View Full Version : Should 3rd person combat be eliminated?
I’ve been playing a lot of UT2004 lately and it is amazing how different FPS combat feels when it is actually played in *gasp* first person view. Almost everyone in Neocron uses 3rd person view because it offers many advantages. However, it also makes many positioning strategies impossible to execute and I think it also takes away from the immersive nature of the game. It feels more like you are manipulating a little puppet avatar rather than actually BEING in that character’s shoes.
Third person view is fine if you are in town or just exploring but I think that as soon as you draw a weapon the view should automatically switch to first person. Discuss.
major flaw in it is the apu casting which can be done thru walls :eek:
Doesnt matter to me since I never use 3rd person view..
So I think I will say YES.
major flaw in it is the apu casting which can be done thru walls :eek:Good point. Allowing 3rd person view also causes a lot of technical problems, some of which—as you mention—can give some players an unfair advantage.
Lets just say I would quit neocron if I had to pvp in 1st person. Neocron is a 3rd person pvp game and the combat is great right now. Why change it? 1st person with guns like lib and cursed soul would completely suck.
Shadow Dancer
05-09-04, 09:38
I agree Ray, when you draw a weapon it should switch to 1st person.
About executing strategies, I also think outside of safezones the local list shouldn't work. It's so stupid that you can't really hide in this game, because someone can "feel" you presence in the area. :rolleyes:
Mindgibber
05-09-04, 09:39
Monks would say, never !, they like it to attack behind a hill or something :)
tanks like the 3rd person too, because they can shoot back with his CS, ok others chars too :)
i come from the Q2+Q3+UT2004 scene and i play 1st person only
so i would say yes ! 1st person only please, 1st person -> skill :) (dont flame)
greetings
Mindgibber
This is why 3rd person is needed. 8|
I dont play 3rd person for any other reason than i really really enjoy it more, i played months in first person and i actually have to say its miles more fun in 3rd, i like watching my av move about and fight, i play nearly all games in 3rd if there is an option to, i just like the feel more. I would be very very dissapointed if they took 3rd person from neocron.
glok highlighed one reason i hate 1st person in this game, tank weapons take up to much room on the screen, if it was 1st person only i would stop playing my tank.
and tbh you play UT the weapons are fucking awesome, oh and theres no real aiming for a start, you point you fire you hit as long as its over the target it will hit, unlike neocron which has the reticle
When first i read this i was like "WTF? I wanna see my avatar" however as long as it ONLY switches to 1'st person when you draw a weapon that'll be ok with me.
but dont eliminate it completely.
glok highlighed one reason i hate 1st person in this game, tank weapons take up to much room on the screen...I agree. The cannons would have to be adjusted.
..and tbh you play UT the weapons are fucking awesome, oh and theres no real aiming for a start, you point you fire you hit as long as its over the target it will hit, unlike neocron which has the reticleThere are quite a few differences in the combat systems between both games but I prefer not to get into a discussion of that. The point I was making is that combat has a more tense and immersive FEEL when you are in first person view and can't see behind you.
...I also think outside of safezones the local list shouldn't work. It's so stupid that you can't really hide in this game, because someone can "feel" you presence in the area. :rolleyes:I posted this suggestion several times over a year ago and finally gave up. Naturally, I agree.
I dont play 3rd person for any other reason than i really really enjoy it more, i played months in first person and i actually have to say its miles more fun in 3rd, i like watching my av move about and fight, i play nearly all games in 3rd if there is an option to, i just like the feel more.I have to admit that I also enjoy seeing my avatar move and fight in 3rd person. Nonetheless, I think it takes away from the experience and possibly even some of the skill required.
err ray you just posted in a diffrent colour
well imo PvP is still tense in neo, at least for me, doesnt matter if its in 1st or 3rd.
Since when is this a FPSMMORPG?
Richard Slade
05-09-04, 10:36
Since when is this a FPSMMORPG?
Since just about the start of the creation of the alpha..
Somewhere there
"Neocron is the worlds first cyberpunk MMOFPS"
Anyone care to find that quote?
juvestar15
05-09-04, 10:47
You can't comapre other games to Neocron. Every FPS game that i can think of always had ranged fighting. Neocron is a whole other story, that's why we third person. I choose 3rd person view because the guns are too fucking big and when in close quarters combat you need to see as much as possible.
Get rid of 3rd person and I'm out of here.
Richard Slade
05-09-04, 10:54
You can't comapre other games to Neocron. Every FPS game that i can think of always had ranged fighting. Neocron is a whole other story, that's why we third person. I choose 3rd person view because the guns are too fucking big and when in close quarters combat you need to see as much as possible.
Get rid of 3rd person and I'm out of here.
I've never played 3rd and I use all kinds of chars
Also there's a lot of ranged combat, just because you play tank tank and tank doesn't make it a tank world
And did you just threaten KK with leaving? Isn't that rather lame? o_O
I agree i'll like neocron much more if in combat u've to use 1st person :)
Would be great.
First person only combat + Scale / redesign large weapon models not to take up so much room = :cool:
Athon Solo
juvestar15
05-09-04, 11:03
I've never played 3rd and I use all kinds of chars
Also there's a lot of ranged combat, just because you play tank tank and tank doesn't make it a tank world
And did you just threaten KK with leaving? Isn't that rather lame? o_O
No actually i don't play tanks anymore. I never said the tanks have big weapons. I find any gun large. I also play an APU and PPU. The APU i use first person and the PPU i use 3rd. Sniper spy is first person. PE Pistol/Rifle, all in 3rd. Tank i play in 3rd aswell.
About executing strategies, I also think outside of safezones the local list shouldn't work. It's so stupid that you can't really hide in this game, because someone can "feel" you presence in the area. :rolleyes:
Perhaps it should only work for same clan / faction / alliance.
Athon Solo
juvestar15
05-09-04, 11:14
And did you just threaten KK with leaving? Isn't that rather lame? o_O
I'm not threatening. Like they would give a shit anyway. :rolleyes:
Neocron works much like my pay tv, if i don't like whats on, i don't pay. You can't hold that against me or call me lame. :mad:
Richard Slade
05-09-04, 11:46
I'm not threatening. Like they would give a shit anyway. :rolleyes:
Neocron works much like my pay tv, if i don't like whats on, i don't pay. You can't hold that against me or call me lame. :mad:
You pay for TV? 8|
If I had to play in 1st person only, I'd play monk only, because it's the only class that has a weapon-model even remotely well done... the rest is just ugly piles of polygons that take up half the screen (even small pistols take up fucking 30% of it 8| )
No, 3rd person should still be in there... I don't know one (1) other mmo in 3d that doesn't have 3rd person as either an option or as the only choice...
Richard Slade
05-09-04, 11:53
Perhaps it should only work for same clan / faction / alliance.
Athon Solo
Sex, 'nuff said.
I would prefere Reakktor fixed the exploits and bugs around 3rd person than removed it as an option.
Shame that in UT and its lastest version you can switch to 3rd person really :rolleyes:
Aside from that, it makes the game more interesting fighting in 3rd person for me. I have played pure FPSes for a long time, and its nice to have a change. And if you don't like 3rd person, don't use it. Simple as that.
Clownst0pper
05-09-04, 12:42
Without 3rd im screwed :eek:
I hate 1st person in this game just can't aim pistols in 1st it just rattles all over the place if 3rd person view where taken out I would quit.
I'm first person all the way. Although i will go into 3rd with my APU occassionally when i want to de-buff as you can track the target a lot easier.
[TgR]KILLER
05-09-04, 13:08
on one side i don't mind realy.. on killer i always fight first person. but on my apu or on a tank i always play in 3rd..
reason for that is because with a cannon you can't see shit anymore.. and casting some spells have the same effect..
but they also should adjust the damage types. everybody who got with with fire ( fire modded earp / fire spells ) know what i meen.
In some games that require lightning reflexes and so on, 3'rd person can help alot because it increase the turn ratio cap of the mouse.
Is it exploiting? Since everyone can do it - dont think so. Is it playing the game like it wasn't supposed to be done? Why is there 3'rd person at all then..?
I personally hate 3'rd person view in general, makes the game look like a cheap crappy PS2/XBox game (SWG). First person puts you into the situation of your character/avatar more, playing say BFV for example with 3'rd person would ruin the whole game.
Is it exploiting? Since everyone can do it - dont think so.
You don't know the half of it. :p
Since I'm not allowed to mention exploits, I'll just leave it at that. ;)
Should 3rd person combat be eliminated?
No.
fire stacks fuck up your view totally, HC weapons cover 1/2 of the screen etc.
apu spells that strikes from the sky should be changed tho. Into projectile attacks that needs a line of sight. Like the lance spells...
Anyone care to find that quote?
Found it! :o
Neocron is the worlds first cyberpunk MMOFPS
I say no. Have to say that I would quit as well, purely because first person view annoys the living daylights out of me. The fact that my CS takes up the majority of my screen makes PvP a pain in the backside, plus using a reticle in first person is weird as hell.
Eliminate the exploits or give third person view 3 billion times the recoil first has, I don't care, just I couldn't stand playing in first person, it's crap even in an 'FPS'MMORPG.
Richard Slade
05-09-04, 13:43
Try this:
1)Set yourself on fire and see if you can see more than in-game
2)fetch a RPG and see if you can see anything on that side, at all.
hence, we shouldn't have 3rd person,
it's to much exploiting in it :(
Freaky Fryd
05-09-04, 14:22
I'd rather the "exploits" with 3rd person be fixed, rather than it be eliminated.
I play my rifle spy in 1st person until I plan on doing some First Love close combat...
My PPU is always in 3rd person, as is my melee tank.
landofcake
05-09-04, 14:40
I'd play first person if the mouse wasn't horribly laggy in that view.
I love third person but i honestly cant stand the horrible mouse input (it might be the camera), nowhere near as precise as first person view, it's like there is loads of horrible mouse smoothing applied to it.
I suspect it's the camera.
I'd love this to be fixed ;)
Big no. If first person was anything realistic like they tried to make it feel then maybe people would use first person, but when your gun covers the best part of half your screen as a tank and using a lib its as if your playing while an earthquake is happening.
This game is 3rd person. You have more control over your characters in 3rd person than you ever do in 1st.
Try this:
1)Set yourself on fire and see if you can see more than in-game
2)fetch a RPG and see if you can see anything on that side, at all.
hence, we shouldn't have 3rd person,
it's to much exploiting in it :(
1) What does that have to do with anything? This is a game, it's not suppose
to be like real life
2) Who gives a fuck about other RPGs.... We play NC... Instead of removing
3rd person due to exploits they should fix those exploits instead. After the
exploits are fixed nobody can complain, and what would the point of removing
a game feature be then?
And how about we remove 1st person, 1st person truly blows chunks of shit
in this game, sorry kk but it's true. As someone mentioned above, fire stacks
fuck up your screen, weapons take up to much space, try shooting anything
that has a high freq and your screen start shaking & twitching and you cant
focus on the target.
tomparadox
05-09-04, 15:12
NO. ffs they can fix the exploits but dont get rid of 3rd person or this game would suck ass.
Lets just say I would quit neocron if I had to pvp in 1st person. Neocron is a 3rd person pvp game and the combat is great right now. Why change it? 1st person with guns like lib and cursed soul would completely suck.
i agree. try to pvp with a speed gat in 1st person, or a slasher. every time you shoot your screen will go up, witch makes it a royal pain in the ass to fight, and that just about gos for any rare/normal gun you use, depending on its class ( HC/RC/PC/ ) and its RoF. the more the RoF the harder it will be to hit jack because the gun will be going up faster and higher...
To make Neocron 1st Person only the whole PVP needs to be changed!
Here are 4 good reasons
1.Half of your screen it taken by the Weapon Modell
2.Fighting in a big Fight in first person ends up in epileptics
3.You cant see anything when your Fire/heal+shelter running or getting shot
4.You totally loose the overview in the fight because you just see bullet flying through you and lights flashing.
THe pvp is really well, atm why change it ?
If you dont like 3rd person hu ? so what go and play in 1st person ?
Like several people have mentioned its not just weaponmodels that screw up 1st person, its also fireeffects and such. Try fighting a couple of firemobs at the same time and still have a decent hit-ratio....
I have to say that the ONLY reason people play this game is its combatsystem. There are tons of games out there that are better at about everything but the combatsystem.
To even think about doing such a drastic change as removing 3rd person is ludicrus. The only thing that would do is to remove the only thing that makes this game good, the combatsystem. People enjoy playing different styles and thats one of the things that make the game good, that people can choose to play whatever style they so chooses.
BDoY/NC2 (silly to call an expansion a sequel) is the last chance KK have to save Neocron from dieing. People have been satisfied with a game with about no missions at all (except epics), boring monsters, tons of bugs and so on just simply because the combatsystem still kick other games asses. Now lately people are getting less and less satisfied with such a lacking content. What they gotta do is rely on their triumphcard and expand the game with all those things that this game lacks compared to other games and its gonna be a real kickass game that will attract more and more players.
Although I generally fight in 1st person I like the 3rd person view so that I can see my chars and what they look like. I don't think it should be removed at this time, people are too used to having it. Things like this can only be removed at the very start.
BTW you cant compare NC with other FPS shooter because in other fps
you dont have a reticle which has to close you just shoot and the bullets hit and ppl die much faster!
In neocron you have to wait a little bit and follow your enemy with the reticle which is in dead very difficult sometimes, to be able to shoot then.
And enemys in neocron dont die liike in UT with a good placed headshot ?
You gotta fire for some time till someone dies.
Any now you ppl want to remove 3rd person ?
Would mean all the aiming time to be changed the dmg and resist system ?
to balance it out again.
Btw if we all play now in 1st person in opfights
We could opfight for 2h+ :D
because we couldnt keep aim on someone with so many ppl arround he would just get lost in the crowd. And you couldnt target him in 1st person.
Afterwards 10 ppl need a doctor because they got epileptics!
:lol:
Whoa that be really cool
BTW you cant compare NC with other FPS shooter because in other fps
you dont have a reticle which has to close you just shoot and the bullets hit and ppl die much faster!
In neocron you have to wait a little bit and follow your enemy with the reticle which is in dead very difficult sometimes, to be able to shoot then.
And enemys in neocron dont die liike in UT with a good placed headshot ?
You gotta fire for some time till someone dies.
Any now you ppl want to remove 3rd person ?
Would mean all the aiming time to be changed the dmg and resist system ?
to balance it out again.
Btw if we all play now in 1st person in opfights
We could opfight for 2h+ :D
because we couldnt keep aim on someone with so many ppl arround he would just get lost in the crowd. And you couldnt target him in 1st person.
Afterwards 10 ppl need a doctor because they got epileptics!
:lol:
Whoa that be really cool
lol
:)
agreed :D
Only way I wouldn't mind going back to 1st person, all the time or at least when I pull my weapon out, is if they bring back the command to hide your weapon from your view. I know when people used to do it others couldn't see it, so of course fix that it only disappears for you not your enemy.
I find it very amusing that people get so upset at a mere discussion, claiming the game would be ruined and even threatening to quit.
I personally hate 3'rd person view in general, makes the game look like a cheap crappy PS2/XBox game (SWG). First person puts you into the situation of your character/avatar more, playing say BFV for example with 3'rd person would ruin the whole game.Exactly. It “puts you into the situation of your character/avatar more.” That is the observation I was making after playing more traditional FPS games. You get used to first person view very quickly and you don’t feel crippled. It feels as if you ARE THE CHARCTER and not simply CONTROLLING THE CHARACTER.
Part of the fun in BFV is hiding in the high bushes on many of the jungle maps. If you could simply switch to third person view in BFV and rise above the brush then, as ichinin says, it would ruin the game.
OBVIOUSLY, there are problems with the size of some weapons, the excessive recoil, the blinding fire effects, etc. that would have to be fixed. But I think it could be done and would be an improvement. Just one person’s opinion, no need to lose sleep over it people. 8|
juvestar15
05-09-04, 17:00
Deciding to quit over it just shows how fragile our relationship is with this game.
BTW: If 3rd person was such a bad thing then KK would never have put it in.
And who is losing sleep over it? O_o
___T-X____
05-09-04, 17:10
dont u dare touch it.
Leave it as it is pls
QuantumDelta
05-09-04, 17:11
Yes.
MMOfpsRPG.
And: Quite simply.
Darken's post labels exactly why Third Person Should never have been introduced.
Richard Slade
05-09-04, 17:17
Someone's gotta play with the FLAK in ut2k4 and go close combat....
People die faster, pfft!
Harder to aim with the circle thingy, pfft! Try getting a clean FLAK vs me and we'll talk about it
And for the OP fights, speak for yourself about not being able to aim.. geez...
BTW: If 3rd person was such a bad thing then KK would never have put it in.
Kinda like the Holy Para then?
Or when PAs were BPable?
Want 200 other things KK put in that they shouldn't have?
geez...
*goes to smoke*
juvestar15
05-09-04, 17:28
Kinda like the Holy Para then?
Or when PAs were BPable?
Want 200 other things KK put in that they shouldn't have?
geez...
*goes to smoke*
Holy Para they are sticking by. Seems to be OK at the moment.
They didn't remvoe PA all together.
You can list the other 200 if you like......
My point is, if it ruins the game so much, they would of taken it out or attempted to fix it. But with 3rd and 1st person, they don't even address it as an issue.
I think it's interesting that some people just sit there and scream 'no, never! I'll quit if you do', rather than discussing the pro's, con's, tweaks and alternatives.
Athon Solo
Hate first person in 99% of situations, think i only really use it for barreling and that b/c barreling in 3rd is fucked.. always has been, Silent hunter b/c of aiming.
Satocastix
05-09-04, 17:48
Personally, I always play in first-person view. The main reason I don't like third-person view is because on my spy, if you bend over, his ass shows through his jacket. What also turns me off about third-person is when you aim at something with a lasersight, it's always two feet to the left and below of the aiming reticle. That's not to say that I want third-person view removed, though. I would use third-person view much more often with the high-poly player models and improved avatar customizaton. I would hate to be blind of what my avatar looks like. However, if the third-person view combat was improved, I might use it slightly more often but there is no replacement for first-person view. Oh, and if they got rid of the "externalcam 1" spam that fills up your chat window, then I'd definitely have some motivation to use third-person view.
Doc Holliday
05-09-04, 17:56
theres some nice avatars coming. why waste em. im not gonna be vain in game standing looking in my mirror when i wanna see how sexy i look.
Satocastix
05-09-04, 18:03
If I don't look sexy, we have a problem.
If I don't look sexy, we have a problem.
*rings houston, texas*
:lol:
Wow now this is interesting. Most of people say that they will leave Neocron if they cant play on 3rd person view. Why? Because they cant hit shit in 1st person view. Doesnt that mean that we that use 1st person view and still are good at PvP and PvM would own teh fecking Neocron if we would switch to 3rd person view? I mean, we can hit you when we are burning, we dont die even if we cant see behind our asses, we cant shoot through walls with spells and we have that raycannon/gatling gun blocking 50% of our view. And still, we own your fecking asses.
Consider getting some skills people, and whine less.
And BTW, just that 75% of all the people that play Neocron use exploits in 3rd person view, doesnt make it legal to do so.
Im off to smoke n00bs...
Doesnt that mean that we that use 1st person view and still are good at PvP and PvM would own teh fecking Neocron if we would switch to 3rd person view?
No.
As you aren't used to the 3rd person view. The ppl whos been using it since it was avalible would still be better in that sence.
I would support this if:
1) The position of cannons is fixed (it's not just the size, also look at where a Libby is despite the fact that PEs hold it directly in front of their faces, a Tank holds a CS on his shoulder yet it obscures more in front of him than Lib does by miles. Gats go without saying).
2) The recoil in 1st person was reduced to match 3rd person.
3) The FOV was increased in 1st person to increase spatial awareness. The main reason above any other I use 3rd person is so I know what's around me better. Humans in RL aren't restricted to such a limited perspective as 1st person offers.
4) It would most likely be better if 3rd person was simply not allowed at all. But add more mirrors and more mirror effects in the general game world to compensate.
Btw, most of the advantages of 3rd person cited by 1st person advocates cancel themselves out. There is less recoil, but target boxes become smaller because of the increased distance between target and camera. There is increased vision in 3rd person, however the camera often gets stuck on walls and objects in enclosed spaces. The 3rd person APU 'exploits' which are often the main point are actually for the most part completely impossible to execute in a PvP situation.
Consider getting some skills people, and whine less.
What a productive argument. I could just as easily say, 3rd person is fine, it's just you who needs skills. You want to put forward a reasonable argument to remove 3rd person view? Go ahead. Start with the crap about how someone who uses 3rd person is less skilled or exploits by definition, and you can fuck right off, simple as that.
[F6]Knight
05-09-04, 19:24
fix the 3rd person exploits,but dont take it away :(
dont u dare touch it.
w0rd!
Psycho_Soldier
05-09-04, 19:29
My opinion on first person is that KK didn't design it well enough. Weapons take up half the screen and the skill it takes to pvp in first person in NC is like 10 times greater than any other FPS I have ever played. My main class the tank would also be at a MAJOR disadvantage if this was to happen. I would be fucked by any class especially point and click ones like melee and monks. Rifles or Pistols aren't that hard to aim in first person either so basically this would just fuck tanks over... Only way I would agree to this is if the viewing area was made larger in first person, the crosshair locked faster, and if people ran slower. Do you know how hard it is to fight someone who is running inside and out of your character and within 1 feet of your character in first person? It is almost impossible.
QuantumDelta
05-09-04, 19:44
Knight']fix the 3rd person exploits,but dont take it away :(
That would be problematic since the field of view that it affords in itself is a minor exploit.
--
Also, recoil.
Also, wrap locking is several times easier in third person (someone can walk around be-fucking-hind you and you still keep them locked).
Psycho - The Liberator has this problem as well.
As well as a Rifle or two.
Not only that:
Rifles and Pistols retain less lock after it's broke than cannons do.
I'd use 1st person except that apart from the problems already mention, using it makes it seem like your looking from your chest. It just feels weird and isnt immersive at all.
What a productive argument. I could just as easily say, 3rd person is fine, it's just you who needs skills. You want to put forward a reasonable argument to remove 3rd person view? Go ahead. Start with the crap about how someone who uses 3rd person is less skilled or exploits by definition, and you can fuck right off, simple as that.
I said I can PvP fine with 1st person view, and anyone who uses 3rd person view to gain advantage is just lame. Dont you agree? Besides killing someone in 3rd person view is really waaay too easy, just try to PvP first in 1st person view and after that in 3rd person view and you know what I mean.
Dont you think that just using the "I cant see in 1st person view when Im on fire!!1!1!" or "I cant PvP if I dont see everything that goes around me1!1!!!" as a reason not to play in 1st person view just fecking lame? If you cant PvP in 1st person view why dont you just get some skills or stop PvPing :D
Wow now this is interesting. Most of people say that they will leave Neocron if they cant play on 3rd person view. Why? Because they cant hit shit in 1st person view. Doesnt that mean that we that use 1st person view and still are good at PvP and PvM would own teh fecking Neocron if we would switch to 3rd person view? I mean, we can hit you when we are burning, we dont die even if we cant see behind our asses, we cant shoot through walls with spells and we have that raycannon/gatling gun blocking 50% of our view. And still, we own your fecking asses.
Consider getting some skills people, and whine less.
And BTW, just that 75% of all the people that play Neocron use exploits in 3rd person view, doesnt make it legal to do so.
Im off to smoke n00bs...
exactly mate I have played in 3rd person for so long it would kill the game for me it just would not be fun. I can't hit shit in first person I admit that with out 3rd person this game would be just another FPS like quake
I'd use 1st person except that apart from the problems already mention, using it makes it seem like your looking from your chest. It just feels weird and isnt immersive at all.
This is basicly what I mean would not be as immersive just feels shit in first person.
If they removed the reticule and just had it shoot where you aimed like in other FPS's then is might work the recoil is enough to put me off I mean WTF the screen shakes like mad when firing libby in first.
I said I can PvP fine with 1st person view, and anyone who uses 3rd person view to gain advantage is just lame. Dont you agree? Besides killing someone in 3rd person view is really waaay too easy, just try to PvP first in 1st person view and after that in 3rd person view and you know what I mean.
Dont you think that just using the "I cant see in 1st person view when Im on fire!!1!1!" or "I cant PvP if I dont see everything that goes around me1!1!!!" as a reason not to play in 1st person view just fecking lame? If you cant PvP in 1st person view why dont you just get some skills or stop PvPing :D
Yeah, it's around about as lame as getting owned and blaming on the fact that your opponent was using 3rd person, and it clearly wasn't just because you need to get some skills. :rolleyes:
juvestar15
06-09-04, 01:30
I said I can PvP fine with 1st person view, and anyone who uses 3rd person view to gain advantage is just lame. Dont you agree? Besides killing someone in 3rd person view is really waaay too easy, just try to PvP first in 1st person view and after that in 3rd person view and you know what I mean.
Dont you think that just using the "I cant see in 1st person view when Im on fire!!1!1!" or "I cant PvP if I dont see everything that goes around me1!1!!!" as a reason not to play in 1st person view just fecking lame? If you cant PvP in 1st person view why dont you just get some skills or stop PvPing :D
oh well if his holyness can PvP in 1st person, then everyone can!! :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
I think just about every class can PvP in 1st person, except tanks. You disadvantage yourself if you use 1st person.
Why the fuck would we stop PvPing because we can't PvP in 1st person? :wtf: I think that you use first person as an excuse. I can imagine you saying something along the lines of "Hey you only beat me cuz u use 3rd person, i use 1st because i think im leet, if i used 3rd id beat j00 but im not a l4mz0r" :rolleyes:
tomparadox
06-09-04, 03:14
Wow now this is interesting. Most of people say that they will leave Neocron if they cant play on 3rd person view. Why? Because they cant hit shit in 1st person view. Doesnt that mean that we that use 1st person view and still are good at PvP and PvM would own teh fecking Neocron if we would switch to 3rd person view? I mean, we can hit you when we are burning, we dont die even if we cant see behind our asses, we cant shoot through walls with spells and we have that raycannon/gatling gun blocking 50% of our view. And still, we own your fecking asses.
Consider getting some skills people, and whine less.
And BTW, just that 75% of all the people that play Neocron use exploits in 3rd person view, doesnt make it legal to do so.
Im off to smoke n00bs...
wow, you have no idea how dumb that just sounded. No, people cant hit shit. i personaly dont do it because it herts my eyes.
I said I can PvP fine with 1st person view, and anyone who uses 3rd person view to gain advantage is just lame. Dont you agree? Besides killing someone in 3rd person view is really waaay too easy, just try to PvP first in 1st person view and after that in 3rd person view and you know what I mean.
Dont you think that just using the "I cant see in 1st person view when Im on fire!!1!1!" or "I cant PvP if I dont see everything that goes around me1!1!!!" as a reason not to play in 1st person view just fecking lame? If you cant PvP in 1st person view why dont you just get some skills or stop PvPing :D
i dont agree, infact i think half the shit your saying is bullshit, why do i care if you can PVP in first person? it herts my eyes, and its a royal pain in the ass to see shit in a good OP war with a lota people.
personaly i think the only reson you came into this thred was to try to brag about you being able to pvp in first person.
btw, hows it gaining an advantage on anyone in PVP if probly 70% - 90% of the people play in 3rd person? if you play in first and have a problem with it get over it.
If you cant PvP in 1st person view why dont you just get some skills or stop PvPing :D
just go into a corner and shut the F up. Btw, im about geting sick of all the fucking n00bs in this game comeing onto the forums and saying that KK should do stuff that would massivly effect the game and 75% of the people that play it. personaly, i whant to know WHAT THE FUCK gives all you people the right to say we HALF to fight in first person? and dont say and exploit cus that can be fixed without the removal of 3rd person pvp...
Wow now this is interesting. Most of people say that they will leave Neocron if they cant play on 3rd person view. Why? Because they cant hit shit in 1st person view. Doesnt that mean that we that use 1st person view and still are good at PvP and PvM would own teh fecking Neocron if we would switch to 3rd person view? I mean, we can hit you when we are burning, we dont die even if we cant see behind our asses, we cant shoot through walls with spells and we have that raycannon/gatling gun blocking 50% of our view. And still, we own your fecking asses.
Consider getting some skills people, and whine less.
And BTW, just that 75% of all the people that play Neocron use exploits in 3rd person view, doesnt make it legal to do so.
Im off to smoke n00bs...
Well if thats the case, come "own" my 3rd person view ass with your 1st person view, kthxwotever. :rolleyes:
tomparadox
06-09-04, 03:24
Well if thats the case, come "own" my 3rd person view ass with your 1st person view, kthxwotever. :rolleyes:
yes, id also like to see you in first person come own me too...
without 3rd person , hc tanks = dead.
Prolly the only ones what wouldn't suffer(so much) would be melee and psi.
Imo, it's much easier to target in 3rd person.
You know Tikiri, I have a capped H-C tank, and I typically use 1st person for most things and it's fine
the only things you can't use it for are:
The gat cannons (take up too much of the screen)
PvP VS Melee users.
if melee lost 3rd person, I think it would be pretty even overall.
in fact one of my favorite passtimes with my tank is MALEDICTION sniping grimmies, and for that you pretty much have to use first person.
Wow just look at this!
Well first of all, I AM a HC tank and I can live with it :lol:
Now just why do you call me a n00b? I have played since Beta 4 tho I have had some breaks in playing.
"personaly i think the only reson you came into this thred was to try to brag about you being able to pvp in first person." No I dont brag about it. Actually I have given up PKing (never liked it in first place), well mostly I mean. If some moron attacks me hes dead ofcourse.
Dont you just know how pathetic that sounds?
"I cant PvP because of the parashock!1!!!!1",
"I cant PvP because of the flame effect1!1!!!",
"I cant PvP because my tank use cannons and they should be as big as pistols!!1!1!"
Now when Im able to still kill those morons that try to kill me, in 1st person view, then why would you people quit the game if you cant use the 3rd person view? Is it because of:
1) You cant compete in fights in 1st person view = You need some skills.
or
2) Well really I cant make anything up here.
Im going to get some coffee...
Ender
Its a game its meant to be fun to play 3rd person view is fun first person view sucks why change something that works well?
Most people use 3rd person view if it where to be removed you can expect alot of whining
I said I can PvP fine with 1st person view, and anyone who uses 3rd person view to gain advantage is just lame. Dont you agree? Besides killing someone in 3rd person view is really waaay too easy, just try to PvP first in 1st person view and after that in 3rd person view and you know what I mean.
Dont you think that just using the "I cant see in 1st person view when Im on fire!!1!1!" or "I cant PvP if I dont see everything that goes around me1!1!!!" as a reason not to play in 1st person view just fecking lame? If you cant PvP in 1st person view why dont you just get some skills or stop PvPing :D
Ever considered that some people might play 3rd person just for the reason the like it more? Not to gain "advantages". Everyone should be able to play the way they want, simple as that. If something SHOULD be changed, its to make 1st person more viable for the ones that want to play it by making the weapons smaller and stor fireeffect from blocking your screen so you dont see anything.
(Btw, I agree with Scikar, ever heard of productive arguments?)
Lets just say I would quit neocron if I had to pvp in 1st person. Neocron is a 3rd person pvp game and the combat is great right now. Why change it? 1st person with guns like lib and cursed soul would completely suck.
actually 1st person with a cs isnt too hard.. libby is practically impossible for me tho... dont think it is for a person used to it.
However, it also makes many positioning strategies impossible to execute and I think it also takes away from the immersive nature of the game. It feels more like you are manipulating a little puppet avatar rather than actually BEING in that character’s shoes.
Third person view is fine if you are in town or just exploring but I think that as soon as you draw a weapon the view should automatically switch to first person. Discuss.
If it makes the game more immersive for you then by all means play in 1st-person, however others may prefer playing 3rd-person. What if we were to reverse the argument and ask if 1st-person should be removed? *waits for flames*
Noone is forcing you to use 3rd, if you dont like it dont use it, instead of forcing other people to conform to your playstyle.
By the same token you could say everyone should play as *insert class here* because you prefer playing said class and other classes have certain advantages...
Promethius
06-09-04, 16:29
Doesnt matter to me since I never use 3rd person view..
So I think I will say YES.
Same, I've used 1st person for aslong as i've been playing this game. So I'm down with 1st person only. I'm sure alot of wat people consider 'good' PvPers would come out trash in 1st person. (works both ways tho, i tried 3rd person and , well lets jsut say i prefer 1st.) Although it would be fun to see for a few days, i dont think we should force players to use ONLY 1st or ONLY 3rd person view. Should be up to the runners chioce.
-Prom
i only play in 3rd and then i say no.
Wow now this is interesting. Most of people say that they will leave Neocron if they cant play on 3rd person view. Why? Because they cant hit shit in 1st person view. Doesnt that mean that we that use 1st person view and still are good at PvP and PvM would own teh fecking Neocron if we would switch to 3rd person view? I mean, we can hit you when we are burning, we dont die even if we cant see behind our asses, we cant shoot through walls with spells and we have that raycannon/gatling gun blocking 50% of our view. And still, we own your fecking asses.
Oh I can aim fine in first person view, but I simply prefer third. Being able to kill plenty in first person doesn't make you better than those who do it in third, it just means your preference is first. So what if you can aim with 50% of a cannon on your screen? So can I, and a lot of other people, but when I play a game I like to see everything so I can actually have some sort of fun; rather than staring at a boring black cannon half the time.
I always fought in 3rd person as Rabbi Fang
Why?
- Because it makes it easier to keep a lock
- If you make your character look down, you get a 360degree view
- It would be stupid to use 1st person and put myself at a disadvantage.
Neocron's 3rd person view is excellent - one of the best 3rd person views ive used in any game. Once you get to know your speed/ jump height/ Character, you are SO in control...
In spite of all that I have just said, I think it SHOULD be removed, but tanks would have to have their views sorted. Make that cannon take up way less space. Id rather have the cannon look out of proportion than get in the way.
-----------------------------------
Rabbi Fang
Back for NC2 open beta ( I think.....depends if i find a link faster than 10kb/sec)
3rd person should be removed
i've only ever used 1st person and many of you have had your asses handed to you. also if he hasnt already posted (not read entire thread) hivemind also only ever uses 1st person
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