View Full Version : A Worry About NC2
I'm sitting down here thinking about gaming magazines, like PC Format, PC Gamer, PC Nudists, and I get to thinking "how are these mags going to rate NC2?".
Think about it, these magazines have somewhat of a duty to look at a game and objectivly review it, giving it good marks and bad marks.
Now, one of the things they are going to do is to compare NC2 directly with NC1, to note any changes, so one of the things they will do is ask themselves "is NC2 really a totally new game, or an addon for NC1?".
If they review it and find that it is so similar to NC1 that it cant really be an brand new game, just an upgrade, they will list that, and that will go badly for NC in the reviews.
They might also be the same people that have been watching NC for quite a while, and might notice "mechs, hack net, stock-x" were all supposed to be part of NC1, so again, that could go badly for NC.
So the question that really needs to be asked, is NC2 so far different in visuals, items, skills, gameplay that it really can be deemed as a sequel and not just an upgrade? Cause remember, the mags that review it, if they feel its just an upgrade and not a totally new game (or ranks enough to be called a new game) they will probably rank NC2 badly in the reviews, and at the same time they will be reviewing SWG, AO-AI, and might do a total comparison between the three.
.hack//sign
29-07-04, 00:52
seems to not be much of a new game...
TheGreatMilenko
29-07-04, 00:53
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I'm not so bothered about magazine reviews. They were quite favourable last time (mostly around 80%) so I expect they'll be close to that again.
NC seems to have attracted people by word of mouth rather than reviews though. It's not like a single player game where you need good reviews to shift lots of initial units because that's where all the money is.
If - and this is currently looking a little too dubious for my liking - KK and BB get some reasonable advertising going then word of mouth should do the rest. It's still the only MMORPG with an FPS system, and the only one with a decent sci-fi setting.
It's all up to see. I think the DX9 improvement will interest gaming magazines but it's hard to say how the review will end up to be... As NC2 or NC1...
Can't know yet.
It's still the only MMORPG with an FPS system, and the only one with a decent sci-fi setting.
SWG - Jump to lightspeed is bringing in a FPS type system with JTL, only its not groundbased, its in space like in tie fighters and stuff, so NC might be in direct competition with SWG.
I think a big question i have is....was that trailer the new engine or no? Cause if it was, i don't think thats a very big graphical difference. Now if it means new engine as in, running better, doing processes faster, then i'd be all for that, but i think that trailer doesn't impress anyone as a visual improvement. I also agree lexxuk, a lot of the stuff that you would expect in a sequel is just more of the same. THat said, they felt i think that this was the second birth of the game, justifying the nc2 label.
rofl I didnt see any reveiws for NC1(at least in English Mags) what makes you even think they will reveiw it...I havent seen ANY hype except here and the sneak peaks on gamespy...
SWG - Jump to lightspeed is bringing in a FPS type system with JTL, only its not groundbased, its in space like in tie fighters and stuff, so NC might be in direct competition with SWG.
It might be, but I doubt it. I never related the early X-Wing/Tie games with say Doom or Quake. They're very different styles of game.
SWG will no doubt cut into NC2s playerbase but hopefully not more than it did to NC1.
I'm generally feeling quite optimistic about NC2. I've no idea why; NC has some truely brilliant features and ideas, but it also has some utter wank, and KK can be shockingly cack-handed when it comes to 'fixing' problems.
Far more than reviews or competition I worry that KK won't be brave or bold with NC2. I'm not expecting it to be feature complete on release, but I'll be very disappointed if it doesn't at least point the way to some consistent vision for the future of the game.
rofl I didnt see any reveiws for NC1(at least in English Mags) what makes you even think they will reveiw it...I havent seen ANY hype except here and the sneak peaks on gamespy...
i did......got 83% in PC zone iirc
A game that can't be dicussed here I looked at there screen shots :) and Neocrons new textures look a damn lot better so I think it will rank higher
The only write up I ever saw about Neocron was in some top 100 list and that was for its red light district (Pepper Park to the rest of us) and the nude octagonal girls you could find there.
Ghanima :angel:
I think a big question i have is....was that trailer the new engine or no?
I don't think so, as I was in at least one of the fights used in the video. The beta hadn't started at that point, and if it had the chances of me getting to touch it before 1st Sept are absolute zero (kk hate me boohoo :( ).
If I'm wrong, and it was, I have to wonder what they've been doing all this time :lol:
I think perhaps bits were - the wastelands looked a bit nicer generally, and the water looked more 'DX9'. By contrast the fights looked older rather than newer than current NC.
Basically I dunno, but I guess a mix :D
NC had the niche of being the only cyberpunk fpsmmorpg in existence, its a fact that KK has never managed to exploit, being the only game in a genre should have given KK mass amounts of customers, the servers should have been falling over themselves with 2000 people on each server and threads sayin "we need more servers"
Instead, KK never managed to get around to pushing NC into the market place properly, and now we see more of the same, 1 advert in a german magazine, which i guess is ok if they are only releasing the game in germany.
Releasin the game as NC2 is in my opinion, nothing more than a marketing ploy to detract from the fact NC1 is dead in the water, they want to try to get back the people who left, the people who played NC1 and thought "man this sux" to lose the reputation as a game where new players are ganked constantly by capped runners, and so to do that, they will market NC2 as a totally new game, but if the magazines dont feel its a new game, they will punish the marketing ploy.
Shadow Dancer
29-07-04, 02:52
I agree, I too worry that NC2 will be criticized for being called a sequel by the gaming magazines. I mean look at it, same classes, 90% of the same areas as "part one", 90% of the same weapons(i'm sure their will be new weapons), etc...........
Personally I still see it as an expansion. Not that that's a bad thing, I'm just calling it how I see it.
I agree, I too worry that NC2 will be criticized for being called a sequel by the gaming magazines. I mean look at it, same classes, 90% of the same areas as "part one", 90% of the same weapons(i'm sure their will be new weapons), etc...........
Personally I still see it as an expansion. Not that that's a bad thing, I'm just calling it how I see it.
Agreed, But how can we really judge it now kk hasnt revealed all the cards , all the new stuff coming into the game ect . only time will tell what it will be viewed as
Going by what is stated on the website, there will be a lot of new things in NC2, so I'll wait and see.
That will be a special bonus. All I want is to be able to play NC again because I simply love the game. The only reason I can't get myself motivated any longer is because I doubt I can carry an existing char over to NC2
I can't wait to start NC2 and start building up my chars again
I just wish they would hike up the advertising. Will we be buying the game online direct from KK? Have not seen the game advertised in any of the big (or small, or any) online games stores.
One plus NC has got against competiors (except one who is not really a competitor if you delve a bit into the background), is that it is the only game of its kind on the market, and for a long time to come. And it is a good game.
A lot of people were playing Lineage2 (crap) because of the PvP and then moved to CoH (which is a short term fun game, I heard). All of those people are out there lusting for a game that NC2 would satisfy. Unfortunately most of them won't even know NC2 exists :(
Shadow Dancer
29-07-04, 03:40
Martin(or Odin? I forget :p) already said you can carry your chars over. :p
Well why don't we compare what is added in a typical MMO expansion to why NC2 will bring to the table (if we can accurately judge what that is)?
Well why don't we compare what is added in a typical MMO expansion to why NC2 will bring to the table (if we can accurately judge what that is)?
The only real sequel MMORPG I've seen in both forms in Lineage. There are a few others - EQ and AC spring to mind, but there aren't many and I haven't seen them enough to comment.
If NC2 is as much of a leap forward graphically from NC as Lineage 2 was from Lineage it would be better looking than quake. I doubt this will happen, especially as KK have yet to show us any proof the new rendering engine works and it's a month to launch.
NC1 appeared in PCGAMER (US), three times.
The third time was a brief mention that KK has an expansion called BDOY coming out soon to upgrade graphics and content for Neocron.
The second time was as already mentioned in a top100 listing. NC won for it's "mature" content, ie red light district.
The first time was an actual review of the game, this was way back not long after US Retail Release. I don't remember what the rating was, but I do remember it being lower then the UK version of PCGAMER's score for NC. From what I recall the review was really enthusiastic about the game, you could tell they liked Neocron, especialy the refreshing fps pvp. Then as they always do, they added the... But. At that point the review ripped NC to pieces with all the bugs/crashes/lag/imbalances/general incomplete feel. He summed it up by mirroring what most of us have said many times, that NC felt like a Beta product, which is a shame since it had so much potential.
*That* is NC2's biggest hurdle imo. If it ends up being just the same NC with extra goodies, and still full of crashes/bugs/problems then it's game over. We had patience with KK through NC because we believed DOY would fix our problems. I don't think most of us will have much patience to stick it out if DOY is just as bad.
{MD}GeistDamnit
29-07-04, 06:10
I'm sitting down here thinking about gaming magazines, like PC Format, PC Gamer, PC Nudists, and I get to thinking "how are these mags going to rate NC2?".
Think about it, these magazines have somewhat of a duty to look at a game and objectivly review it, giving it good marks and bad marks.
Now, one of the things they are going to do is to compare NC2 directly with NC1, to note any changes, so one of the things they will do is ask themselves "is NC2 really a totally new game, or an addon for NC1?".
If they review it and find that it is so similar to NC1 that it cant really be an brand new game, just an upgrade, they will list that, and that will go badly for NC in the reviews.
They might also be the same people that have been watching NC for quite a while, and might notice "mechs, hack net, stock-x" were all supposed to be part of NC1, so again, that could go badly for NC.
So the question that really needs to be asked, is NC2 so far different in visuals, items, skills, gameplay that it really can be deemed as a sequel and not just an upgrade? Cause remember, the mags that review it, if they feel its just an upgrade and not a totally new game (or ranks enough to be called a new game) they will probably rank NC2 badly in the reviews, and at the same time they will be reviewing SWG, AO-AI, and might do a total comparison between the three.
this is what I been trying to say since the announcement, but nobody listened :(
KK are making a big mistake renaming the "addon" to a sequel, and it will show in sales. If it is stable netcode no crashes, sure they will stay afloat but you wont see MJS on the fortune 500 any time soon :p
4 times, there was a one page Ad picture i belive < i worked at the factory where pc gamer was printed ;)
I could really not care if they agree its a total new game or not. If they review the game it will bring new players, even a bad review. In fact if they really just trash the crap out of the game it will cause people to come take a look more then if they just give it a soso review. Bad press can be just as good as great press. On the othere side middle of the road reviews or press brings you almost nothing.
So love us or hate us is fine as long as they talk about us.
I don't think most of us will have much patience to stick it out if DOY is just as bad.
I'm going to attempt to be forgiving, which doesn't come very naturally. The initial release may well be quite buggy with some exploits. I can't think of a single MMORPG release that hasn't thrown up a few embarressing glitches once the game has gone retail.
What I'll be watching, and will determine if I keep playing, is how KK react to these issues. If they get bug fixes out quickly, fix exploits (and I mean fix not patch with a brick wall) and show they have some ideas for new content, then deliver on them, I'll probably stick around.
If they ignore the bugs and imbalance issues like they're happy to do with NC, or try to balance them with their usual sledgehammer subtlety (yay anti-buff and spirit ammo) then I guess I'll lose interest in a month or two and do other things.
If the NC2 visions is as good as the NC vision was, I'll be happy. If the following support and content management is as poor I'll be disappointed and probably leave.
Don't know how game mags handle MMORPGs in America/England but in Germany they are covering these game with mostly half a page whre 50% of the space is occupied by a picture. I was looking for the SWG review and it was just half a page. Lol, half a page for a gfamouse ame that costed 20 millino bucks to make? DAoC seams to get better coverage, don't know why.
DAoC has/had more subscribers than SWG and a MUCH higher retention rate.
Did they really spend 20 mil on SWG? How?
Clownst0pper
29-07-04, 11:48
Your correct Ryuben, Neocron did get 83% and is still played by one of there writers.
It also scored very well in all game magazines, but didnt pull in the crowd.
PCzone still intend to review it, and preview it extensivly in the comming issues.
@ Lexxuk- another issue is player classes, or lack of- its something they will always pick on.
rofl I didnt see any reveiws for NC1(at least in English Mags) what makes you even think they will reveiw it...I havent seen ANY hype except here and the sneak peaks on gamespy...
Loads of mags did Neocron: PC Format for example.
pc format gave nc a rating of 82%,i still got the issue,and said nc was one of the first mmprpg shpipped in a playable state,apart from the odd fre
Well I think NC2 will be tripe to be honest.
It will be an addon which most people will see most of the 'extra's within the 1st week and then be rather bored.
Its' looking like its basically a repackage of NC1 with a few extra's that any other game would implement with a patch and they are trying to make their last ditch attempt at getting some cash out of the public before shutting the doors and leaving the community with a skeleton ghost ship crew for fixing a bug now and then 6 months after it was introduced.
The trailer didnt impress me - i saw a few cosmetic changes, and im now well versed in the reakktor pack of lies / string along treatment.
I do like the game, but thats because there's no real alternative at the moment.
If an NC clone was created thats very similar - i'd probably be playing that now.
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