View Full Version : [Threads Merged]High Cliffs
See here! (http://neocron.jafc.de/showthread.php?p=1492944#post1492944)
Bout time this was taken into account!
many a time i've crashed leaving NC gates only to find myself up on the cliffs, now crashing is classed as an exploit :rolleyes:
rofl i remeber a fight at grant, about 10 of us ended up there after we zone crashed.
doesnt help having spawn points on the highest mountains :rolleyes:
no but there is a difference in crashing and staying up there and crashing and then ask for help to get down.... and you know it lexxuk
ok, to what degree does this count ?
Are we allowed on the first stepp if we can get there with a hovertech or on foot ?
if i get up there, i jump down, but i got no proof i crash landed on the cliffs when it happens, and anyone can take a screenshot of person X on top of the cliffs without knowing how person X got up there, then those that didnt crash to get up there could say "i crashed".
Magic Sausage
26-07-04, 17:44
SO what is going to happen when people start flying there gliders up there...
Sry you guys are exploiting... Temp Ban... WTF...
just a couple of points.
1) this was stated a few months ago it was wrong
2) redesign the cliff edges around the nc entrance as its possiable to get ontop of the high cliffs there and ontop of the nc city.
ok, to what degree does this count ?
Are we allowed on the first stepp if we can get there with a hovertech or on foot ?
To my knowledge, the first and second steppes can usually be gotten to through legit means like a hovertech or finding a place where it's possible to jump up. The third steppe is simply impossible to get to unless you either crash or use other less-than-legit means to get up there.
--Stryfe
Yes Tycho C
that answers my question :)
I don't think they will be as harsh to accept a screenie as proof of exploit. Maybe a couple that has them shooting from up there yes. But i'm sure common sense will be used to stop people doing this.
How about putting an invisible sloping brush along the top of the cliffs, so anyone who ends up on the top of the cliffs will just slide off?
How about putting an invisible sloping brush along the top of the cliffs, so anyone who ends up on the top of the cliffs will just slide off?
and make a new sliding animation too, hehe, that would be cool.
many a time i've crashed leaving NC gates only to find myself up on the cliffs,Huh? You can get up there by driving a Hovertec around the back of the zone. I've done it before - you end up there accidentally if you visit Einstein half the time. How is that considered an exploit?
The cliffs near Mil Base that surround the zone, that makes sense, but the entrance to NC? Why would that be an exploit?
Dribble Joy
26-07-04, 17:49
There is a part of the cliff near MB where if you jump at the right place, you can get onto the 2nd lvl, but not the third.
Is this included in the exploitage?
It is a map error, dunno what can be done about it.
just a couple of points.
1) this was stated a few months ago it was wrong
2) redesign the cliff edges around the nc entrance as its possiable to get ontop of the high cliffs there and ontop of the nc city.
True, but that isn't the problem area. The problem is Grant Mine and Military Base. I can't count the number of times I've been at MB chasing around a BD or TG rifle spy, only to have him disappear and reappear on top of the cliff.
And quite frankly, I'm tired of sending in screenshots of people up there only to see them still doing it a day later. Maybe a few temp bans will wake people up.
It's possible to get on most high "impassable cliffs" through non exploiting means.
Sometimes it means as much as 5 zones travel.
Magic Sausage
26-07-04, 17:51
So now i have a question to carbonite...
If I can find a area on the third layer cliffs you can drive a hovertech to... will this new rule be lifted?
At the neocron gates you can actualy walk to the top of the cliff O_o invisible walls would be the best way to stop this all around the map.
The game mechanics should counter people trying to abuse other game mechanics in relation to this exploit me thinks.
Invisable walls are the thing i hate most in games :mad:
they actually make me angry!
Invisable walls are the thing i hate most in games :mad:
they actually make me angry!
used in this context they shouldnt annoy you, as you shouldnt be behind them ;)
so are these the cliffs that mainly surround the wastelands (with the three stepps) or cliffs like the tezla bridge, on top of canyon reload point, on top of mc5, etc.
that announcement is far too vague to be of any help to the community.
Freaky Fryd
26-07-04, 18:17
I can remember getting up onto the super high cliff at Grant Mine, but it was sometime last year and I can't remember how, although I don't think it was through crashing...
:wtf:
As for the one above the Neocron city gates, I thought it was easily accessible by going a few zones over and working your way back - no hovertech needed, just footwork. I could be wrong...but if I'm not, then they're not counting that cliffline, as you can get up there by normal means...
Again, it's been a looooooong time since I tried, so it might have changed, or I could just be wrong...
Gah...maybe I should just go to bed...
:p
(12 noon here and I haven't slept yet)
I can remember getting up onto the super high cliff at Grant Mine, but it was sometime last year and I can't remember how, although I don't think it was through crashing...
:wtf:
As for the one above the Neocron city gates, I thought it was easily accessible by going a few zones over and working your way back - no hovertech needed, just footwork. I could be wrong...but if I'm not, then they're not counting that cliffline, as you can get up there by normal means...
Again, it's been a looooooong time since I tried, so it might have changed, or I could just be wrong...
Gah...maybe I should just go to bed...
:p
(12 noon here and I haven't slept yet)
No your right, there is a place east of the gate where you can walk up the cliffs and get on top, as for by grant mine there is also a place where you can reach the top by hovertec as for the mil base the only way I've seen is sometimes when you crash you end up there unless there is a cheat being used thats the only way.
It's possible to get on most high "impassable cliffs" through non exploiting means.
Sometimes it means as much as 5 zones travel.Well i think this annoucement is mostly about all the snipers up on the cliff in J_01. Its nearly impossible to level a noob out there anymore, youll get sniped so damn often. Even the normal pkers are gone. o_O
NC Gates: You can walk up it without crashed
Grant Mine: Need to crash while going in zone to get up it
One of the zones near CatLock: Need to crash to get up it
MB: You need to use a form of an exploit to get up it. Which this exploit has been around since this game has been out and yet they haven't fixed it...
But it is possible to get to most places by finding the right spot with a hovertech and trave a few zones. So Carbonite how are you going to temp ban someone or ban someone for this? You really need to watch someone the whole time and see how and if you dont nothing can be proven
Freaky Fryd
26-07-04, 18:44
You really need to watch someone the whole time and see how and if you dont nothing can be proven
Well, all they really need is screenshots of the person doing stuff up there.
If I submitted a single screenshot of you standing up there, yes, you might have crashed, so they may overlook it...but if I submitted 5 screenshots of you firing from up there, or doing other actions...well, it's kinda hard to talk your way out of that...
:D
how do you classify something an exploit that will have action taken against u when it happens almost every time u zone crash, which funnily enough in this game is 1/4 times every time u zone.
-Crono
Well if you get up there without using an exploit and using a HoverTech then nothing can be done. And if they say "You cannot be up there at all" Thats just gay, Its in the game its only land to stand on and if others can get up there with a hovertech then there shouldnt be a problem.
There is one spot in the MC5 zone where you have to hit the mnt. just right to get up it with a hovertech, if you dont then you arent getting up there. Then you have to travel around one layer and have to time it right to get on the 3rd layer. Then you just sit up there and snipe people that go in to mc5 :-p
Fear my Spirit mod SH!
sanityislost
26-07-04, 19:05
So using a hovertech around TG to get on the high cliffs is an exploit?
thats evil.....
SiL ..:..
Magic Sausage
26-07-04, 19:07
And as I said... What are they going to do when the gliders are in the air... NO WHERE will be unassesable... (forgive me if I can't spell)
Freaky Fryd
26-07-04, 19:11
I wonder why that chair is up on the TG cliffs if no one is supposed to be up there to sit in it...
:lol:
Heres an idea why not make all high cliffs acessible on foot problem sorted
Put back fall damage into the game - so if you screw up getting up there, it's going to cost you a belt.
Completely unrelated to this thread:
sanityislost, your sig makes me want to vomit, then makes me hot, then makes me want to vomit again, from left to right, respectively. Can we have more of the middle please? kthx :D
Completely related to this thread:
I'm pretty sure this exploit enforcement is in-place to stop snipers/droners from killing people in a place where they can't be reached by someone in the class of a melee/pistol class combat player. But on that note, being a droner for almost two years I learned how to get into *many* places, including these high cliffs in some zones, with a hover, so I hope that the GMs are reasonable in their disgression.
Heres an idea why not make all high cliffs acessible on foot problem sorted
Then where would you zone to when there's no zone at the edge?
Put back fall damage into the game - so if you screw up getting up there, it's going to cost you a belt.
That becomes a real hassle for the number of times you crash leaving NC, crash leaving Gaya mines, etc. I personally don't want to stand around waiting for a GM to get me down - however there's always /set reset_position 1, so maybe that idea isn't so bad... but the elevator in TH is soooooo long :p
Uh, i can drive to the 3rd ledge on MB with my hovertech. so if i drive on a hill now its an exploit? sweet....
Uh, i can drive to the 3rd ledge on MB with my hovertech. so if i drive on a hill now its an exploit? sweet....
Erm thats possible?
I have tryed that on a hovertech cos I have seen people up there but noway could I drive up there even with a good run at it
hmmmmm good and bad idea at least it wont leave any vantage spot for droners / snipers ect but outlawing something that happens by chance because of a bug in the gameis stupid . I agree with the idea of putting the invisible wall up all around these cliffs so if you are up on the cliffs because you crashed you have to call for help.
More incompetence by ReaKKtor...
Going up on the high cliff's surrounding the entire neocron world is infact an exploit, as you cannot go up there by normal ways.
We will take serious action towards players caught up there.
Umm, its your game? you wrote/write it? you fix it ;)
Another example...
Due to a widely used exploit, the experience points gained from the repair skill have been greatly reduced until a fix for the exploit can be applied.
Great, no way to lvl monk dex! woot!
But wait, we can't program so.....lets disable even more stuff in this already neglected game....
Since the XP reduction seems ineffective, the Remote Repair Tool has been disabled until further notice.
How much more incompetant can one company be? :lol:
Magic Sausage
26-07-04, 19:40
Here is Statement Number 1...
Gotterdammerung CopBot (Moderator) Join Date: September 2003 Posts: 2,038 Any area accessable by a droner is accessable by anyone else. If he uses foot power or hovertec it's not like he can't be gotten to. Should you make a personal choice to play a character where you have no points spec'd for vehicles then that is your choice, but just because you can't drive up to a spot and get him doesn't make it wrong. Also, if you feel that you have found something that is actually an exploit please follow the procedure for reporting it. The policy for discussing things of this nature on the forum is crystal clear.
Here is Number 2
Carbonite ACG Join Date: February 2003 Location: Jerico's Posts: 214 Going up on the High Cliff's Going up on the high cliff's surrounding the entire neocron world is infact an exploit, as you cannot go up there by normal ways. We will take serious action towards players caught up there. (Link to the Support Policies) http://www.neocron.com/index.php?na...ndex&pageID=195
Make up your minds
Erm thats possible?
I have tryed that on a hovertech cos I have seen people up there but noway could I drive up there even with a good run at it
there is one spot u can drive up.
Do it, right now, and show us a screenshot of you on the high cliff at MB with a hover.
As far as I know it can't be done since they nerfed vehicle speeds.
How about putting an invisible sloping brush along the top of the cliffs, so anyone who ends up on the top of the cliffs will just slide off?
Would be easier to move the respawn points on a crash, and then put a toxic field up top that kills really quick.
t's possible to get on most high "impassable cliffs" through non exploiting means.
There is no where on the map where you can get up onto the top of the map (on the zone boundries) where you can legally get up to. It used to be that you fell off the end of the world and it threw you up there, but they put boundries in place. Now you can only do it by cheating.
You can get up to mountains easy where they aren't on a boundry line but then so can everyone else. As I read it they are only pointing out the map boundry hills.
Do it, right now, and show us a screenshot of you on the high cliff at MB with a hover.
As far as I know it can't be done since they nerfed vehicle speeds.
You can get a hover up there but only illegally. You couldn't even drive up there when the speed was linked to your FPS.
Do it, right now, and show us a screenshot of you on the high cliff at MB with a hover.
As far as I know it can't be done since they nerfed vehicle speeds.
if i do it now and take a screenie ill get banned :rolleyes: :p
/edit: uh archeus, do you even know what you are talking about? i went there just now, but im not posting the proof until i get official response i wont get banned :p
You couldn't even drive up there when the speed was linked to your FPS.
Lies. :) Anyone on Uranus who paid my spy, Bus Driver, for a ride somewhere got scared shitless as I raced across zones, over 3-level cliffs, over everything. I would pile them into my red car, point it in the right direction, look straight down, and tromp on the gas. I could drive a person to Tescom in well under five minutes. My only concerns were solid obstacles, and I was pretty good at driving around them at insane speeds. No cliff/mountain/hill ever held me up, including MB/TG 3rd level cliffs. I shot straight up them without a hitch.
Can't do that now though...
Would be easier to move the respawn points on a crash, and then put a toxic field up top that kills really quick.
.
hahah i like that idea the best toxic field of doom .
Great, no way to lvl monk dex! woot!
O_o So how did 15,000 other monks since the beginning of retail cap their DEX? Oh, right, by doing it the long and hard way you're *supposed* to do it since it's not a primary skill :rolleyes:
Your sentence should read:
Great, no [super easy] way to lvl monk dex [without even having to sit at my computer]! woot!
Granted, I agree KK should've taken the initiative to fix the exploit rather than bypass the actual bug and disable an entire aspect of the game, but at this point, I'm running out of hope for NC/NC2 and can only hope that NC2 'fixes' many of these things. If I can't remote repair a vehicle for the next few months until NC2 comes out in trade for NC2 being so much better, cool. If that ideal doesn't hold up, I'll probably just split *shrug*
More incompetence by ReaKKtor...
Umm, its your game? you wrote/write it? you fix it ;)
wow its my game ?!? damn i didnt knew it was my game, i just work here (volunteer work i should add)
Carbonite can you tell me if i will get banned for posting screenshotf of me up there on my hover? getting there LEGALLY?
Would be nice if some mid map hills say in canyons were more easyily ascessable by foot.. so snipers do play a role (doesnt make too much sense sniping on flat open ground:P ) and if they can go by foot (hills get modified) so can the people wanting to kill em... but it would be nice to be going up the places we all stare at day in, day out without a need of a hovertech.
This btw doesn't relate to the outer map boundry hills.
Dargeshaad
26-07-04, 21:01
Does this mean I can report ppl with pictures I've taken months ago?
I mean how can you tell they're not taken today?
Carbonite can you tell me if i will get banned for posting screenshotf of me up there on my hover? getting there LEGALLY?
well he just said getting up ontop of the cliffs at map edges is an exploit I don't think the ones around the map are there to be climbed really
wow its my game ?!? damn i didnt knew it was my game, i just work here (volunteer work i should add)
Well wouldn't you agree that those who DID write it, should be able to edit their own program Carbonite? Rather than adding to the list of "disabled" things?
Or would you go the same way and just disable items for an unknown period? (Bearing in mind your probably bound to was you can/can't say)
*Apologies for stating it was your game
well he just said getting up ontop of the cliffs at map edges is an exploit I don't think the ones around the map are there to be climbed really
then they should make them unclimbable (if thats even a word), they basically said everyone up there is exploiting, which im not. there is a lowering in the 2nd ledge near the MB bunker, if u get good speed and hit that lowering, u will get up, no matter what. I will keep going there until they fix that map so i cant go there anymore. if i drive there legally they cannot ban me..
if i do it now and take a screenie ill get banned :rolleyes: :p
/edit: uh archeus, do you even know what you are talking about? i went there just now, but im not posting the proof until i get official response i wont get banned :p
Yes. There is no where you can drive to the very highest cliff legally. Even with the FPS linked to speed you could make it almost to the top but would fall down again.
If you can do it legally page a GM and show them (if they let you).
Actually the only place off hand I can think of where you can get to the top by walking is the NC main gates. But then how many droners do you see PK'ing around there?
Even with the FPS linked to speed you could make it almost to the top but would fall down again.
I'm telling you, dude, you're wrong. I went up there ALL. THE. TIME. on a hover, red car, and chaincraft. I couldn't get a tank or APC up there though. Maybe back then, your FPS wasn't as good as mine...
Yes. There is no where you can drive to the very highest cliff legally. Even with the FPS linked to speed you could make it almost to the top but would fall down again.
If you can do it legally page a GM and show them (if they let you).
Actually the only place off hand I can think of where you can get to the top by walking is the NC main gates. But then how many droners do you see PK'ing around there?
read my previous post, go to MB, get a hovertech and try. you will see that ur quite wrong.
then they should make them unclimbable (if thats even a word), they basically said everyone up there is exploiting, which im not. there is a lowering in the 2nd ledge near the MB bunker, if u get good speed and hit that lowering, u will get up, no matter what. I will keep going there until they fix that map so i cant go there anymore. if i drive there legally they cannot ban me..
Seriously, some people are missing the point. If you go up there 'legally' and you like, take some scenic pictures or something and come down, no harm no foul, I'm sure nobody will even know. But if you do up there and start picking off people... that's where the problem lies.
It's *what* you do in these 'exploit' places most of the time, not *how* you got there.
And again however, I do agree that if my droner can get there in his hover - tough shit to those who can't shoot me.
Mmmm, using a hovercraft to get to the 3rd cliff at MB is the only way I have ever done it. Didnt know you could exploit up there on foot :p
I like this ruling... if it only applys to world edges.
from what I understand if you can get up there by foot or by hovertech by going up an incline or driving real fast and swooping up on top it is not an exploit. I dont' see where the problem lies in that. If you can prove you got up there by the legal means then there should be no problem at all.
Magic Sausage . . . gliders aren't even out yet. Right now we don't have gliders so it doesnt' apply. When gliders do come out though everyone will be able to access all sorts of areas on the map. If you exploit and get up to a very high cliff that people can't reach without exploiting then this rule would apply. When gliders come out this won't be a problem as someone can just fly up there and take out the person. Currently Exploit. Future it will not be.
As for the make up your mind thing I think carbonite means the very high impass cliffs that are impossible to get to without exploiting. As the legal means was asked and he said it was alright. If you can get up there legally by a hovertech there should be no problem.
Magic Sausage
26-07-04, 21:56
The thing I was trying to point out is that even now its not a exploit because you can get there by regular means.
So why make a rule that even there current argument will be shot down by in a month.
if you can get there by regular means and prove it then as I've said there should be no problem. If you can get to all the cliffs that everyone say are exploited by people by regular means and record in fraps to prove how you got there legally then fine we can talk about the rule not meaning anything. But till a video is produced for all possible considered exploits of getting up high cliffs we can't really discuss this further. :\ I've never tried too much to get up really high cliffs so I guess I can't really comment on how hard it is. I saw someone mention about geting on top of CRP but that's so easy to get up and requires no exploit what so ever. I didn't know you could get up on top of neocron gates by legal means . .hmm .. and if you can get up with a hovertech onto the very top of the mb cliffs hmm . I dont' know. I guess they'd have to prove they can do it.
I think you should change the game and cut out the exploits instead of just saying "Oh well if you do that blah blah blah you'll get a ban because our Dev team cba to fix it, we'd rather take the easier step and just outright ban you for our mistakes"
Also change the spawn points from on top of mountains, but that does'nt mean change the spawn points to a Grim's spawn point.
So if i send in the screenshots of countless sniper spies on top of cliffs now you will do what and how can you asure me that your actually doing something about it? Or do i have to take your word on it?
Put back fall damage into the game - so if you screw up getting up there, it's going to cost you a belt.
o_O so brammers, every time i zone crash and end up logging in on the other side of the zone i was going to, and on top of the cliff, i will also lose a belt? rofl :D it is alwready punishment enough that we are far from where we wanted to be and may be banned/suspended due to a game bug that is common as hell rofl
-Crono
So if one is accused of this exploit will they be given a chance to show the GM's how they got there by regular means?And if they can show how they got there and no exploit was involved no action taken?If they cant show you how they got there with out exploiting then take what ever action is needed?
As you can get to many places in this game which are real high if you know where to go where to jump etc,etc...
Lucid Dream
27-07-04, 00:18
Heh i would assume they have the ability to put up invisible walls, as newbie MC5 is surrounded by them =p But, what with DoY coming, its possible they have something new in mind for that, and its way way more work then its worth to go around adding invisible walls everywhere..
how can they make a rule like this?
Only way to get up there is because of the flaws of the game, most people that get there, get there by crashing.
And how are they going to separate Crash from Exploit?
The runner maybe didnt know that it was an exploit? Because i don't remember anyone saying that you are bound to check the offical announcment forums frequently.
I dont agree witht this. Due to lag/sync/crash issues, their have been numerous times I've ended up on the cliffs.
I dont agree witht this. Due to lag/sync/crash issues, their have been numerous times I've ended up on the cliffs.
So you have no problem jumping down then. Its the people who are sitting up there droning and others have to lag/sync/crash to get to them.
Well this is for learning purposes ONLY! :-p I'm not responsible for what is in this picture :-p
Oh btw this was hard for me to get the hell up but its Possible meaning, whats this?, its not exploiting
It's not about crashing.
It's about people who are deliberately abusing the game engine to be able to get into the high cliff and snipe/drone people from it while beeing completely safe (as the only way to get there is to use the exploit as well).
That cliff is the devil, Neg 32 SL on my sniper from killing one person :-\
To bad no one could find my ass to get my spirit modded 5 slotted SH :-p
Ok WTF do people not understand ? right its an exploit if you get on top of high cliffs that can't be got to using normal means by onfoot hovertech. Everytime I see one of these posts from a GM mod or DEV we get the same shit like WTF sweet so I Will be banned for crashing OR great I will be banned for driving a hovertech up a cliff :wtf: You people are not stupid so don't act stupid if you can get there using proper game tatics then fine but if you use an exploit to get there then you will be banned I know one such exploit I won't post and as far as I know it has allready been reported.
edit: another thread that made me want to bash skulls is the one where a DEV/GM/MOD posted anyone exploiting to get into sealed up areas would be banned. People where arguing if its possible then why the ban? simple really KK put a fucking wall there to stop you so don't try to go over it NCPD for example
i compleatly get you man, but what got to me was "anyone cought up there will have action taken against them" Not saying anyone abusing it or anything. If i crach and end up ontop of a cliff i dopnt just jump off, i go where is most convienent, the game messed me up and threw me on the other side of the map, im not jumpin on the wrong side of a mountain divider :D
-Crono
Oh btw this was hard for me to get the hell up but its Possible meaning, whats this?, its not exploiting
You can get a craft up there by exploiting as well. Proves nothing. Do a movie.
errr why don't they just add invisible walls so the exterior cliffs around the neocron map can't be gotten to. Adjust any of the respawn points.
Well this is for learning purposes ONLY! :-p I'm not responsible for what is in this picture :-p
Oh btw this was hard for me to get the hell up but its Possible meaning, whats this?, its not exploiting
Fuck, I stand corrected. Thanks. This puts a whole new spin on this.
KK, you need to address this with some invisible walls or something, or this new rule is dead in the water. I don't see how it's enforceable when you can still drive up there.
Well alot of these high up places can be gotten too only with a hovertech most of this is done by getting up an easy cliff to drive down it so you got alot of speed to get up the next. I got a nooob droner when hes lvled I will go where ever the hovertech lets me easyly and if someone DM's me saying I'm exploiting I will show who ever I need to too on how too get up there
The fact that you can get there with a hovertec is irrelevant
there are places in Neocron where due to the same kinds of bugs, you can stand in places where you can hit high-level mobs all day long and they can't touch you. That's an exploit too.
This is a game, not a contest of 'outsmart the devs'
To quote a mod a long time ago (forgot which one, may have been Niddhog):
"Do you ever consider that places are made inaccesable for a reason? Barriers are not obsticles (SP?) to overcome"
in other words, just because the map maker made an error doesn't mean that it isn't an exploit to EXPLOIT that error on his part.
in other words, just because the map maker made an error doesn't mean that it isn't an exploit to EXPLOIT that error on his part.
an error that they havent fixed for years mind you....
they should just put a huge castle wall there, like they do with everything else.
an error that they havent fixed for years mind you....
they should just put a huge castle wall there, like they do with everything else.
:P because there prob wont be many if any fixes that require lots of map reworking untill NC2 :D doubt they will spare that much time for that.
Anyone have any idea why everyone always plays the fool when it comes to old exploits. "Wha, how is my dumb ass supposed to think and stuff and realize that was an exploit all by my self"
Its like they need their hand held and have no logic portion of their brain where they could think of what may or may not be an exploit. That GM is absolutly right, everyone always acts like since there was a game messup, something that happens in most games (but most games have the attack where they just hit u, cover doesnt help)
-Crono
It doesn't matter if you can get there on hovertec or not. It's the edge of the world, you're not supposed to go there. It's not as though people are going to be randomly out driving and accidentally drive up the cliff at the edge of the map and then get a warning for exploiting. To get up there, you have to either be bugged, or you want to get up there.
of course i want to go there, i always seek towards hills on my droner. the point is, anyone can get there. to kill me they need to spec 25 vhc skill, i dont call that exploiting.
however, ive been killed several times by people without vehicles, so you can only guess how they got there.
i guess i should find myself some lower area hiding spots, since everyone knows where i am now :p
Or you can just pick the hills which you're supposed to be climbing and just avoid climbing to the very top of the ones at the edge of the world...
How about this ... at grant mine we were looking for a dronner .... and could not find him .... zonning in I fataled as I sometimes do at grant , and found the dronner on the cliff top .... kiled him and destroyed his hover tech up there ....
Question ... I understand he could get up there same way as me by accident, he obviously exploiting as this is not accessable to everyone and I found him by chance. How the hell did his vehicle get up there ... I mean hell when i fatal i move away from my vehicle, unless there is a way to actually drive up there, in which case , is this still and exploit ?
your vehicle wont transfer if you fatal, so he wasnt exploiting.
your vehicle wont transfer if you fatal, so he wasnt exploiting.
Not true. As I said you can get a craft up there by exploiting as well. It proves nothing.
I can fly a drone up there and shoot from there...is that exploiting just as much as getting a person to shoot from there?
metalangel
27-07-04, 11:51
Oh come on, if you had a chicken farm and there was a hole in the fence, would you wait to kill every fox that came through the fence and ate chickens, or just fix the hole?
*is reminded of Todd Flanders' piggy bank: PLEASE DON'T STEAL FROM ME*
It's not *THAT* hard to get up there, is it an exploit to go on the roof of the MB?
Oh yeah, level monk dex the proper way? By using the fucked mission system that doesn't work, you mean? O_o
Imho it's not hard to get up there using normal means- a hovertec can get up there with ease.
So if you put too much throttle on your HT while trying to get upto the 2nd ridge... *Temp kick*
Edit: I'd make a movie but it'd get me banned :( but i'll see if I can do one on the TestServer.
Not true. As I said you can get a craft up there by exploiting as well. It proves nothing.
you also said you cant get up there legally, which you can, so im not taking you seriously anymore.
you also said you cant get up there legally, which you can, so im not taking you seriously anymore.
Except for the NC gates area, there is no where on the boundry map you can just drive up to.
But please feel free to post a movie showing you can do it.
Except for the NC gates area, there is no where on the boundry map you can just drive up to.
But please feel free to post a movie showing you can do it.
in military base you can, as ive said countless times. and sure, if you want to host a movie for me ill go make it when i get home from work. if i can do it with the 3 fps i get from fraps :(
"Climbing the high cliffs surrounding the Neocron World by using an exploit to be able to snipe/drone with little to no risk of dying yourself. Added 07/26/2004" Dont drone or snipe or shoot from up there as you are in a place where you cannot be reached
Come on be real about this, what would do up there besides shooting ppl that cannot shoot back at you?!?
i know there are places where you can get up there.
I really think that in all fairness, if there's a way to get up on those cliffs without crashing your client it needs to be blocked off before people start getting in trouble for running or driving somewhere.
no but there is a difference in crashing and staying up there and crashing and then ask for help to get down.... and you know it lexxuk
Is it an exploit, if like right near the enterance to NC city, and somewhere near TG (forget where, but you can then get to behind Tg, etc.) you can get to these places legitimately? say with or without a hovertec?
Considering it has been stated by KK staff/ GMs that if one player can do it legit imately, we as players cannot call it an exploit...
lol 7 pages, sorry for the late post :P
i also remember where you can get up in TG, if any GM's want to know, to prevent it, PM me.
Freaky Fryd
27-07-04, 15:23
Come on be real about this, what would do up there besides shooting ppl that cannot shoot back at you?!?
i know there are places where you can get up there.
Okay Carbonite, assuming you mean without exploiting/bugging...then I don't understand what the program is, unless it's just not possible to get a target box on someone while they're up there (like placing a turret in a place it can't be targetted)
I fully understand people not being allowed in places that you can only get to through bug/exploit, but if I can just walk up somewhere, or even drive up there, and while I'm up there sniping, people can see me and get a target box...then what's the issue?
If they want to shoot me, then they have to come to me (or come closer)...it's no different than me outranging someone with my rifle - I can hit them, they can't hit me until they come closer... (unless I'm just not understanding something)
Seriously...if I'm not getting something, someone please explain it to me if I'm not understanding the issue...
Okay Carbonite, assuming you mean without exploiting/bugging...then I don't understand what the program is, unless it's just not possible to get a target box on someone while they're up there (like placing a turret in a place it can't be targetted)
I fully understand people not being allowed in places that you can only get to through bug/exploit, but if I can just walk up somewhere, or even drive up there, and while I'm up there sniping, people can see me and get a target box...then what's the issue?
If they want to shoot me, then they have to come to me (or come closer)...it's no different than me outranging someone with my rifle - I can hit them, they can't hit me until they come closer... (unless I'm just not understanding something)
Seriously...if I'm not getting something, someone please explain it to me if I'm not understanding the issue...whats not to understand, you can stand up there fire at person, and kill them easy, when they fire back, you just take a step back and they have zero chance of hitting you
I have plenty of good droner spots in other zones where people cannot get to and kill me without a hovertech, just like the one in MB that are nowhere near the map border, if i can still stand on those, then what is the difference?
whats not to understand, you can stand up there fire at person, and kill them easy, when they fire back, you just take a step back and they have zero chance of hitting you
that is called taking cover, hardly a crime is it.
I have plenty of good droner spots in other zones where people cannot get to and kill me without a hovertech, just like the one in MB that are nowhere near the map border, if i can still stand on those, then what is the difference?
that is called taking cover, hardly a crime is it.not if the over person is unable to get to you,[ edited ]
Nice and Simple, Its asked you do not do it, So do not, Do not push it, Just don't... I mean is it really that hard. and As always No means No :lol:
not if the over person is unable to get to you, [ edited ]
so any person with a vehicle, able to get on a cliff you cannot run to, is supposed to go down so he can get killed by the morons without vhc skill.
[ edited ]
Freaky Fryd
27-07-04, 15:32
whats not to understand, you can stand up there fire at person, and kill them easy, when they fire back, you just take a step back and they have zero chance of hitting you
Yeah, and?
I can do that with any hill, or just by stealthing...what's your point?
APUs can hit people on the other side of the hill with their beams/halos without the other person even being able to see/target them...doesn't that sound worse than what you said?
Freaky Fryd
27-07-04, 15:33
not if the over person is unable to get to you,[ edited ]
Under what I said, the person can...go read it again.
LagWarrior
27-07-04, 15:34
"Climbing the high cliffs surrounding the Neocron World by using an exploit to be able to snipe/drone with little to no risk of dying yourself. Added 07/26/2004" Dont drone or snipe or shoot from up there as you are in a place where you cannot be reached
Come on be real about this, what would do up there besides shooting ppl that cannot shoot back at you?!?
i know there are places where you can get up there.We are real about it.
As you say: One can get up there by regular means without using exploits. So, if there is a sniper up there killing other runners or trying to do so, the runners being attacked can also go up the cliff and hunt the sniper. If they cant use a hover or dont know the way up, its a pity, but not an exploit.
I cant see the problem. And what about stand alone hills inside a sector? There are a lot of places, which can only be reached with a hover. If my runner hovers up a hill, sniping runners with no vhc-skill. Is that forbidden, too?
Questions about questions.
Peace & out
Nice and Simple, Its asked you do not do it, So do not, Do not push it, Just don't... I mean is it really that hard. and As always No means No :lol:
See, that's crap. Statements like that really put me on edge. You aren't my mother, and I'm not 10 years old. You want people to do something, you need to give a good, valid, justified reason - ESPECIALLY when the problem is due to shitty mapping or code, not due to people actively trying to beat the system.
"Because we said so" just doesn't cut it.
I am a person who regularly sent in screenshots of people on the hill at MB because I was told "It's an exploit because you can only get there by crashing your client". Not that I'm hearing that you can drive up there, I feel like that's bullshit.
If you can get somewhere to snipe or drone that doesnt require exploiting you should be able to use that area, if KK dont want people using certain areas that they can access now they should put some way of blocking people from betting to those areas and not just say its an exploit dont do it.Mods saying do as your told doesnt cut it either.If it isnt exploiting the game mechanics I dont see why people should be just told that it is and not to do it.
Freaky Fryd
27-07-04, 15:53
Nice and Simple, Its asked you do not do it, So do not, Do not push it, Just don't... I mean is it really that hard. and As always No means No :lol:
Going up on the high cliff's surrounding the entire neocron world is infact an exploit, as you cannot go up there by normal ways.
We will take serious action towards players caught up there
Okay, assuming that the people that say you can get up there my walk or even with a hover are correct, that means Carbonite is incorrect (or doesn't consider walking/driving a "normal" thing)
So, maybe we should be asking why we can get in trouble for doing something that has been labeled incorrectly.
From what I've seen/understand, it's no different than you telling us that going on the roof of Medicare can only be done by exploiting so we can get in trouble for being up there, when I can easily jump up there. Why should I get in trouble over something you guys don't fully understand & haven't taken the time to research?
Now, if the people that say it's easy to get up with or even without a vehicle and without bugging/exploiting are incorrect, then I fully understand why I could get in trouble for being up there...but if they are correct, then it's you guys that are in the wrong for trying to get us in trouble...right?
I think the APU spell targeting thing is also close to an exploit.
I don't mind the AOE, but i've had apu's kill me when i couldn't even see where they were.(behind hilltop)
I must say it's about damn time this was classified as an exploit. "Climbing the high cliffs surrounding the Neocron World.." <-- I guess that means all cliffs like J01 etc. and not only the one at oz station? If so, good.... :rolleyes:
EDIT: I also want to know why it's classified as an exploit now when it wasnt before, I remember me whining about ppl going on top of the cliff hills and the only reply I got back from a moderator/gm (cant remember) was something like "get your own hovertech and do the same".
Yo Carbonite!
Are you talking about just the high cliffs or are you including the two lower cliffs?? :p I just want to make sure I'm not doing something wrong.
Trent
I think its just the Top level, as you can get to the 2 lower levels by hovertech.
Read the other thread on the subject where carbonite has posted.
"Climbing the high cliffs surrounding the Neocron World by using an exploit to be able to snipe/drone with little to no risk of dying yourself. Added 07/26/2004" Dont drone or snipe or shoot from up there as you are in a place where you cannot be reached
Come on be real about this, what would do up there besides shooting ppl that cannot shoot back at you?!?
i know there are places where you can get up there.
Carbonite, I REALLY Really hate to point this out to you but. in the statement
"Climbing the high cliffs surrounding the Neocron World by using an exploit to be able to snipe/drone with little to no risk of dying yourself. Added 07/26/2004"
It says:
Climbing the high cliffs surrounding the Neocron World by using an exploit
So therefore you are able to be up there but arent allow to exploit up there. So meaning you must have a Vhc. with you when your up there otherwise you know that person exploited to get up there.
Oh and
what would do up there besides shooting ppl that cannot shoot back at you?!?
A tank can snipe you with a rav and a CS, a spy can hit you as well. So can a pistol PE, oh and an APU can hit you as well if they are on the 2nd layer.
Answer my Email Carbonite!!!!!!!!!
Q`alooaith
27-07-04, 19:41
and there are many, many places where you can simply walk up the side of the cliff's..
what'll happen when flying vehical's come in?
and there are many, many places where you can simply walk up the side of the cliff's..
what'll happen when flying vehical's come in?
Most likely the rule will be removed at that point. :p
Most likely the rule will be removed at that point. :p
Most likely there will need to be some reworking of the maps.
Magic Sausage
27-07-04, 21:59
You'll be happily flying around and hit a invisible wall...
Your Vehicle will blow up...
And you'll die from the fall.
Q`alooaith
27-07-04, 23:11
falling damage has been removed for some time MS
Yeah, and?
I can do that with any hill, or just by stealthing...what's your point?
APUs can hit people on the other side of the hill with their beams/halos without the other person even being able to see/target them...doesn't that sound worse than what you said?
Yes it does, and is!
I want an official word on why monks using beams, etc that allow this havent been banned.
Why is it not wrong to be able to cast on someone when they cant hit you, but its not ok to sit on a hill and shoot.
I mean if they had given even a small amount of thought to how they designed the map borders, rather than the very unrealistic and ugly 3 hill border, then we wouldnt be having these problems, dont forget its NOT THE PLAYERS FAULT.
Players go wherever the map allows them. if the map is badly done we cant be blamed, but hey just like these guys to turn around and say its our fault their hills are wrong.
Q`alooaith
27-07-04, 23:19
they could raise the hill's so they are just a more slope up to the top of the skybox, then you'd never be able to walk on top of them.
Magic Sausage
28-07-04, 04:23
I know that falling damage has been removed... the thrilling adventures at TH with the elevator was broken was proof enuff.
But if they bring it back to prevent people from climbing the ridges...
Fly... Crash... Fall... Die
I was bored today so I made a video of me on a hovtec legitimately driving fast and getting on the 3rd tier cliff. It's the one that connects to the west side of the MB zone. The video, unfortunately, is 5fps, but it shows how and where to drive and aim for, and also what zone. It's about 3 megs but I don't have a host for it. As stated before, the rule says something to the effect of "getting up there by an exploit". If I can prove that getting onto the mb cliff is possible without an exploit, can I do it? Not that I would seeing as I'm a pistol pe... but hypothetically?
The general point of the rule from what I can gather is "don't go up there", not "don't exploit to get up there". KK certainly don't want people droning or sniping from up there. Is it really so hard to just not go up the 3rd tier cliffs?
The issue is that once again, we're being threatened with banning for a defect in KKs game.
If they don't want people up there, then there needs to be NO LEGITIMATE WAY to get up there.
Otherwise, it's like them saying "Shooting at mobs from inside Canyon Reloading Point is an exploit, we didn't mean for people to get in there." Or something else completely arbitrary.
Or, they're again taking something away from people who know how to get up there fairly because some people cheat to get up there. Like they just did with the remote repair tool. They can't fix the problem so they punish everyone.
And people are getting sick of it.
So while we're waiting for a fix it should be allowed for people to continue exploiting? Let people cap their spies overnight with repair tools, use a map bug in MC5 to get an SA and then snipe people from the 3rd tier cliffs at MB until the next patch? Given that DoY is likely going to be the next patch, I doubt that would be a very acceptable solution. Or imagine if KK said "NC2 has been delayed, the new servers can't be up yet, because CoDi hasn't had time to work on them due to working on the 3rd tier cliffs and the remote repair tool." You think people would prefer that?
It's not the greatest of solutions, and nobody says you have to like it. But for every person who doesn't like the current solution of "Just don't go up there", there's another who doesn't like the idea of delaying DoY over it or allowing people to continue exploiting unpunished.
Clownst0pper
28-07-04, 08:34
There are many cliffs around the grant mine area although on first glance look impossible to get to on foot, arent.
It took me a while to learn all the places for best droning advantages, and theres some really high, legitimate ones.
My only concern is a hovertech, in the TG zone theres several small humps, that you can ride up, and launch from, you can be killed if someone gets a droner or another hovertech, or even an APU. But unless you have a hovertech you cant get there.
That allowed?
metalangel
28-07-04, 11:31
Oooh, oooh *puts hand up*
What if you drive up there legitimately, but then while you're doing whatever it is you're doing (ahem) your vehicle times out and goes back to the garage?
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