makes hard.
Its a nice idea (and one I'd support) but you'd only get morons joining the RP server just to piss over other people game play (at least then there would be no argument that they were griefers though......)
Hence the enforced RP. If you want to RP, join the server, if you don't want to RP, don't join the server. It would most likely require a new level of GM, say Warden, which has no GM powers other than the ability to temporarily ban someone from the RP server until a permanent ban from a full GM is applied after a review. But I wouldn't be so quick to give up on it.
I roleplay F6 I think I really enjoy being a ...cunt ! but only because they fuel me with stupid shit like "I bet that made you feel big " or " I bet your an arsehole in real life" . Of coarse this is not true I'm just a 23 year old bloke who goes to work in the morning etc etc I can get along with anyone never had any RL enemys. We can play this game how ever we want it really pisses me off when some people get all worked up in the forums and tell us it reflects how we are in real life if we PK other players BULLSHIT!!
EDIT
I never really tryed true roleplay its not my thing tbh it is very hard to do to RP you must play that character from start to finnish in character you can't slip and thats what makes hard.
You enjoy "being a cunt" yet you refuse to acknowledge this doesn't reflect on your "RL" personality at all? Ooookay, enjoy your self-denial.
QuantumDelta
13-10-04, 00:50
You enjoy "being a cunt" yet you refuse to acknowledge this doesn't reflect on your "RL" personality at all? Ooookay, enjoy your self-denial.
You really really remind me of someone o_O
I didn't think they were banned or anything...
--
Heh, When did PvP Come into this?
PvP is RPable.
RPK isn't really, regularly, RPable.
You enjoy "being a cunt" yet you refuse to acknowledge this doesn't reflect on your "RL" personality at all? Ooookay, enjoy your self-denial.
No but it does reflect how I play computer games I'm no cunt in RL I don't walk around randomly insulting people or punching them in the face. Yep looks like you another person who can't tell the difference from RL and a fucking computer game which has armour and guns and stuff that are there to be used. PLZ STFU now ok I was being honest when I said I like acting like a cunt ingame I never said I am a cunt
/EDIT if I invited some of my RL mates who don't play computer games to come and read what you just said they would laugh
No but it does reflect how I play computer games I'm no cunt in RL I don't walk around randomly insulting people or punching them in the face. Yep looks like you another person who can't tell the difference from RL and a fucking computer game which has armour and guns and stuff that are there to be used. PLZ STFU now ok I was being honest when I said I like acting like a cunt ingame I never said I am a cunt
I never said anything about you acting like a "cunt" outside of the game, I was simply pointing out how amusing I think it is that you enjoy acting that way yet flat-out deny it being a reflection of your personality. That, and if it's "just a game", as you say, why get so worked up over what people think of you?
You're been driven to return flames, so something's getting through to you.
ALL ppl around here - playing - pay to have fun or whatever...
reasons having as many or more faces as the players behind the chars...
i don't want to be killed while i'm busy doing anything else -
lets say i don't want to be killed unexpectedly.
if u feel like showing u (or your char) is a human beeing i'm rdy anytime.
u guys could just do me a favour ignoring my chars if u feel that urge to kill
as i try to ignore whiney threads on the forums and as i don't attack first or without a word.
i'll get attacked without knowing it before - oh well... dangerous world it is -
just don't want to loose the ability to play relaxed NC.
i'm not skilled in PvP and i'm no elitist RPer (yeah i played p&p RPGs as well)
but i'm patiently giving kk the time to get NC to where it should be and
still enjoying it as much and as often as i can.
i'll call myself a passive egoist...
not stealing other ppl's time and asking them not to steal mine.
u might call me a carebear... and i am -
cause i care that the other models r made by real ppl too.
u might call me a carebear... and i am -
i recon that pink bear in your sig is a give away :p
Jesterthegreat
13-10-04, 13:19
I dont give a shit what you have done so your a bigger NC nerd than me and you missed what i was saying completly
I wasnt posting that i was better than any one else i was stating some saturn history and what happened . Some of the roles i played at the time just an example of what happened but at the time in said clan i was a soldier the clan afterwards i helped lead .
One of the earliest memorys i had of neocron wasn't organising some stupid next market ( i was next ) but was helping the city mercs fight the elite and very big TG PRO at the time . It was one of the Times i truly RP'd they were my one great nc1 enemy to who there has been no match to this day.
Oh and if you werre in 3 of the most influential clans on Uranus how about you post some experience of what you have gotten outta these clan's the RP envolved in being a part of one leading one ect. Instead of slating what i was saying
im not gonna get drawn into a flame war.
although i fail to see how this:
hes a newb from uranus ezza he wouldnt understand all he need know is my CS is bigger than his and being a saturn player im a bigger cunt than him .
has anything to do with RP
henrymkfin
13-10-04, 14:52
Can't we just....get along.... ok....
It's a game.... try to have some fun.... don't make it too complicated.....
Roleplaying is ok, but playing rpg on computer is different compared to PnP rpg's.
Those great singleplayer rpgs like Morrowind, Neverwinter nights etc. are rpg's but still won't give the same freedom that PnP give.
Same goes to mmorpg's. There is no way to determine actual roleplaying in computergame. When you play a computer or videogame that cas that main crharacter that player controls, isn't player taking the "role" of that character?! I doesn't matter what the game really is. If you play Doom3 wich is not a rpg, you still take a role of badass spacemarine and try to survive in the dark and very small wolrd of Doom3.
If you play FF-X you take a role of Tidus and try to complete the game. If you play Neocron, you take a role of your character that has part of that virtual character wich you have greated and part of you!
Some ppl have roles even in IRC. They act totally different in real life than in irc.
That's why it is difficult to determine roleplaying! Maybe roleplaying has evolved.
I think there is lot's of roleplaying in NC2. I play my character as dedicated hacker who has issues with DoY. And I play my character that way.
When i interact with other players i do it as i do in real life. I have my role in this virtual wolrd as do every one who plays NC2.
Of cource, there are those who greate char, level up and start pking as soon as they can. I call them "psychos" ingame, assholes IRL.
Oh and how about that, those PKing bastards have their role in this virtual wolrd too! They are those psycho maniac killers that you have to avoid in this dark and violent place called earth. There are random mobs in PnP that attack players etc. I think there PKing psychos the same. They are Human controlled random mobs. Some are powerfull, some are not.
Plz. Try to see teh forrest from teh trees!
conclusion.... Every1 has his role in NC2 and other mmorg's and so on. And every one plays his/her role as good as they can. So IDOLA. stop whining and start playing!
Peace!
Bugs Gunny
13-10-04, 15:11
In the words of one of the people you are describing...
KOS !!!!!!! TBH
Hell-demon
13-10-04, 15:39
Look just leave people alone. If ya wann kill people do it! Wanna role play? Just fucking do it! Wanna chat and play for fun and friends, then go ahead. Everyone has their own playing style so just leave them be.
You dont like player killers, then go home and cry to momma. If you think role play is bullshit, so be it but some people dont. Just play the god damn game its pixels and codes you make what the hell you want from it :)
Bugs Gunny
13-10-04, 15:45
I do both roleplaying and pking.
Depends on what char i'm on, and most of the time i log in the character i'm in the mood for.
Hell-demon
13-10-04, 15:46
I like your style bugs
I do both roleplaying and pking.
Depends on what char i'm on, and most of the time i log in the character i'm in the mood for.
Who says they have to be separate?
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