View Full Version : Would u want to see a Complete removal of freezing in any form for NC2?
___T-X____
25-08-04, 18:34
MODS : Please can you merge this Poll with my other thread.
Polled because people still hate it and after 2 years its still shitty and nows probably the best chance to remove it once and for and all from the shops/pool for NC2.
I think its come a long way from the dark days of complete para spam. It's better now and I think they have the freq and range right the strength still needs to be worked on a tad.
If you don't wanna get frozen then carry the anti-shock drugs.
I think its come a long way from the dark days of complete para spam. It's better now and I think they have the freq and range right the strength still needs to be worked on a tad.
If you don't wanna get frozen then carry the anti-shock drugs.[ edited ]
Drugs are fine for the first five times in 60 seconds you're frozen.
not givin up trying to have it removed are ya m8 :lol:
but i voted yeah remove all the freeze shit it kills pvp
keep trying tx
I agree, remove it now while you have the best possible chance. Or make it work on mobs only, since some mobs are hard to hit if they arent paraed, like the little 100/100 bats in the crystal cave(Bat Queen).
[ edited ]
Drugs are fine for the first five times in 60 seconds you're frozen.
Whatever if you have nothing more to add apart from insult me don't bother.
They work fine for me to get outta trouble and heal etc, if they dont for you fine but cut out the flame.
[ edited ]
Drugs are fine for the first five times in 60 seconds you're frozen.
not taken sides here but ican see what hivemind means drugs are ok but after a few times of para it kinda pisses you off that you have used the rdy drugs in your qb.
now into the inventory to use the others coz some para whore is chasin you across the wastes :lol:
Shadow Dancer
25-08-04, 19:23
Drugs should stack at least, if para is going to stay in.
I think it should be removed. A cool alternative would be the para goes away if you get hit.
Btw, i've been hit alot recently by Holy Para and it doesn't seem THAT crazy. Still drugs need to stack, and there needs to be no flash IMO. Or make them cheaper, or just remove it. :p
But honestly, people should really be complaining about the melee shocker not the PPU freezer.
yeah remove it once and for all (preferably along with the whole ppu class :p )
Disturbed021
25-08-04, 19:34
I voted no. B4 you flame me hear me out :p
I really don't like being frozen and rarely use freezers of any kind, but the way the game is designed atm you need freezers in certain situations.
How are you supposed to stop fast-ass stealthing whores w/o freezers? Even with para and db spamming its hard to track and eventually killing a good rifle spy. They really really good ones are near impossible to kill. Entire clans can waste an hour and still not kill one little spy in one zone.
Take away freezers and the stealther is going to get away even more. Rifle spies used to not be too much of a problem. Good damage at good range was just a kind of nuisance at OP wars, so I'd say "let them just stealth its no problem." But now, with the lovely spirit mods, they are deadly. Letting them just stealth away freely to setup a good sniping position is a big mistake. Especially for PPUs. There is no warning that your shelter has been sniped off.
Again w/o being able to freeze and slow down the rifle spy they get a huge advantage with stealth. They can run halfway across a zone with a stealth 2 or 3 and with an oblit they will just vanish.
On my melee tank I have tried not to use freezers at all. I get really annoyed when all the newb melee users use the damn things on me so I figured "what the hell. I'll leave it in my gogo so I'm not tempted to use it."
And you know what happened? I was outside of MB and a PE pulls a Judge and starts shooting my melee tank.
So, I start running circles around 'em and hacking away with my PoB. I got the PE down to a little more than half health and they start running away. I chase after them hacking away at their back side but while I think I'm right behind the PE hacking at their back in reality they are about 10-15 feet in front of me, so I wasn't able to cause any damage until they stop...which they didn't.
Once they get to the zone line we hop back an forth a bit and b4 too long the PE was back to full health and shooting me again. Same thing happened. I got them to half health or so and they start running away from me to the zoneline and yet again I can't hit them because my range is short and I see them right in front of me on my screen running away but in reality they are just out of my range.
Needless to say this happened for maybe 30 mins when I finally decided to let the PE get me to half health and start running away from the zone line like I was scared of dieing. :angel: I hoped over a hill, kneeled down and waited for them to catch up and went buckwild slashing the shit out of them.
They finally did drop but only after I let them think they would be able to kill me. :rolleyes:
Again, melee is a bitch to actually hit a target that is moving away from you, not just because the range is short but because you see the person running away from you much closer to you than they actually are. A shocker would have ended that fight in about 2 minutes.
Those are just 2 examples off the top of my head.
Antishock drugs should be bought in stacks of 4 like stamina boosters and 1 stack of 4 should take up 1 QB slot. They should definetly nerf the melee shockers to hell and back. And even nerf the para spells again, but imho you just cannot remove freezers completely with the way the game is designed atm.
Of course.
Remove a game feature that annoys the majority of players and wrecks PvP? Bit of a no-brainer really.
I still think they keep it in to slow down PvP so the god awful netcode doesn't show up so much...but then I'm a cynic raised on accurate FPS netcode.
It's not a feature, it's a BUG!
Well it bugs everyone so ya.
:o
I voted no because thats what the drugs are for...
But instead of nerfing para more how about just reworking the drugs. Remove drug flash from the antishock drugs, and make the stack in 2's. 4 is way to much, my tank has 6 in his QB all the time.
If they did that you would find it more balanced out. Also drop the stuck to the floor shockers the melee tanks run about with. They already run fast enough u should be able to catch anyone over a zone. All melee tanks with shockers got to be nibs if they use a shocker.
BUT keep my 5 slot Holy Para. I love watching people just stop dead and find themselves looking up at the sky. It happens to me when i run out of anti shock or miss the key. But I dont cry about it, just when I get drug flash I get pissed at the stupid drug flash you get.
I see both sides of the issue here, but honestly, something needs to be done about para...
Drugs need to stack in your belt, they need to give no flash and they need to be cheaper... they also need to be made so that they will cancel out stealth like Anti-stealth drugs do, to keep stealth whores in line.
They need to boost the rifle and cannon freezers so they slow you down as well as holy does, but reduce the duration DRASTICALLY (I think a duration of maybe 6 seconds is enough for holy para, maybe less)... make para do what it was inteneded to! protect fleeing PPUs...
Crackitakk
25-08-04, 21:44
i think fighting with honor is a big deal, and i try to show honor towards everyone i fight except those who dont deserve it, there is NO honor in paralyzing of any kind in my opinion.....i usually run into pepper park and fight alone get parashocked, use the drug and win so it doesnt bother me.....i think slasher is prolly the only gun that does significant damage to ppus while they are healing
not givin up trying to have it removed are ya m8 :lol:
but i voted yeah remove all the freeze shit it kills pvp
keep trying tx
How does it kill PvP? Dumbasses try to gank me and my friends, they fail... They run... I shock them, we kill them. Without para they could escape their just punishment. Para stays! :D
I think freezing should only work on NPC's.
___T-X____
25-08-04, 23:13
It completely negates all the effort you put into setting your character up. A ppu and (insert class here) team doesnt win because of the ppu buffs, they win because the the ppu only has to spam para 3 times to know that the QB cant hold anymore Drugs in a pvp setup (at best). Its BS remove it in any form, or keep it just for NPC's
Yes.
I don't think that there's much more to add really.
..i..DemonX
26-08-04, 02:11
I think freezing should only work on NPC's.
Yeah that would be a cool way as well!
To the others:
Drugs stack in QB ... would be cool yeah (but may exploitable, dont ask me how just think so)
Drugs cheaper ... why? U realy think thats a need? :wtf: I not think we will lack in money in NC2
Rifle spies used to not be too much of a problem. Good damage at good range was just a kind of nuisance at OP wars, so I'd say "let them just stealth its no problem." But now, with the lovely spirit mods, they are deadly. Letting them just stealth away freely to setup a good sniping position is a big mistake.
:lol: Everyone is fine when spies have ZERO combat capability, but as soon as they become a threat everyone panics. Better not remove that all powerful para or spies might be DEADLY!! *gasp* A spy......deadly?!?!
Its easy to kill a spy without a para, I do it on my PE all the time. They cant see they are being dmg boosted while sniping, so it is only a matter of patience.
BUT keep my 5 slot Holy Para.
Nerf the melee tank, but not you because it fun having all the power. Makes perfect sense :rolleyes:
You can just take it away from one class and let another have theirs. Its all or nothing.
I voted no :)
..i..DemonX
26-08-04, 02:39
Its easy to kill a spy without a para, I do it on my PE all the time. They cant see they are being dmg boosted while sniping, so it is only a matter of patience.
Why u cant see a DB? And u ever fighted any good Spy's? I not gues u come from Pluto (yeah sorry its the only server i know good ppl from) but try to fight Demon or Casady with ur PE, i would like to see ya at this.
.hack//sign
26-08-04, 02:48
im not a huge fan of holy par but i thinks its been nerf enough to stay :rolleyes:
Remove it. Or at least make it pve only. its just annoying. It ruins the fun, it destroys pvp.
And to everyone saying "Theres Drugs against it, use em!"...
1. Most people just havent got free slots in there QB.
2. They dont stack.
3. They are damn fucking expensive.
4. They dont stack.
5. They are damn fucking expensive.
10. They give a damn fucking drugflash already if you only take 2 in a short amount of time. I.e. anti para and anti db. WHAM DRUGFLASH.
The drugs are completely useless. I've had opfights where i used up about 50 fucking anti drugs. Thats more than 100k. And dont forget they got a weight. On an APU with a decent resist-force, i cant carry many, so its the goguardian every some minutes to restock. Not to mention i have to access my inventory anyway everytime i used a drug.
:mad:
REMOVE IT!
Its easy to kill a spy without a para, I do it on my PE all the time. They cant see they are being dmg boosted while sniping, so it is only a matter of patience.Stealth, open inventory, pop anti-db drug, run away. If a spy dies to a PE, he sucks and deserves it.
But hey, spies dont matter here. This is about para. We dont need to know how you own spies and shit. :)
snore snooorreeee...... + spamity mc spamage spam... (to me). para is part of the game.. i used to play Counter strike and i thought it wos bad peepz moaning bout the AWP. but u guys with ur para's is just like...WWWWOOOO....
freezing is teh pwnage it makes me feel cooler when im in the canyons...
tomparadox
26-08-04, 04:31
para sucks, pls remove it. its to powerful as it is, and dont say "its a rare, so it makes it powerful" because the melees taser sucks, the spys rifle sucks, and there rares too...
i used to play Counter strike and i thought it wos bad peepz moaning bout the AWP. but u guys with ur para's is just like...WWWWOOOO....
If I didn't already have the most coolest signature ever, I would put that in as a quote.
Still disagree with you though. :p
Yes.
If the drugs really worked, then people wouldn't parashock. It's that simple. The fact that PPUs still 'waste their mana' on people can pop drugs shows that the drugs are ineffective. By the time they kick you've lost any advantage you had in a fight, by the third you're starting to get a drugflash, and that's assuming you have room for 3 in your QB anyway. Also interesting to note is that several of the 'use drugs' people are either A) PPUs and cast antipara at 70/min RoF with no ill effects, or B) Spies who stealth and then take the drug, using the stealth to avoid paraspam.
The fact that in a few minor cases parashock does have a point does not justify its use in ganking everywhere else, which accounts for 99% of its use. The stealth whore and someone running away from a melee tank highlight problems with stealth and problems with melee. That doesn't justify making every other class suffer parashock in general combat where it has no place.
Yes.. yes yes yes yes.. and im a ppu lol.
The ROF isnt as bad as ppl say, you still get a lot. Mana i dont wear PA and i can use 4 in a row wit ha booster popped and it still sticks u 2 the floor and lasts ages.
Needs BBIIGG work or to be destroyed.
Haven't seen a lot of people using it lately.
Pepper park used to be blue with parra, now i hardly ever see it.
No way, I just built a 3 slot Holy Para, I FORBID KK FROM REMOVING PARA!
Massacre**
26-08-04, 10:04
I think its come a long way from the dark days of complete para spam. It's better now and I think they have the freq and range right the strength still needs to be worked on a tad.
If you don't wanna get frozen then carry the anti-shock drugs.
I agree, stop moanin ya cocks... just carry anti-freeze, n00bs!
:angel: ;) :lol:
1st lvl drug too expensive ?!
This game need moneysink... too much ppl with many millions :o
Huh ? oh ... no... better idea i have :
Remove all drugs because it give too much power to junky.
Remove all drone because they can't be shocked by melee tank and kamikaze-drones are frightening.
Remove hack skill because i don't want to lose my belt in a funny pvp-party, hacker kill all fun in pepper.
Remove pool because it make you having weired idea like "Remove freeze" or "Remove PPU".
Remove this game from your computer too.
1st lvl drug too expensive ?!
This game need moneysink... too much ppl with many millions :o
Huh ? oh ... no... better idea i have :
Remove all drugs because it give too much power to junky.
Remove all drone because they can't be shocked by melee tank and kamikaze-drones are frightening.
Remove hack skill because i don't want to lose my belt in a funny pvp-party, hacker kill all fun in pepper.
Remove pool because it make you having weired idea like "Remove freeze" or "Remove PPU".
Remove this game from your computer too.
People who want Parashock removed don't want it to make this game more carebear, they want it removed because it removes all skill from PvP.
I prefere a SW:G combat system to the Neocron system with Parashock. It's actually more fun.
Massacre**
26-08-04, 10:28
do u not think that the games boring enough for ppus, most of them dont even wanna play ppu no more, they just get forced to by there clans because they are needed... don't remove para gives the ppus something else to do other than keeping fighters alive.
People who want Parashock removed don't want it to make this game more carebear, they want it removed because it removes all skill from PvP.
I prefere a SW:G combat system to the Neocron system with Parashock. It's actually more fun.
And what about holy-debuff and the anti-heal drone ?
Oh... no, of course, because it's the way you kill a should-be-nerfed-ppu.
Well .... mmm... add an anti-shock buff, anti-shock sanctum, or something. (and make ppu the ppu a bit more powerfull then).
No really... i don't understand you. I have a low-tech melee tank (i don't use thunderbolt). The freeze is NOT SO powerfull, i can play shocked and i don't use drug and/or anti-shock drug.
If you remove all freeze you'll give too much power to FAST people.
The freeze is usefull to kill a speedy-melee-tank.
The thunderbolt is usefull for a (melee) tank to kill a fast PE.
I think the main problem is the freeze effect on ability to aim, maybe KK should remove this effect. but shouldn't remove freeze.
Oh, and remove carebearness :D
do u not think that the games boring enough for ppus, most of them dont even wanna play ppu no more, they just get forced to by there clans because they are needed... don't remove para gives the ppus something else to do other than keeping fighters alive.
Tbh, I could care less. Para fucks the game up for everyone else, what do I care if PPUs get nerfed.
1st lvl drug too expensive ?! This game need moneysink... too much ppl with many millions
For the amount of drugs you have to use to effectively combat Para atm, it is too expensive. Yes there are people with lots of money, but not everyone has lots of money and they shouldn't be penalised by, quite basically, not being able to take part in PvP due to the fucking blue glue.
Huh ? oh ... no... better idea i have :
Remove all drugs because it give too much power to junky.
Remove all drone because they can't be shocked by melee tank and kamikaze-drones are frightening.
Remove hack skill because i don't want to lose my belt in a funny pvp-party, hacker kill all fun in pepper.
Remove pool because it make you having weired idea like "Remove freeze" or "Remove PPU".
Remove this game from your computer too.
Oh, I know. How about you get a clue, stop being so stupid and rather illogical then come back with a proper arguement. :rolleyes:
Clownst0pper
26-08-04, 12:31
Stuns in general just reduce the most talented player to nothing but a vegatable.
Remove it- Have at thee!
remove it from pvp but keep it in the pvm section only it's a very useful mob control spell
do u not think that the games boring enough for ppus, most of them dont even wanna play ppu no more, they just get forced to by there clans because they are needed... don't remove para gives the ppus something else to do other than keeping fighters alive.
PPUing is not boring at all. Whats boring as a PPU is having to be offensive by para and DB ppl at a OP war, instead of doing what ur supposed to do. Wich is indeed to keep people alive. If you don't like it, jusst dont play a PPU. I like playing a PPU, as the challange for me is to keep my team alive, and not to give the other team a hard time aiming and turning them into sitting ducks.
I hope the Para will be removed, along with the rest of the freezers/stunners etc. That DB is removed from the PSI weapon pool, and replaced with a tool thats only avalible for PEs. (with the same efect of a DB of course)
How does it kill PvP? Dumbasses try to gank me and my friends, they fail... They run... I shock them, we kill them. Without para they could escape their just punishment. Para stays! :D
melee tank vs apu or hc tank, melee tank gets para'd......... they are pretty far away, better get a bigger sword. :wtf:
thats how it kills pvp
___T-X____
26-08-04, 13:40
melee tank vs apu or hc tank, melee tank gets para'd......... they are pretty far away, better get a bigger sword.
exactly mate
melee tank vs apu or hc tank, melee tank gets para'd......... they are pretty far away, better get a bigger sword. :wtf:
thats how it kills pvp
Um... It's a MELEE tank! By that same token lets remove drones because a melee tank can never reach them. Remove stealth because a spy can get away and shoot from far away while the tank takes the time to close the distance. Let's remove ALL rifles, especially SH because of their damage output and range.
So tell me again how does PARA kill PvP? Melee is a pretty flimsy excuse.
I'd like to see a complete removal of all the threads asking for this :rolleyes:
I'd like to see a complete removal of all the threads asking for this :rolleyes:
I'd like to see a complete removal of all comments asking for removals of comments, but seeing as that would make me a hippocrite I fold. :p
yea remove em from pvp.
all kind of freezers suck tbh. They just take all skill away from PVP. Just practice.. get some aim and you`ll see that you can live without it and its much more fun to fight without crawling or being drugflashed nonstop.
How para could kill pvp someone asked. The thing is 1 ppu, 1 whatever class vs whatever else class, here's how it mostly works, the ppu will para you the second you show yourself right, then you have a dmg boost on you, then all it takes is IQ enough for the dmg dealer class to klick his mouse x number of times until you are dead.
Now lets say you the person glued to the ground is the best ever elit pk dude there ever was. Getting glued will for 100% end your leetness and your killing spree with or without your para drugs, cause all you have to to is throw another para until your drugs are all out and you have one hell of a hangover and killing you will be even easier.
Now lets say a world where you the leet pvp dude isnt glued to the ground, could in theory kill the dmg dealer with a little effort OR just get away, something that is impossible with lame ppu's who uses para instantanious the scond you popp up in local. It's not really like you need to para a spy or a apu if you have another dmg dealer with you.. A tank can take more blows but really it isnt that hard to kill ppl without glueing.
The only time I would remotely consider using para in a pvp situation is when I'm alone and there are more than 5 attackers, glue the most annoying one and run away.
That is why para could ruin pvp so many times. cause it doesnt take any skill what so ever from the attackers to kill you. It's like you get jumped by 50 ppl and you are on your own and then they direct you and say you suck, we owned you so bad, uuuu now thats skill :)
How para could kill pvp someone asked. The thing is 1 ppu, 1 whatever class vs whatever else class, here's how it mostly works, the ppu will para you the second you show yourself right, then you have a dmg boost on you, then all it takes is IQ enough for the dmg dealer class to klick his mouse x number of times until you are dead.
Now lets say you the person glued to the ground is the best ever elit pk dude there ever was. Getting glued will for 100% end your leetness and your killing spree with or without your para drugs, cause all you have to to is throw another para until your drugs are all out and you have one hell of a hangover and killing you will be even easier.
Now lets say a world where you the leet pvp dude isnt glued to the ground, could in theory kill the dmg dealer with a little effort OR just get away, something that is impossible with lame ppu's who uses para instantanious the scond you popp up in local. It's not really like you need to para a spy or a apu if you have another dmg dealer with you.. A tank can take more blows but really it isnt that hard to kill ppl without glueing.
The only time I would remotely consider using para in a pvp situation is when I'm alone and there are more than 5 attackers, glue the most annoying one and run away.
That is why para could ruin pvp so many times. cause it doesnt take any skill what so ever from the attackers to kill you. It's like you get jumped by 50 ppl and you are on your own and then they direct you and say you suck, we owned you so bad, uuuu now thats skill :)
That's silly. There ARE drugs to combat parashock. If anything, the drugs need to be slightly reworked to perhaps give you a brief period of immunity (can't be shocked while it's still in your system for like 60 seconds or something). But shocks take a lot of psi and are pretty slow now so you can't spam them.
The drugs are an in-game counter to the shock, so why not just go with it? What's this thing against using counter measures? If you don't want to use drugs to combat parashock, why don't we just remove everything? Remove all shields because we don't want to bother using anti-shield spells. Remove healing because we don't want to bother with anti-heal spells and weapons. Remove vehicles because we don't want to use anti-vehicle weapons. Remove poison and DB, those also have drugs that we don't want to use. I mean seriously! Instead of crying "NERF!" and asking to remove a feature, why don't you folks work within the game system? If it needs a bit more balancing, that's ok, but do not try to remove content from an already content-free game simply because you're lazy to think of alternatives.
No im sorry but you are silly if you consider the drugs to be of any use other than 1% chance of escaping before the next para hits you. If it gets reworked maby it could work, but then again why not just remove the para from pvp if the drugs work so good that para isnt needed cause everyone eats the drugs?.
There is no reason whatsoever to be using para in combat other than your a chicken shit and really need to win badly.
Remove the flash and allow stackage of drugage then it be cool.
JustIn_Case
27-08-04, 14:02
Remove the flash and allow stackage of drugage then it be cool.
Agree! If the drugs are usable, then para can stay. They way the drugs are today they are useless you are 1 meter from an zone border, and how fun is that?
yea remove em from pvp.
all kind of freezers suck tbh. They just take all skill away from PVP. Just practice.. get some aim and you`ll see that you can live without it and its much more fun to fight without crawling or being drugflashed nonstop.
yup yup.
hell even if you cant aim dont be a lamer and just die :p
QuantumDelta
27-08-04, 20:59
yea remove em from pvp.
all kind of freezers suck tbh. They just take all skill away from PVP. Just practice.. get some aim and you`ll see that you can live without it and its much more fun to fight without crawling or being drugflashed nonstop.
He said it most susinctly and best.
No im sorry but you are silly if you consider the drugs to be of any use other than 1% chance of escaping before the next para hits you. If it gets reworked maby it could work, but then again why not just remove the para from pvp if the drugs work so good that para isnt needed cause everyone eats the drugs?.
There is no reason whatsoever to be using para in combat other than your a chicken shit and really need to win badly.
But that's the point! Not everyone eats the drugs! Not everyone carries them and not everyone can afford them or you might catch someone without their drugs. Adds an element of additional risk to PvP AND creates a VALUABLE money sink.
Dribble Joy
27-08-04, 22:27
*sigh* this is the 3rd time I have pasted this.
I am ferverently against para, I loathe it.
Any and all forms of shocking renders an opponent virtually unable to fight back.
Where speed was once no defence against peoples aim, para means that the para victim cannot target the shocker, in addition the victim is reduced to a crawl where even the most hopeless of people can strike them without effort, also rendering their ability to escape null.
PPUs do not NEED para, noone NEEDS para.
Get rid of it, no drugs, no resist psi thing, no special armour or 'para-stealth'.
Free up those QB spaces for something that might just (shock horror) help make the fight FUN (heaven forbid).
___T-X____
27-08-04, 22:36
Get Rid, It Doesnt Add Value
greendonkeyuk
27-08-04, 23:03
lol youre the thread starter you pisshead. you already said that.
Freaky Fryd
28-08-04, 00:18
Haven't seen a lot of people using it lately.
Pepper park used to be blue with parra, now i hardly ever see it.
I was having fun this morning on my PPU in PP, until the para came out.
1 APU, 1 Hybrid, 1 HC tank and 1 rifle spy against me.
I was being debuffed, damage boosted, dev'd and holy lightning'd but it wasn't a problem until they brought out the para. I didn't die, but I did have to leave PP a couple times due to para...
Para really changes any balance there is in combat...
Get rid of it, or make it only work on NPCs...PLEASE!
EDIT: I haven't carried a para in my quickbelt for over 7 or 8 months, except for a point about 2 months ago that I tried out my melee setup, and wanted to see if the para would help me be able to kill people :lol: That only last a week, and it was re-retired to my apt again...
I was having fun this morning on my PPU in PP, until the para came out.
1 APU, 1 Hybrid, 1 HC tank and 1 rifle spy against me.
I was being debuffed, damage boosted, dev'd and holy lightning'd but it wasn't a problem until they brought out the para. I didn't die, but I did have to leave PP a couple times due to para...
Para really changes any balance there is in combat...
Get rid of it, or make it only work on NPCs...PLEASE!
well you know people just have a thing about PPUs in PP
Think about it, certain classes live by the speed they run at, pistol spies for one. With para still in place, we suck at dealing damage, we suck at hitting, we suck at taking damage, and guess what, suddenly we suck at running too.
Remove it.
Para was a major reason I stopped playing the first time around, and now that I haven't logged in for almost a month again after a few months back, it's again the reason. I only came back because I saw para had been nerfed to the point that no one was using it. Lucky me, they boosted it back up.
Anyway, I'm gone until it is. Again.
Shadow Dancer
28-08-04, 00:36
Think about it, certain classes live by the speed they run at, pistol spies for one. With para still in place, we suck at dealing damage, we suck at hitting, we suck at taking damage, and guess what, suddenly we suck at running too.
Remove it.
Pistol spies suck at dealing damage????? What NC are you playing? :p
My point is that spies excel in nothing save the speed they run at - APUs have damage/aim, tanks can take so many hits. PEs dont excel at anything, but they are the all-round class. Spies may deal decent damage, but that's not what they were designed for. Para negates this only major plus we have over other classes: speed.
Shadow Dancer
28-08-04, 01:42
Spies have stealth. :p
They can also cast shelter with a drug. :p :p
And executioner deals very high damage. :p :p :p
Think about it, certain classes live by the speed they run at, pistol spies for one. With para still in place, we suck at dealing damage, we suck at hitting, we suck at taking damage, and guess what, suddenly we suck at running too.
Remove it.
Yeah, exactly, some classes live by their speed. Which means they can go and gank and if they bite more than they can chew, they can run away before you can kill them (Especially the damn spies that can stealth as well and considering TSS is so useless, it's like the ultimate escape maneuver). So without para, folks who do NOT have the same speed will have very little chance to kill those fast ones. At the same time, if you're worried about your speed, carry a damn drug! I mean seriously people! Parashock now takes a LOT of psi to cast and takes a long time. It cannot be "spammed" anymore. It was changed a LONG time ago! Just give it a rest, it's a decent little device now to help fight annoying stealthing spies and PEs (No real point on wasting the time or psi pool using it on tanks or monks).
rubaduckythug
28-08-04, 09:21
Take all freeze spells/weps away. you get 2 ppus or even one for that matter and have them constantly para you in 3 second intervals your screwd with even jsut one combat enemy vs you. dosnt matter how many anti shocks you have your not getting away. calculate the time it would take you to go 15 meters in game to saftey or a zone while poping as many anti shocks as you can as fast as you can while ast being para'd 2 times for every one anti shock youve taken and being attacked by any 3 combat class's and youll mabey make it about 3-5 meters... well thats my say on that matter
-=BlackBeard=-
28-08-04, 10:14
dont remove freezers
make them pvm only
Um... It's a MELEE tank! By that same token lets remove drones because a melee tank can never reach them. Remove stealth because a spy can get away and shoot from far away while the tank takes the time to close the distance. Let's remove ALL rifles, especially SH because of their damage output and range.
So tell me again how does PARA kill PvP? Melee is a pretty flimsy excuse.
thats why i said hc tank aswell it dont really matter what class it is a hc tank becomes a turret, a person using para on a melee tank is just sad coz you know by the time the tank has crawled towards you he is dead, and the reason stealthers do that is coz they aren't for close combat :rolleyes:
Yeah, exactly, some classes live by their speed. Which means they can go and gank and if they bite more than they can chew, they can run away before you can kill them (Especially the damn spies that can stealth as well and considering TSS is so useless, it's like the ultimate escape maneuver). So without para, folks who do NOT have the same speed will have very little chance to kill those fast ones. At the same time, if you're worried about your speed, carry a damn drug! I mean seriously people! Parashock now takes a LOT of psi to cast and takes a long time. It cannot be "spammed" anymore. It was changed a LONG time ago! Just give it a rest, it's a decent little device now to help fight annoying stealthing spies and PEs (No real point on wasting the time or psi pool using it on tanks or monks).
I think you need to try using those drugs just a little bit more. Parashock cast time is almost exactly the same as the time it takes for the drug to kick in. You can shock someone, start the next cast while they're still shocked and popping a drug (guaranteed hit), the drug kicks in, your cast finishes, they're shocked again. As Birkoff said, it might use a lot of mana but you can still do that six times in a row.
Parashock isn't used as a 'decent little device', it's used for ganking, plain and simple. In the old days, people didn't need shocks to gank. It was fun having Starkes about because you saw him in local and ran like fuck to get away. Today, you don't even see anyone in local. You get the blue beam out of the sky as your first warning (and sometimes, if the PPU does the dodgy switch spells trick you don't even see a beam), then there's an APU or Tank on top of you, fully buffed. You can't run, you can't fight, all you can do is die. It's no wonder people like Jack Scratch complain about gankers - it used to be at least somewhat exciting for the victim, now it's just fucking stupid.
The only time I can pop an anti shock drug vialy without losing the little aim i can grasp IS when I'm running under stealth, so that completely negates the point that para is useful for these situations. What Scikar said: its used for ganking 90% of the time, not for these dream tactical situations.
maggotcorpse
28-08-04, 20:53
Have no Problem with freezers or without freezers. But when the fun comes back with removing of Freezers then hell yes. Remove this Crap :D
I think you need to try using those drugs just a little bit more. Parashock cast time is almost exactly the same as the time it takes for the drug to kick in. You can shock someone, start the next cast while they're still shocked and popping a drug (guaranteed hit), the drug kicks in, your cast finishes, they're shocked again. As Birkoff said, it might use a lot of mana but you can still do that six times in a row.
Parashock isn't used as a 'decent little device', it's used for ganking, plain and simple. In the old days, people didn't need shocks to gank. It was fun having Starkes about because you saw him in local and ran like fuck to get away. Today, you don't even see anyone in local. You get the blue beam out of the sky as your first warning (and sometimes, if the PPU does the dodgy switch spells trick you don't even see a beam), then there's an APU or Tank on top of you, fully buffed. You can't run, you can't fight, all you can do is die. It's no wonder people like Jack Scratch complain about gankers - it used to be at least somewhat exciting for the victim, now it's just fucking stupid.
*sigh* My GOD people! I DID say that the drugs DO need some fixing. I didn't deny that the drug is simply not good enough. But why don't we friggin FIX something in-game instead of removing 2 items from the game?! (The para AND the drugs). The game has very little content as is without all the whiners asking to remove something. Just fix the shock drug so it's worthwhile to use!
Or HELL! Maybe put MORE content in the form of anti-shock items! Perhaps add some more expensive devices or items or what not to negate or protect the player against shock. Why does a useful tool (Yes, SOME of us use it as a defense tool, not for offense! Some of us play a *gasp* DEFENSIVE PPU!)
Why does a useful tool (Yes, SOME of us use it as a defense tool, not for offense! Some of us play a *gasp* DEFENSIVE PPU!)
Either you're lying, or you're the only one in the game.
i mainly play a offensive ppu and paraspams the shit out of ppl when i can.
I love it.... and atm ppl run way to fast for this game to be able to handle it....
KK know it, thats why kk wont listen to you cs kiddies...
remove para? sure but also speed nerf all chars by 33%
Or learn to aim.
Too bad the skilless vocal minority have to fuck it up for everyone else.
Dribble Joy
29-08-04, 00:07
People really don't run that fast.
If I, one of the worst PvPers ever to disgrace the name of PvP in NC can hit someone with 110 agl/atl then I am sure you can too.
Freaky Fryd
29-08-04, 00:19
I'm horrible at aiming (partially due to computer, partially due to me), which is why I generally don't duel and just snipe instead.
Runspeed is fine. I'm a fast bastid and I still get hit, and even I can hit fast people during the rare time I duel...
Freezing ruins fast paced pvp. I mean, imagine it. You suprise your enemies from behind with your squad, fire a few rounds at them, hide behind a crate to reload, you dash as quickly as possible away from it as it blows up, you duck behind a corner, fire a few rounds, then decided to make a run to the building on the other side. You dash for it, placing some bullets in your chasers BAM PARASHOCKED FROZEN BY PPU MONK (you then see your health goto 0 and a bunch of green stuff hit you) YOU ARE DEAD. Damn, thanks for ruining some good pvp fun. Hell, I even drew a picture captivating the true intensity of a battle, then getting ruined by freezing. -=BlackBeard=-'s idea for freezing in PVM only would be great too though.
http://server5.uploadit.org/files/kinssink-noirecorefight.JPG
Was made in about 5 Orange Goblin songs off of The Big Black.
Oh my god... That picture sure is weird...
Well anyway, if you guys are just whining that someone killed you because of freezer or parashock, get some skillz.
Yea and that means I voted NO.
Or learn to aim.
Too bad the skilless vocal minority have to fuck it up for everyone else.
yes im suuure thats why kk havent changed para much in all these years... o_O
___T-X____
29-08-04, 10:26
Can this thread get some Stars to help it get seen. I'd had put it in Fluorecent if I could.
i mainly play a offensive ppu and paraspams the shit out of ppl when i can.
I love it.... and atm ppl run way to fast for this game to be able to handle it....
KK know it, thats why kk wont listen to you cs kiddies...
remove para? sure but also speed nerf all chars by 33%
Speed already got nerfed big time once. No offense but just learn to aim.. :o
Clownst0pper
29-08-04, 12:12
Ya know, I find most PPU's actually will parashock you just for kicks.
As they themselves know how badly it fucks you over, they just do it on purpose, even if they arent running away, or dont have anyone else with them.
PPU's = Lamers :p
Dargeshaad
29-08-04, 15:43
Ya know, I find most PPU's actually will parashock you just for kicks.
As they themselves know how badly it fucks you over, they just do it on purpose, even if they arent running away, or dont have anyone else with them.
PPU's = Lamers :p
wow i agree
QuantumDelta
29-08-04, 18:31
Either you're lying, or you're the only one in the game.
Oy! :(
That's not fair..
You should know how I'd play PPU :/
I used to para people just to piss them off but thats just the kind of person I am, frankly, I don't give a damn.
Look at the poll. I am sure the arguement to remove PE stealth was much closer so if they dont remove PvP freezing.... :mad:
Shadow Dancer
30-08-04, 05:01
Funny you should say that StrongSad. I don't remember many people asking for complete removal of stealth from PEs, yet KK did it.
Even more of a reason to have PvP freezing removed :D
No.
Simply because we're not on CS... :D
Original monk
30-08-04, 11:42
Funny you should say that StrongSad. I don't remember many people asking for complete removal of stealth from PEs, yet KK did it.
i remember people asking: me :P
freezers stay in, simple as that, been said loong time ago
be glad they nerfed em to hell allready
if ya meet a freezing ppu ya dont like: yust keel em :)
i pitty the people that keep and keep whining to get that spell out of the game, they must be really bored :/
Glue is what holds the world together :-)
Shadow Dancer
30-08-04, 18:57
i remember people asking: me :P
I said I don't remember "many" people, I didn't say I don't remember any people.
be glad they nerfed em to hell allready
If they were "nerfed to hell", they wouldn't be used all the time.
if ya meet a freezing ppu ya dont like: yust keel em :)
You can't always kill the ppu. I'm talking about good ppus, i'm not talking about that special one time your cousin's father's friend's brother's daughter killed 5 ppus with her mid-level PE using a nailgun.
i pitty the people that keep and keep whining to get that spell out of the game, they must be really bored :/
by the looks of the poll thats alot of bored people who would like to see the removal of ALL TYPES OF FREEZERS not just para.
im one of them :D
Doc Holliday
30-08-04, 19:15
You can't always kill the ppu. I'm talking about good ppus, i'm not talking about that special one time your cousin's father's friend's brother's daughter kill 5 ppus with her mid-level PE using a nailgun.
But but but........ she really did. :angel:
Shadow Dancer
30-08-04, 19:18
lmao Doc, I KNEW someone was gonna say that. :D
Speed already got nerfed big time once. No offense but just learn to aim.. :o
yes they did but do you also remember why?
bakc in the days there where no soft cap or any cap on speed... tank with most con points in atl would warp all over the place....
remember when me and casius where chasing this god damn uber pk lib pe around grant...
not fun... he was warping all over the place...
think megaman used some uber atl setup back in the days too...
You could be standing around and all of a sudden you would take dmg o0
ps. well it was fun to be able to run full tilt with your cs out in those days :D
ps. well it was fun to be able to run full tilt with your cs out in those days they should bring that back :angel:
___T-X____
09-09-04, 22:37
You Missed One....
Doc Holliday
09-09-04, 22:49
lmao Doc, I KNEW someone was gonna say that. :D
:) i had to back that quote up mate. i fell off my chair when i saw it.
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