View Full Version : what is wrong with you people!!!!
THE_TICK!!!!
13-07-04, 16:16
I dont get it...maybe im a little slow on the uptake or maybe im so old that its
like...one of those you cant teach dogs new tricks things...but im thoroughly
disgusted with the post's ive been reading lately..i mean people asking for a
NEW server where they can hunt and blah blah in peace....so they dont get
killed and that pker's are ruining the game and blah blah blah...and that new
players coming into the game are getting pk'd and we are losing playerbase
because of it...get of it people. You dont know squat. When im home i spend
plently of time showin the nibs around and helpin em out in the sewers...and
they do there little niblet thing with no probs..now on occasion you get the
kiddie with a cool tank runnin round with a hardon..and no control..but that is
occasionaly..if you dont have the fortitude to stick it out then to me your a
DRAIN a HINDRANCE to the neocron society in general. Ive been playin for a
good bit..and when im home i play ALLOT so i know allot of gents and ladies
from ingame..and have met LOTS of n00bs...and to tell ya the truth the
server has calmed down LOTS from when i made my first n00b. As far as
making a server for YOUR style play...i say fit in with the way the game was
layed out or go play some other game. I mean you say your paying for the
game and blah blah blah..well yaknow COOl im glad your payin and have your
opinion..But to be honest this game was made a certain way and most people
are fine with the way it was made..sure there could be refinements and what
not to make a better playing experiance for all..but NOOO you want to change
the whole way the game is sposed to be played...hmm lets see, like i can
choose wether i want to be a pvp guy or not..or someone was lame enough in
this forum to actually throw up a post saying that someone needs to ask a
certain person if they can pvp with them..what a joke..listen people this game
was INTENTIONALLY made to be dangerous..and like any game SOME people
are going to use that to there advantage. Deal with it...IMHO the only thing
this game needs is some sort of age verification...to keep the kiddies out...So
now that ive said my peace....flame away..im sure i will have some more
affleunt people who can state what im tryin to say a tad more clearly..help me out :D
Parashock...err graphs are your friend.
Replace some of those "." to "<ENTER>". Will be easier to read.
I read the first couple of senteces and gave up. It hurts my eyes.
Hard to read, but spot on with what you said!
big texts scare me :(
//edit:
that didn't really help :P
Yea man, make it easier to read by splitting up points, big paragraphs scare allot of people away :P
But you make good points.
What we need is an updated deffinition on the LE chip. And in the beginning when you see the diff messages in your apt when you look at them, there Should be one explaining what the LE does, and what taking it out can do. That wayy if a noob removes it, and gets PK'd over and over, he will know that putting it back in for a little while will stop that.
Unless your a rerolled vet, or just someone who is familiar with the game, you should prob keep the LE in till you need that imp spot.
And as a unclanned noob to the game that can be some lvls from when you started. Its good for new new players to keep it in for the first lvls, Vets wont get chased off by that, but noobs just trying to rember where they are or how they got there will. We dont need a chip whos description lies to them about reduced exp/money, that removing will get them ganked and pissed :P
Dont need a safer server, just need a way to better teach new players, before they get driven away before even leaving the sewers.
-Crono
Ok sort of understand what you was saying, and I am guessing your moaning about my idea for a new fresh server for when BDoY comes out. Do you think its fair to force new players to have to join a server which will contain loads of capped chars with loads of cash and the best equipment straight away?
Those who wanna pk will have fun wiping out half of the new players, I am fairly sure that new players would enjoy a new server far more. Also if I am feeling this way cause I have just recently come back from a long time off the game, dont you think that the others that come back will feel the same as me and maybe even the new players feel the same ? Adding this new server I would see as being a hit, new players, returning players and others will enjoy this server probably more than those who dont.
BDoY will be a new era in NC and such an era should come with the option of a new beginning.
THE_TICK!!!!
13-07-04, 16:39
cent..i guess in part its about your post but not fully..let me start with a question..when you started where there capped players..and if so..did you get killed ? did it scare you away? no? why not..ill answer my question on my behalf yes there was capped players and yes i got pk'd and YES i stayed, And i loved the game and still do...even since CURRENTLY and for the past 7 months ive been in iraq..and it doesn't look as if im coming home anytime soon..so the coming back and having to play catchup thing doesn suck..since i did get a 2 week vacation to come home. But thats not KK's fault that i took and extended break..so im not goin to try and change anything im goin to bust my ass to get back where i belong..on top.
james_finn
13-07-04, 16:40
BDoY will be a new era in NC and such an era should come with the option of a new beginning.
Agreed, I for one would start a new server, hopefully the economy wouldnt get as fucked as quickly, and rares parts would become "RARE" but thats my opinion. I was all for KK to wipe all the servers and start afresh. But thats not going to happen (Not quite as much for it now I have a DS etc. but hey!) lol.
Delphi
New server is a crap idea. The game isnt AOL with pictures ya know.
New server is a crap idea. The game isnt AOL with pictures ya know.
Nice constructing comments, YOU DONT HAVE TO PLAY THE NEW SERVER!!!
Doesnt make it a crap idea
New server is a crap idea. The game isnt AOL with pictures ya know.
WHAT! when did AOL lose all their pictures!!!!!!
Logan_storm_03
13-07-04, 17:00
u just sumed up what i was feeling about this game :) though i mey not have hardly the amount of expirence and some im still learning new things every now and again :cool:
A new server is a OK idea, but not everyone really cares about being the best before others. Cent u shure you would be for this idea if you diddnt have allot of catching up to do because you leaft? If you speant your entire break time commecting and hunting and such, your view may very well be different.
And new players will always have high lvl people to compeate with. Not to burst anyones bubble, but BDOY may very well be very good, and after time draw many in after some good publicity/reviews, but its not getting any endcaps and no one but us long term players will be busting down the store dores to get it the day it comes out. After 2 weeks there will be many near caped players, i mean Many. This seems more of a way cercumvent catching up with the rest of the server then a way to protect new players :/
Espically since not many like the idea about making Rares Acually really "Rare" so that prob wouldnt be implimented. The economy will get bad very fast, without money sinks, enough fun non PvP edge giving moneysinks and then suddenly people will be pimping their serveces more often to make up for their new found spending on furnishings and other such RP like items.
-Crono
(btw Tick, now it just looks like a tornado got hold of your txt :p )
well you might get people PvPing with *gasp* non rare weapons!!!!
THE_TICK!!!!
13-07-04, 17:08
LOL crono..dunno how to fix it...not sure whats wrong with it lol...aahhh oh well im OLD and i can see it :P
well you might get people PvPing with *gasp* non rare weapons!!!!
Or *double gasp* people RPing with no interest in PvP whatsoever!!!!!!
THE_TICK!!!!
13-07-04, 17:09
hmmm ive RP'd without PVP and had a good time..that is not the point of this post !!
i kept in my LE chip untill i found a clan to join, all i did was hunt and RP. now i hunt RP and do a little PvP.
i think there should be a warning when taking out the LE chip with a do you want ot proceed notice
Or *double gasp* people RPing with no interest in PvP whatsoever!!!!!!
BS, it wouldnt Cause more RP at all even though i wish RP could become a much bigger part of this game, it enhances the gameplay.
But that wont help it, and ooo, fighting with normal weapons while a few "elite" people run amok with a rare that they were lucky enough to get all the parts for clear house of the others.
IT will make Neocron another game that Big clans are Needed to get anything done, as the higherups in those big clans wil be the first to get the rares they need from pooled rareparts from all the guild hunting. Centuri i bet would be one of the first with a rare pistol, anyone in a big org would love this idea as many of the favorits in that guild will be the first to get rares, a great way to make the strong stronger. Nothing is compleatly without another agenda.
-Crono
BS, it wouldnt Cause more RP at all even though i wish RP could become a much bigger part of this game, it enhances the gameplay
Sorry, I was actually being sarcastic - I should have included <sarcasm> tags
oh, my bad :P
Shame on me for being dense enough to not catch that too :P
-Crono
greendonkeyuk
13-07-04, 17:27
lol tickster, it looks like you wrote that in word and pasted it across to nc while gettin your indents wrong. either that or you got yourself an iraqi keyboard or something. :D
Even if we were given a char wipe, item wipe or even an asswipe, (plenty of those about) the game would still remain the same. The power gamers (unemployed or jus generally megalomanical) would get all the rares before anyone else. They would probably pass them on to those less fortunate (casual) gamers at hyperinflated prices and generally the servers would end up the same as they are now. The best way to make a difference is to continue to be your good self, help the noobs, show em about and if someone starts to pk... do your thing. Whip out the Dg and get medieval on their asses.
Btw these are paragraphs, but you knew that already. Have fun dude. Take it easy.
MjukisDjur
13-07-04, 17:34
scrap a few servers instead :P
Problem isn't PKers, Problem is Griefers who kill allies and camp GR's, killsteal, lock GR's to clan only, rally mobs and generally act like asses. That reason alone made me quit once.
But now i'm on pluto mostly and wont have to take that shit since there is only 1 char slot and people have to watch their rep there or get Ignored by tradeskillers.
SNIP
But now i'm on pluto mostly and wont have to take that shit since there is only 1 char slot and people have to watch their rep there or get Ignored by tradeskillers.
WE HAVE TRADESKILLERS????
:p
I read the first couple of senteces and gave up. It hurts my eyes.
Dito, i don't undertand what i read anyway... the only complaint "nerf" threads usually have a valid reason anyway.. is it a nerf the nerf threads post or what... jeez.. some ppl...
1: Line breaks are your friend.
2: I immediately lose any regard for any opinion that is followed by a 'if you don't like it paly another game' because basically you're telling people if you don't want MY interpretation of 'xxx' go fuck off. Which is really quite immature
3: We've been 'round and 'round on this issue HUNDREDS of times. Roleplayers and PvPers will NEVER get along on the same server for one simple reason: PKs will never accept limitations on their in-game behavior to create a continuous world (IE they will never not break character) and RPers will never accept that simply being in the wrong place at the wrong time can get you killed, even by someone who should be your friend. Now I know these are generalizations, and that some players do get along with both (I do for the most part) but in general that's the way it is, the way it's been and the way it will be until either they differentiate the servers or one group forces the other out.
Shadow Dancer
13-07-04, 17:50
Forcing new players to play with capped chars, lol.
So should every mmorpg release a new server every week or something?
Anyways, if a new server is made then I want to see a server merge of some of the old ones. I really don't want the population split EVEN more. And with all the advertising i'm seeing of doy(nil), I'm starting to worry that not many NEW people will play. :(
I think all servers should be whiped with DoY, but thats mostly because I missed the start of retail and basically everyone had atleast 1 capped char when I started.
and rares parts would become "RARE" but thats my opinion.
How about... no? :rolleyes:
We are not playing Everquest here.
I'm not sure if this guy is a crap clone of the old Vettro but you sound to me like your wingeing at the prospect of looseing an advantage over new people.
I'm more than happy to start a new char with doy unless some one gives me a real reason not too?
I how ever won't transfer any of my pluto chars to anything but a 1 slot server if there is a server that allows this.
Tick, I agree with you wholeheartidy. The game was made this way, so play the game. If you don't like the game then play something else that meets your requirements. Simple.
The Necron game play is fine.
(would like to see no QBs Safezones, but hey:)
I dont get it...maybe im a little slow on the uptake or maybe im so old that its
like...one of those you cant teach dogs new tricks things...but im thoroughly
disgusted with the post's ive been reading lately..i mean people asking for a
NEW server where they can hunt and blah blah in peace....so they dont get
killed and that pker's are ruining the game and blah blah blah...and that new
players coming into the game are getting pk'd and we are losing playerbase
because of it...get of it people. You dont know squat. When im home i spend
plently of time showin the nibs around and helpin em out in the sewers...and
they do there little niblet thing with no probs..now on occasion you get the
kiddie with a cool tank runnin round with a hardon..and no control..but that is
occasionaly..if you dont have the fortitude to stick it out then to me your a
DRAIN a HINDRANCE to the neocron society in general. Ive been playin for a
good bit..and when im home i play ALLOT so i know allot of gents and ladies
from ingame..and have met LOTS of n00bs...and to tell ya the truth the
server has calmed down LOTS from when i made my first n00b. As far as
making a server for YOUR style play...i say fit in with the way the game was
layed out or go play some other game. I mean you say your paying for the
game and blah blah blah..well yaknow COOl im glad your payin and have your
opinion..But to be honest this game was made a certain way and most people
are fine with the way it was made..sure there could be refinements and what
not to make a better playing experiance for all..but NOOO you want to change
the whole way the game is sposed to be played...hmm lets see, like i can
choose wether i want to be a pvp guy or not..or someone was lame enough in
this forum to actually throw up a post saying that someone needs to ask a
certain person if they can pvp with them..what a joke..listen people this game
was INTENTIONALLY made to be dangerous..and like any game SOME people
are going to use that to there advantage. Deal with it...IMHO the only thing
this game needs is some sort of age verification...to keep the kiddies out...So
now that ive said my peace....flame away..im sure i will have some more
affleunt people who can state what im tryin to say a tad more clearly..help me out :D
I think all servers should be whiped with DoY, but thats mostly because I missed the start of retail and basically everyone had atleast 1 capped char when I started.
Just because you missed the start of retail does not entitle you to request a server wipe. If you want a capped char., then spend the time to cap one yourself.
The people with the capped chars., and the associated resources they gained spent their time and money doing so. I refer to real money because they paid a monthly fee to do it.
Or was what you wrote just bait ;)
Ive got capped or near capped chars on uranus and venus high level chars on saturn and a mid level char on pluto, what I missed about not starting retail was that everyone was new and didnt know what they were doing and were exploring and finding new things. Today even real newbs power level which isnt as fun. Also a complete wipe would remove all duped items any and all money exploited for and since APC making has been nerfed to a certain extent it will make the economy of all servers less stupid in general.
I said mostly that I regret missing the beginning of retail for a wipe not that it is my only reason for thinking one is a good iddea.
Agreed 100% so you wipe all chars what does that achieve yes its fair on new people coming into the game or is it , back at the start or retail no on really knew what a con setup was all you had to do was put alot of points in agility and athletics and run like the wind and im sure these new guys wont know what one is either alot of people will have about 2 years experience on these new guys and they will probably cap fast but it still wouldnt be fair all you would be doing is making it unfair for people who have put alot of time in on there chars ect .
cent..i guess in part its about your post but not fully..let me start with a question..when you started where there capped players..and if so..did you get killed ?
Afaik cent started at the start of retail as i did and yes there was pking but imo its more fun on a fresh server as theres less rares etc. I wasn't under the impression this was to stop pking but more to have a server without a fucked up ecconomy.
Few people care about pking anymore because theres noone to pk, when doy comes and there are plenty of noobs, so everyone will gank them and alot will leave, if you read any consumer reviews of the game alot of people stopped playing because of pking. I think no safe zones etc will be great, but a new fresh server to allow new players to level more peacefully would be a good option imo, new players will get pked but not as much and not straight away, and it will save all the bored capped out players one by one raiding hunting zones like jo1 or the aggies.
I dont see whats wrong with the idea anyway, it doesnt effect you if you dont want it too. Theres been no posts i've seen asking for a server wipe, just adding one new one, if you dont want to play on it...dont! Unless you just want all the noobs to start on the server you play so you can drive them away when their 0/2 :rolleyes:
Agreed 100% so you wipe all chars what does that achieve yes its fair on new people coming into the game or is it , back at the start or retail no on really knew what a con setup was all you had to do was put alot of points in agility and athletics and run like the wind and im sure these new guys wont know what one is either alot of people will have about 2 years experience on these new guys and they will probably cap fast but it still wouldnt be fair all you would be doing is making it unfair for people who have put alot of time in on there chars ect .
Dont char wipe just imp, epic, money, item and clan wipe but leave chars intact but even then your left with chars that are capped but have no weapons and spells and tradeskillers with no tools etc.
In reality Im hoping KK makes a brand new server that you cant import old characters into and thats where Ill be playing when DoY comes out, if it happens.
wouldnt mind so much if they did a wipe, but you could keep whatever you had in your implants/armor on your back and what you were carring in your QB. Shure you could carry some items over in there, but that isnt even close to crossing the line of Flooding the economy. You would get a new starter apt as if you made a new char and everything. Im not really supporting that, but i could easily live with that as a way to fix any sort of game economy yet still have playable characters soon as you transfer. Some things like MC5 Imps i dont think anyone wants to do again, ever :P And there was no flood there, thats just 100% pain in the ass to get. You worked your ass off in one way or another to get them.
Truthfully, i kinda see this as how its being done, though whats in your inv/gogo prob will too. Not shure how easy it would be to also have all the Apts with items transfer with it.
-Crono
Shadow Dancer
13-07-04, 21:25
Make a new server for the ppl who want a wipe. What's the problem with that?
Make a new server for the ppl who want a wipe. What's the problem with that?
KK may not be able to afford to feed all those hamsters.
Shadow Dancer
13-07-04, 21:28
KK may not be able to afford to feed all those hamsters.
Martin can't sell one of his rolex watches?
:p
SD: Would u sell it for some hamsters? :)
I wouldn't :)
edit: wait im fuckin confused wtf is goin on here?
Bozz-Von Mel
13-07-04, 22:06
any type of char wipe, be it imps, cash, rares = me gone forever. 3 NC accounts @ $9.95 ea = $29.85/mo x 2 more years = $718 + whatever BDOY will cost me extra.
cent..i guess in part its about your post but not fully..let me start with a question..when you started where there capped players..
During beta yes there was, during retail no there wasn't.
The level difference is just one minor thing that a new server will change. What the new server will do is get ride of the tons of cash that people have and all the rares and other drops, some of which are not meant to exsist.
Leveling a char can be done easily. If you know how too.
Too me the only people who dont want a wipe are those who dont want to have to spend time getting things and leveling up again, which is fine, and kk are doing servers which will be fine for you, what annoys me is why then moan about an idea which will be better for other players? Why are you trying to get everyone to do things your way. I made a post about an idea, which others have mentioned to me in the past and on the forums I beleive. So I wanted an offical answer for the idea, I didn't expect people to come moaning about it even when it wont affect them. If you are afraid that it will take more people away from the server your playing then tough. You can either stay there with those capped out chars, and tons of cash which you have nothing to spend it on and those appartments full of constructed rares or techparts, or come to the other server and start fresh.
So stop moaning. It wont directly concern you.
Agreed 100% so you wipe all chars what does that achieve yes its fair on new people coming into the game or is it , back at the start or retail no on really knew what a con setup was all you had to do was put alot of points in agility and athletics and run like the wind and im sure these new guys wont know what one is either alot of people will have about 2 years experience on these new guys and they will probably cap fast but it still wouldnt be fair all you would be doing is making it unfair for people who have put alot of time in on there chars ect .
Yea dark..
I don't see anyone posting on how the servers should be wiped to make it fair for some new player who might start an account today. So why would we do it with the forthcoming BDoY? Taking what people have been leveling and working on for a while, just deleting them... makes no sense whatsoever. Would be like getting ripped off. Paying for something that won't matter when the new game comes out.
Yea dark..
I don't see anyone posting on how the servers should be wiped to make it fair for some new player who might start an account today. So why would we do it with the forthcoming BDoY? Taking what people have been leveling and working on for a while, just deleting them... makes no sense whatsoever. Would be like getting ripped off. Paying for something that won't matter when the new game comes out.
Its optional, why dont you guys understand that its a choice you can make, you DONT have to choose this server. It is an option for those old players or currently new players to restart again on a server which aint been corrupted by cheaters/exploits etc.
I am fairly sure to say that over 80% of the current people playing neocron today have at some point in there life used an exploit/bug or gained something from an exploit or bug.
I remember how I first got the money to fund for the NDA clan app key. I went down and farmed the aggressor captains for those gatlin pistols which was a bug which wasn't noticed till people where making too much money too fast.
Now the game has had a long period of time to get ride of some of these bugs and exploits a new fresh server will offer a lot more to players. This is one main reason why I would like a new server where people start off fresh.
...disgusted with the post's ive been reading lately..i mean people asking for a NEW server where they can hunt and blah blah in peace....so they dont get killed and that pker's are ruining the game and blah blah blah...and that new players coming into the game are getting pk'd and we are losing playerbase because of it...get of it people. You dont know squat.
A typical PK'er reaction to someone proposing a change/idea that goes in some direction that doesn't fit his reality.
When im home i spend plently of time showin the nibs around and helpin em out in the sewers...and they do there little niblet thing with no probs...
So you can cold-cock them when they turn their backs to you, I suppose? Your nobility toward noobs is only exceeded by your command of English grammer.
...now on occasion you get the kiddie with a cool tank runnin round with a hardon..and no control..but that is occasionaly....
:lol: So, when were you out last at Battle Dome? Or MB, or TH?? You must not get out much.
...if you dont have the fortitude to stick it out then to me your a DRAIN a HINDRANCE to the neocron society in general. ....
Why? Just because we don't subscribe to your version of what Neocron is or could be?? Talk about thinking inside the box.
...As far as making a server for YOUR style play...i say fit in with the way the game was played out or go play some other game. ....
So we are supposed to conform to your style of play?? What's the matter? Are you afraid you will not have any more marks to kill with your RoG?
[needless babbling removed]
...but NOOO you want to change the whole way the game is sposed to be played.......
PKing is not the same as PvP and the game is just fine if PvP is done, but it isn't. Camping at a GenRep and blasting anyone who syncs in is not PvP, Blasting droners when they are using their drones and therfore can't defend themselves is not PvP. Sneeking up on someone 20-30 levels below you and blowing them away, is not PvP, you narrowminded twit.
...hmm lets see, like i can choose wether i want to be a pvp guy or not..or someone was lame enough in this forum to actually throw up a post saying that someone needs to ask a certain person if they can pvp with them..what a joke.........
No, that is not what was proposed. What was proposed was the person being being attacked would have the right to decline combat - particularly when the PKing mental midget sneeks up and blasts him with some uber weapon.
[The rest of the mindless babbling deleted]
Trent
Roleplayers and PvPers will NEVER get along on the same server for one simple reason: PKs will never accept limitations on their in-game behavior to create a continuous world
It is insulting to say that PvP'ers and Roleplayers are different classes of people, or for that matter to say that PK'ers are grouped in with PvP people.
It was painful to read Ticks post. But I Agree with him.
Newbies tend not to have a problem levelling (at least on Pluto). They are left to their own devices, and if they do have problems they have the LE to fall back on.
For those who want a new server (with wipe), well just delete your characters and then start fresh. You can roleplay that you are starting fresh on a server running for 2-3 months. Because that is what it will be like. So why feel the need to penalise others just because you just returned/got here.
For those who want a new server (with wipe), well just delete your characters and then start fresh. You can roleplay that you are starting fresh on a server running for 2-3 months. Because that is what it will be like. So why feel the need to penalise others just because you just returned/got here.
All the markets will still be messed up, people will have capped 18 mill credits, and rare implants etc.
Why dont you understand people dont want to just start off fresh again they want all money removed and the implants etc. There is still way too much duped, and exploited items on the current servers which will get moved over, I really dont want that and I am sure I am not the only person.
There will still be 7 slotted weapons in the game from the eon days, there will still be copbot weapons and ammo and many other things in the game which should not be there now.
I wanna start fresh cause it will be a challenge for me, I leveled my chars up when it was easy, I leveled up my first psi monk by shooting turrets which are now classed an exploit. I wanna see what I can do now that its harder to do things. This is just one of the reasons, not the only one so dont focus on that.
It is insulting to say that PvP'ers and Roleplayers are different classes of people, or for that matter to say that PK'ers are grouped in with PvP people.
It was painful to read Ticks post. But I Agree with him.
Newbies tend not to have a problem levelling (at least on Pluto). They are left to their own devices, and if they do have problems they have the LE to fall back on.
For those who want a new server (with wipe), well just delete your characters and then start fresh. You can roleplay that you are starting fresh on a server running for 2-3 months. Because that is what it will be like. So why feel the need to penalise others just because you just returned/got here.
First of all, why dont you just pick another server then? and let those that
want a fresh start get one.
Second, rerolling all your chars is not the same thing. A new server is a fresh
start for everybody and not just you.
like cent said.. the fresh start should be for everyone who wants to play there.
No money, no weapons, no nothing. And all the players who want to start there would have to start from scratch to be something.
Equal to all. Even for the ones who might start playing when DoY comes out.
And tbh.. i would really like rank 30 vs 30 fighting at aggies :) rather than some capped tank with his 5 slot arti CS comes and mows the cellars. (non LEd.)
Edit: damn primate was faster :)
All the markets will still be messed up, people will have capped 18 mill credits, and rare implants etc.
Why dont you understand people dont want to just start off fresh again they want all money removed and the implants etc.
You know you harp on about that, but the simple fact is it will only be a short matter of time before this all happens again. So why penalise those people who don't want a server wipe.
Even if they made a new server, a few months later it is going to be the same again for anyone new starting off.
I wanna start fresh cause it will be a challenge for me, I leveled my chars up when it was easy, I leveled up my first psi monk by shooting turrets which are now classed an exploit. I wanna see what I can do now that its harder to do things. This is just one of the reasons, not the only one so dont focus on that.
Then delete your characters and start again. You will get to see how to level up again. Don't bother to get items from anyone.
You know you harp on about that, but the simple fact is it will only be a short matter of time before this all happens again. So why penalise those people who don't want a server wipe.
Even if they made a new server, a few months later it is going to be the same again for anyone new starting off.
Then delete your characters and start again. You will get to see how to level up again. Don't bother to get items from anyone.
Who is penalising you? If i move to DoY Server #3 wich is a fresh server and
you move all your chars and belongings to DoY Server #1 in what way are
you being penalised ?
And again, simply rerolling isnt the same.
You know you harp on about that, but the simple fact is it will only be a short matter of time before this all happens again. So why penalise those people who don't want a server wipe.
Even if they made a new server, a few months later it is going to be the same again for anyone new starting off.
Then delete your characters and start again. You will get to see how to level up again. Don't bother to get items from anyone.
You seem to just go against anything that might help people out. I am giving up trying to agrue with you, your not even reading half of whats being written down, your too intent to go against mine and some others opinions.
First of all, why dont you just pick another server then? and let those that
want a fresh start get one.
[quote]
Second, rerolling all your chars is not the same thing. A new server is a fresh
start for everybody and not just you.
It is not a start for everyone. It is a serious kick in the teeth for people who have spent ages to get certain items. Sure it is great if you are just starting off, but a few months down the line it will be exactly the same.
All you will have manged to do is alienate a large portion of your customer base, for the sake of a couple of months quiet time (if that, most players these days can get a good character within a week).
It will be the same as rerolling on a fresh server after a few weeks. It won't solve anything.
duh.. you just wont get it wont ya?`
Nobody is forcing u to cooperate with this idea.
Its like if you start now playing on other server - you dont have anything.
Imagine the picture where everybody was on the same line... without anything.
Play where you wanna, but try to understand what other ppl would appreciate.
Cent,
I hate to say it but I'm not with you on this one.
The population is low enough and even with new people I don't see how making another server to split people even more will help anyone except maybe a couple of people who would love a new start.
Lets not forget that new players will look to us capped players to show them the way, not all be stuck on a new server walking around wondering what to do when all the vets run off to start the capping and imp collecting leaving the noobs high and dry on the whole..
I really don't see many pluses to a new server.
Also all item etc wipe then that equals me and alot of others gone and aint that the truth.
I think if they made a new server which was from scratch id play it.... I'd love to start again from scratch with everyone else.
But I'd play a server that i had transfered all my hard and work to more.
It would be nice to see ho the gmae has changed with the last 67 patches :)
THE_TICK!!!!
13-07-04, 23:34
A typical PK'er reaction to someone proposing a change/idea that goes in some direction that doesn't fit his reality.
Trent
ok trent dunno who you are but if you ask ANYONE on uranus that knows me im far from the pker..type.
So you can cold-cock them when they turn their backs to you, I suppose? Your nobility toward noobs is only exceeded by your command of English grammer.
TrentGranted my english is NOT the best..but i DO try to get my point accross as best i can..i DO NOT try and belittle others over there opinions..because i have nothing better to do.
:lol: So, when were you out last at Battle Dome? Or MB, or TH?? You must not get out much. TrentI get out quite a bit..and yes like i said IT HAPPENS..deal with it
Why? Just because we don't subscribe to your version of what Neocron is or could be?? Talk about thinking inside the box.
TrentActually i was refering to the neocron story line as a whole..and the game PRODUCERS version of what they put IN the box.
So we are supposed to conform to your style of play?? What's the matter? Are you afraid you will not have any more marks to kill with your RoG?
Trent
I dont use RoGs they suck...and i only kill GOOD players..more than likely they wouldn't use a ROG eather..i suppose its a fav of yours ?
PKing is not the same as PvP and the game is just fine if PvP is done, but it isn't. Camping at a GenRep and blasting anyone who syncs in is not PvP, Blasting droners when they are using their drones and therfore can't defend themselves is not PvP. Sneeking up on someone 20-30 levels below you and blowing them away, is not PvP, you narrowminded twit. Blasting droners when they cant defend themselves ?
Trent
LOL i actually did that once..after the bastard killed me with his DRONE...so your point is mute. as for sneaking up on n00bs thats not even worth a responce..
No, that is not what was proposed. What was proposed was the person being being attacked would have the right to decline combat - particularly when the PKing mental midget sneeks up and blasts him with some uber weapon.
Trent
lol..you sound like you got abused as a niblet...but your grammer is superb.
duh.. you just wont get it wont ya?`
...
Its like if you start now playing on other server - you dont have anything.
Imagine the picture where everybody was on the same line... without anything.
Your the one not getting it. Everyone starts on the same line until what? The first hour. 1-2 weeks all the vet players will have the resources, because lets face it they aren't going to have a "Friends" wipe are they?
It is an illusion to think that a brand new server will some how fix all the issues. It won't, it will just delay it for a few weeks.
I would like to see Neptune being made. I would certainly move to that, but a new server for the sake of a new sever is a waste of resources. Especially with the current populations.
THE_TICK!!!!
13-07-04, 23:40
ok just to clear a few things up...i wasn't refering TOTALY to cents. post there have been other posts lately that i have read and i dont know folks...it seems as if im seeing it more and more..i like the game ALL of it i have tradeskillers as well as pvpers..i enjoy every aspect of the game..I do NOT enjoy people whining and crying that this has to be changed to suit him/her and so on and so forth..as far as losing a player base do to PKERS..put your time where your mouth is...i have a idea and im going to make a post..lets see where that gets us.
Why not just have 5 servers when doy comes?
A nc classic one
A NEW fresh doy one
A four char one
A one char one
Venus...as its not kk that deals with it im not sure what happens with it but thats not really kks concern imo the four above are the important ones, venus can go doy or not(/make another server) but thats for those with control over it to decide.
That allows
a. those not wanting doy who kk said they would cater for.
b. Those wanting a 4 char server
c. Those wanting a 1 char server
d. Those wanting to start a fresh.
This in effect will merge the saturn and uranus populous and the pluto and jupiter populous, from the start the servers should be busier, then we just have to hope we get enough new people to the game to keep it that way
:angel:
Edit:
I do NOT enjoy people whining and crying that this has to be changed to suit him/her and so on and so forth
Imo most of these posts are ideas put forward by players about changes/features they would like to see ingame...whats wrong with that? Unless i've misunderstood what your trying to say.
TheGreatMilenko
14-07-04, 02:51
fuck finally some 1 tells it how it is good job tick :)
Your the one not getting it. Everyone starts on the same line until what? The first hour. 1-2 weeks all the vet players will have the resources, because lets face it they aren't going to have a "Friends" wipe are they?
It is an illusion to think that a brand new server will some how fix all the issues. It won't, it will just delay it for a few weeks.
I would like to see Neptune being made. I would certainly move to that, but a new server for the sake of a new sever is a waste of resources. Especially with the current populations.
Exactly, its just a well dressed up excuse to try to get ahead. Like i said, 10 bcuhs says most people for this will eb the ones fastestly racing for the lvls and the rares. Its like a easy way to get out ahead of others without working to catch up. Choclate coat that with something like "i want the economy fixed" and such, and "it will invite new players" (which is funny, like anyone will be busting down the flood gates for new players, and players will be close to cap in like 2 weeks)
ahh well
-Crono
Yay Tick!!!! I'm glad i'm not the only one out there :p
While Arc may think the PvP/RK communities are not that distict the one thing this thread does prove is that the community is polarised
I'll _suggest_ the problem is this
Pure PvP communities are arguably just as niche as RP communities (I'll cite Planetside merging servers as proof of this). While people get a thrill out of PvP its not massively self sustaining (and I'll quote the numerous times I've heard "I PK lowbies, because they are probably an alt so they go log their mains in to fight me..." to back that comment up)
So heres the thing. Neocrons gameplay and community has put off many pure/Semi-pure RP gamers (despite the great game setting) because of the abundance of uncontrolled PvP (the fact that the LE stop you forming/joining a clan is a HUGE disadvantage to the RP gamer - its a fundamental organisational building block)
But by a similar token PvP players get put off by the fact that they generally have to either 'look' for PvP (by attacking ops) or 'make' PvP by attacking lowbies hoping its an alt and the main will shortly be springing out from the woodwork
So no one is happy and everyone loses
Now lets say, as an example, we have 2 servers, an RP server and a PvP server - the RP players are happy in that the PvP has been mostly 'locked down' in that only polarised enemies will fight and that there will be lots of RP behind the conflict (as long as you dont get some PK twat who thinks it would be fun to rain on this particular servers parade - I guarantee this would happen). However the population isnt going to be great
Meanwhile on the PvP server its no holds barred carnage however there is a notable lack of tradeskillers (because everyones too busy trying to be uber PvP man) and again a relatively low population - I doubt it will take long for people to become bored fighting the same people/clans over and over (again see Planetsides server merge for the reasons why)
To summarise, the PvP players benefit more from a combined community (they can attack RP players who dont have alot of say in it) however the RP community really only suffers - split the communities however and no one wins
I dont know what the answer is.......
the fact that the LE stop you forming/joining a clan is a HUGE disadvantage to the RP gamer - its a fundamental organisational building block
I think you are wrong on a lot what you said. To pick one point. The LE or lack there of != no roleplay.
Lets say you join a clan. The objective of the clan is to look after each other. Both in resources and weapons/guards (if you are incapable of defending yourself). If you and your clan are incapable or do not want to fight, then you set up a service with another clan that can.
You can do this with ease in a roleplaying aspect.
To say you need an LE to roleplay is an annoyance. It assumes that because someone is capable of shooting a weapon they will.
The attitude of that there would be no traders on a more PvP centric server (eg. Neptune) is also incorrect. Traders will still exist and will make money. Sure they will get attacked and killed, but they can use their customer base to protect them.
TheGreatMilenko
14-07-04, 13:10
i hate people who wanna make this game not hardcore ok people imagine in real life at post apocolyptic pretty much dying to live would you be a lil fucking carebear?
i hate people who wanna make this game not hardcore ok people imagine in real life at post apocolyptic pretty much dying to live would you be a lil fucking carebear?
Just to show the contrary position
If war and killing had almost destroyed your planet and your race, and it had taken years of hardship and suffering to pull you back from the brink to where you are now (and you were still suffering for those past 'mistakes') - how quickly do you think you'd repeat the process?
Now, man has base traits and killing/violence/dominance are part of them this cant be denied, but you need to bring wisdom and intelligence into the equasion - why do you think neither side ('Cron/DOY) immediately opened up with the 'big guns'?
If war and killing had almost destroyed your planet and your race, and it had taken years of hardship and suffering to pull you back from the brink to where you are now (and you were still suffering for those past 'mistakes') - how quickly do you think you'd repeat the process?
I guess they would stop after they bashed out their enemies skull with a rock.
I think you are wrong on a lot what you said. To pick one point. The LE or lack there of != no roleplay.
Lets say you join a clan. The objective of the clan is to look after each other. Both in resources and weapons/guards (if you are incapable of defending yourself). If you and your clan are incapable or do not want to fight, then you set up a service with another clan that can.
You can do this with ease in a roleplaying aspect.
To say you need an LE to roleplay is an annoyance. It assumes that because someone is capable of shooting a weapon they will.
The attitude of that there would be no traders on a more PvP centric server (eg. Neptune) is also incorrect. Traders will still exist and will make money. Sure they will get attacked and killed, but they can use their customer base to protect them.
Looks like you kinda missed my point - either that or we need to agree to disagree
I'll try a different tact though
I have to keep my LE in, I have no desire to get ganked by capped runners at a whim (I'm far from capped) nor do I feel compelled to level up to the exclusion of all else just to prevent said ganking (I choose how I want to play, as soon as I am forced I'm not having fun anymore) - while I would engage in PvP on a fair basis (rank restricted PvP for example) the game does not cater to this so I have to keep my LE in
I refuse to be the source of a high/capped players twisted sence of achievement and amusement (for all of the 10 secs it takes them to kill me) especially when I am then penalised for it (item decay, dropped items I might not get back, re pokes etc - nothing but negatives for me here)
Which prevents me (and my friends) from forming a clan, pooling equipment, having a meeting place, sence of unity, identity in politics etc. I was NEXT btw so my character/faction goals are hardly confrontational in nature
However give me a fair fight (one where my opponent would be less eager to pull the trigger since he could easily lose and asks himself what he has to gain) not only would I embrace this but it suddenly creates a tense environment where you really dont know if that 'enemy' will fight, run or just ignore you
Theres more to this game than PvP (political 'conflicts' goes wayyy beyond PvP, especially where the 'corp factions' of the city are concerned)
Which is basically why I quit the game - you can either believe that or not, but it doesnt change anything
Then you can look at the polarised community and the low player counts and ask yourself 'why'. Everyones got their own opinion, I just call it as I see it
Looks like you kinda missed my point - either that or we need to agree to disagree
I'll try a different tact though
I have to keep my LE in, I have no desire to get ganked by capped runners at a whim (I'm far from capped) nor do I feel compelled to level up to the exclusion of all else just to prevent said ganking (I choose how I want to play, as soon as I am forced I'm not having fun anymore) - while I would engage in PvP on a fair basis (rank restricted PvP for example) the game does not cater to this so I have to keep my LE in
I refuse to be the source of a high/capped players twisted sence of achievement and amusement (for all of the 10 secs it takes them to kill me) especially when I am then penalised for it (item decay, dropped items I might not get back, re pokes etc - nothing but negatives for me here)
Which prevents me (and my friends) from forming a clan, pooling equipment, having a meeting place, sence of unity, identity in politics etc. I was NEXT btw so my character/faction goals are hardly confrontational in nature
However give me a fair fight (one where my opponent would be less eager to pull the trigger since he could easily lose and asks himself what he has to gain) not only would I embrace this but it suddenly creates a tense environment where you really dont know if that 'enemy' will fight, run or just ignore you
Theres more to this game than PvP (political 'conflicts' goes wayyy beyond PvP, especially where the 'corp factions' of the city are concerned)
Which is basically why I quit the game - you can either believe that or not, but it doesnt change anything
Then you can look at the polarised community and the low player counts and ask yourself 'why'. Everyones got their own opinion, I just call it as I see it
:p Well said!
i hate people who wanna make this game not hardcore ok people imagine in real life at post apocolyptic pretty much dying to live would you be a lil fucking carebear?
Wtf is not hardcore about having a new server? And i still don’t see how people can complain about it, nobody is trying to force people to play there, just give an option to those who dont want to play on a server with a poor economy...
Lol also what does "people dying to live" mean?
And as for real life in the neocron situation would people want peace or war :wtf: I'd be pretty worried if anyone wanted to run around killing innocent people in any rl situation...
Anyway no one is trying to force their rules on anyone else so i don't see a problem, you can play your way they can play theirs, why should everyone be able to play the game how they find it fun?
Well, is it only me or do we have this discussion for the 5th or 6th time? :D
A second thought: Please stop the "you can`t spell properly" and all that waffle :rolleyes: Thanks!
I have to keep my LE in,
Don't confuse PvP with griefing. At any time PvP is enabled there will be a situation that "I'm a roleplayer" type people will deem unfair. Like GR'ing into 10 people of the same level as you.
The point is that PvP can be part of the roleplay. You get PK'ed by someone then hire someone to protect you, or form a clan to police the area, or get you clan/faction to deal with it.
I refuse to be the source of a high/capped players twisted sence of achievement and amusement (for all of the 10 secs it takes them to kill me) especially when I am then penalised for it (item decay, dropped items I might not get back, re pokes etc - nothing but negatives for me here)
We are playing different games. I hunt where PK'rs don't go. If I get PK'ed (which is rare) I move to another area and inform people of where the PK'er is. I have all my stuff blueprinted so if I loose it I can get someone to construct a new one. Getting pokes and repairs with others helps build a community (eg. "That SOB PK'ed me again".. "Oh thats a shame have this on the house"..). You can build trade relations and help to impose embargoes on the troublesome players.
It works reasonably well on Pluto (despite some having multiple accounts). Although multiple characters detracts from roleplay too, but that is another issue.
PK'ers are rarely a source of annoyance to me. SL PK'ers tend to go red fast and have more to loose. F6 PK'ers, well I just avoid the obvious areas they hang out.
Which prevents me (and my friends) from forming a clan, pooling equipment, having a meeting place, sence of unity, identity in politics etc.
It doesn't prevent you. You get like minded people in the clan, and have one build extra items for each other, another do all the repairs for you (just switch spares), team to go hunting so yous can fight back or flee easier. Build up a roleplay presense in your faction so others in your faction will flock to you/help you. With a clan also items become a lot cheaper and death begins to have no meaning.
You don't have to form a clan until your at a reasonable level to defend yourself (30-40).
The problem is a lot of people want hand holding or a single player game. They whine and whine until they get their way and then move onto something else. When NC started there wasn't even LE's. They were only added at the last moment into retail afair. Now they don't even have any penalties anymore.
When I lost my first hovertec I almost died realising how much time it cost me to get it. Now I know enough that I can get the key recycled and blueprinted and get a new one built for a fraction of the cost.
Which is basically why I quit the game - you can either believe that or not, but it doesnt change anything
If you quit the game why are you still posting here?
* Edit.. btw who has problems with PK'ers anymore? All the new characters start off with LE's making noob hunting non-existant. By the time the person has ripped out the LE they are in a position to defend themselves.
Well, is it only me or do we have this discussion for the 5th or 6th time? :D
A second thought: Please stop the "you can`t spell properly" and all that waffle :rolleyes: Thanks!
Rofl, this convo is been brought up 100 times, and anyone who corrects spelling/grammer of someone like this is an english paper is an ass, its like saying "i have no more points/arguements so i have looked and found your spelling to be badd, noob" :P
-Crono
If you quit the game why are you still posting here?
I was waiting for that one :-)
When (if?) DOY arrives I may try again (the fact that NC's enemies will supposedly be banned from the city may help the situation somewhat)
Other than that...sorry asm I not supposed to be alowed to post here/read the threads anymore?
WRT the rest of your points, I can see where you're coming from but we'll have to agree to differ - You're obvious prepared to be more tolerant and flexible than I am and too much of what your suggest I view as 'going out of my way to address a problem I personally dont think I should have to address in the first place'
As I said before once (a) certain playstyle gets forced on me I'm not doing what I want anymore = I'm not having fun, I'm paying to work (and I normally get paid to work :-) ). Since my playstyle obviously isnt popular with some players (or indeed the devs idea of what Neocron is about) I just left rather than kick up a huge fuss, call for nerfs etc - I too old for all that hassle, I'll just go elsewhere (where I can do what I want to do in game)
I refuse to be the source of a high/capped players twisted sence of achievement and amusement (for all of the 10 secs it takes them to kill me) especially when I am then penalised for it (item decay, dropped items I might not get back, re pokes etc - nothing but negatives for me here)
5150 has hit upon an important point. The PKer gets his jollies but the player getting sandbaged is the one being penalized. PKing is not the same thing as PvP.
5150 has hit upon an important point. The PKer gets his jollies but the player getting sandbaged is the one being penalized. PKing is not the same thing as PvP.
If they are a PK'er they risk soullight loss. Too much and they get penalised. For faction enemies, it is up to you to get your faction to help you out. After all factions with the most players do so because there are others in the faction that look out for them.
As for penalised. They loose one item into a high soul light belt. The PK'er has to hack it to get a low level item, which can be easily replaced. The victim also gets CON/STR XP from being killed.
The PK griefers get their jollies from winding up their victims. The more wound up you are the better the feel (trash talking, coming back to your corpse thinking they wont kill you). Remove the fun from the PK'er and they will leave you alone.
Some examples.
- Keep coming back to get killed (if a SL kill), run in front of their gun to stop others being killed. Especially if they are being asses in a hunt zone.
- If it was a facton kill then don't bother going back.
- Warn others of the location. This will keep easy targets away and let the people who like to fight to sort them out.
- Find out of the way levelling spots. For example. Miltary Base is a PK magnet, yet I know of 8 other spots that are static Launcher spawns that PK'ers dont go to because they prefer their sheep in the pen rather then freerange.
- Ignore any taunts and don't engage in conversation.
- Refuse to do any business with them or their clan (extend to faction based on situations).
Don't make them effect you in any way. Once they realise they are not getting the responses they want they will leave.
Also wear the LE until mid level.
Theres more to this game than PvP (political 'conflicts' goes wayyy beyond PvP, especially where the 'corp factions' of the city are concerned)
Absolutely agreed... the Neocron framework doesn't really give us any other way, but that's KKs fault, and it ought to be fixed...
When was the last time in a civilized nation (Neocron) a government, some private corporations some anarchists (TG) and other random people grabbed guns and ran to the bad part of town (PP) to shoot the hell out of each other?
War is about more than just the soldier on the ground.
- Keep coming back to get killed (if a SL kill), run in front of their gun to stop others being killed. Especially if they are being asses in a hunt zone.
This has to be borderline exploiting. I mean if i want to kill Mr. X for whatever
reason that may be, and Mr. Y runs in the line of fire because he wants me
to shoot him, and by doing that loose soullight has to be abusing the game mechanics.
Anyway, I cant say that I agree with much of the other stuff you write aswell.
THE_TICK!!!!
16-07-04, 11:57
Absolutely agreed... the Neocron framework doesn't really give us any other way, but that's KKs fault, and it ought to be fixed...
When was the last time in a civilized nation (Neocron) a government, some private corporations some anarchists (TG) and other random people grabbed guns and ran to the bad part of town (PP) to shoot the hell out of each other?
War is about more than just the soldier on the ground. well first off its a GAME. It's not sposed to be real..thats why i enjoy it...2 i AM a soldier and i AM in a warzone..and i have seen soldiers takin bullets for other soldiers...also..private corporations run allot more than you think....they dont need guns anymore...and if im not mistaking...there really isn't a govt. as we know it in neocron..i think it is pretty much anarchist run and owned ....thats the feel i get anyway...dunno reminds me of texas :D everyone runnin round with GUNS :D
Venus used to be awesome..we had a good population, a good blend of PvP/RP, and then it got screwed up, completely trashed by PK'ers, mostly english-speakers, Saturn players maybe? Or just rascist cunts from any of the servers, who just happened to speak perfect english. Racism..yep, I'm serious.
examples: ``Take that, you french ************!``
``Die, stupid frog noobs!``
``Fucking noob french fries.``
We also had players named Frog Killer, Frog ************, you name it, they were there. Screenshots to Alchemic Dream didn't help much, they just re-rolled with less offensive names, but the comments remained the same. Oh well.
Is the situation on Pluto really that bad? the low server pops, no tradeskillers, etc..? Sounds nice, a 1 server slot where reputation is important.
How's the RP there?
Edit: We can swear and say whatever we want, but the word ``************`` gets censored.Interesting.
Pluto is pretty nice. RP wise people try, and you can find it if you want it also. But in all seriousnes its not asshat free ;P But im shure u werent expecting that anyways.
But it does have a very big RP following in there.
Sorry to hear that stuff happening man, but when you got a agme that draws in from a CS croud, you will have whiny mid teens who shouldnt even be old enough to play the game :/
-Crono
This has to be borderline exploiting. I mean if i want to kill Mr. X for whatever
reason that may be, and Mr. Y runs in the line of fire because he wants me
to shoot him, and by doing that loose soullight has to be abusing the game mechanics.
So, it's an exploit getting ganked by free will now? How about this: STFU.
PvP != Griefing
As I said before once (a) certain playstyle gets forced on me I'm not doing what I want anymore = I'm not having fun, I'm paying to work (and I normally get paid to work :-) ). Since my playstyle obviously isnt popular with some players (or indeed the devs idea of what Neocron is about) I just left rather than kick up a huge fuss, call for nerfs etc - I too old for all that hassle, I'll just go elsewhere (where I can do what I want to do in game)
By the very nature of the game, it's impossible to keep everybody happy and let everybody do what they want. I think in some cases you just have to accept that some places in the game are dangerous and there's a good chance you'll die there. It always strikes me as odd that people will complain when killed by another player, but the fact there was a Grim Chaser just around the corner which would have done the job instead is irrelevant. The point being, it's not only possible but likely that you will die in certain dangerous areas, and that could come from both players and mobs.
The difference between PvP and PKing is merely that PKing refers to non-consensual PvP. Having consensual PvP only would very much damage the atmosphere of the game and a large proportion of what I personally (as a roleplayer who likes to PvP) find to be the highlights of the game destroyed. Also technically, removing the LE is consenting to PvP.
It is harsh, but there isn't really any other way to address the issue. MMORPGs can either go one way or the other, non-consensual PvP allowed, which provides a more realistic atmosphere, or caters to greifers depending on your point of view, or consensual PvP only, which creates some very difficult roleplay situations and generally detracts from the immersion, but eliminating the PKing which seems to upset so many.
A large part of the game revolves around making things happen yourself. If you want something to happen, you have to find other like-minded people and make it happen. When it comes to game mechanics, you're never going to get a response if you want the game to do all of the hard work for you.
That said, the majority of cases where people become upset over PKing tend to occur when a high level or capped runner attacks a lower level runner who has no chance to fight back. The LE is intended as a temporary solution to this problem while the 'victim' levels up to the point where they can fight back. The issue this creates is that some people seem to find levelling up hard work or undesirable. But you're unlikely to find much sympathy in that situation, due to the fact that levelling up is comparatively much easier in NC than in other MMORPGs, and everyone has to do the work at some point, those who have are reaping the rewards (as both killers and potential victims who avoid dying by fighting back).
The practice of a high level player going to an area populated almost entirely by low level players such as cellars or OZ solely with the intention of killing those low level players he comes across is a less than desirable side effect of the atmosphere and PvP system. I think you'll be hard pressed to find a mature player who doesn't agree on that. However, if a reasonable solution was thought up, which didn't affect normal PvP outside this levelling scenario, I think it would have a favourable result. Trying to change the whole system to consensual PvP only, or making changes which seriously affect PvP elsewhere just creates new problems.
EDIT: And one last thing. Would people please fuck off with the "He's a greifer, must be a Saturn player" comments? Not every Saturn player is a greifer, and not every greifer is a Saturn player. There are assholes on Pluto and Uranus who have never once logged into another server just as there are assholes on Saturn who have migrated elsewhere. You want to complain about people being dicks, fine, but there's no evidence that they all start on Saturn and then spread out.
THE_TICK!!!!
17-07-04, 14:52
well said
This has to be borderline exploiting. I mean if i want to kill Mr. X for whatever
reason that may be, and Mr. Y runs in the line of fire because he wants me
to shoot him, and by doing that loose soullight has to be abusing the game mechanics..
I meant if *you* (not you exactly) had killed Mr X as part of a PK run, then yes if Mr X wants to spend his time stopping you from killing others by being killed themselves then there is nothing wrong with it.
I have done it before to great effect. I am not talking about giving the person SL loss in this case. I continued to GR to go back to get killed again. After the 9-10th time the person stopping killing me because "They got bored", then after a few more times stopping them killing others they told me "go get your best weapon, and loose the SL and I will own you bitch". Which was obvious considering I was 50 levels below them. They were getting annoyed because I wasn't putting up a fight for them or getting annoyed by them.
But that has been a long time ago. The mechanics in the game now stop that kind of muppet player. Between LE and hunt zones and factions it limits the amount of annoyance a person can do.
Edit: Good post Scikar.
First I'd like to thank everyone for their replies, I think this is the most civil discussion on this topic I've ever had on these forums (but I could always be speaking too soon)
I think everyone here has good points, the game does draw from diverse crowds and its impossible to please everyone (but to be fair 99% of MMORPGs have that problem) - I think my underlying point was that (imo) KK are failing (atm) to please anyone and perhaps they need to make a choice.
Choose a playstyle and go at it full throttle, granted this will alienate a playgroup(s), but hopefully (for NC as a game) it will keep the target audience happy and allow the playerbase to pull more players in from that audience
The only other alternative I see to that is to make the only penalty for wearing an LE the loss of a implant slot (so LE players can make/join clans) while this would please the RP community I can guarantee the PvP/PK community wont be happy because the number of victims/PvP opponents just took a nose dive and we will still get the usual complaints about LE'd spys in op battles etc (not that the above change would have made this any more/less possible)
At the risk of putting a downturn on the thread, having just read the thread regarding FN being trashed, it seems obvious (to me) that the 100% uncontrolled nature of not having the LE in does also impact the game play of those player who do (normally) wish to participate in PvP
In which respect its not just the RP players problem.....
At the risk of putting a downturn on the thread, having just read the thread regarding FN being trashed, it seems obvious (to me) that the 100% uncontrolled nature of not having the LE in does also impact the game play of those player who do (normally) wish to participate in PvP
In which respect its not just the RP players problem.....Having spoken to a friend who was in a clan notorious for that sort of thing, I'm inclined to agree with his take on the situation. With populations higher, guards could be hired to protect the event. With populations as they are though, that's just not possible, unfortunately. The 'uncontrolled nature' is only when the players themselves don't take control. And I refuse to let game mechanics attempt to do that instead.
THE_TICK!!!!
03-08-04, 19:43
hmm true...its the human factor...nothing we can do about it
i read the first line....and got bored :p
JackScratch
04-08-04, 21:26
The LE is bullshit, it is not a valid answer, fix the LE, then we will talk
PvP is great, shame it is abused out of existance by the "kiddies"
Behavior is the problem, not the game.
Just because the game is just the way you like it, doesnt make it an enticement for the masses, which is the only way for it to survive.
Forget noobs, Ganking as I have come to call the red=dead attitude (or worse) is a problem for the whole game. There are a lot of people who would very much like to engage in PvP, without being whacked every damn time they leave a safe zone. Then there are the people who would like to Opt out of PvP all together, if only there were a way, an actual, valid, real way, that didnt opt them out of the whole rest of the damn game.
Quit whineing, it seems KK is on your side, they want the 5% of the game that is "Hardcore" cause thats realy nifty super cool, and dont care about the group that might potentaily pay the bills, the rest of the world.
Tick, don't bump this thread again, please.
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Totaly agree with you Tick you get 1 rep from me and it annoys me these people only like the game when its going in there favour. I was hunting WB's at battle dome and some LE'd noob ppu comes and fukin holy buffs the WB it went from me doing 100 plus damage to 20 damage he said he did cos I'M THE GRIEFER me the griefer when that tit was griefing cos he was LE'd and there was nothing I could do about him buffing the WB.
Another thing that gets on my nerves is when I kill some one they come right back through the GRep I kill them agian and agian they start whining I'm like "what ?" . There like "your a fucking greifer GR KILLER OMG " and its there stupid fault for comming back through that GR people are so fuking stupid and so ANTI PVP they need to stay in there little safe zones and avoid people like me
Dirk_Gently
05-08-04, 00:02
There like "your a fucking greifer GR KILLER OMG " and its there stupid fault for comming back through that GR people are so fuking stupid and so ANTI PVP they need to stay in there little safe zones and avoid people like me
I have a solution to people like you. If I get GR ganked I stick a DVD on settle back to watch it while repeatedly GRing back to see how long the idiot stays.
My record is two and a half episodes of the Professionals. (so over two hours) ;)
I have a solution to people like you. If I get GR ganked I stick a DVD on settle back to watch it while repeatedly GRing back to see how long the idiot stays.
My record is two and a half episodes of the Professionals. (so over two hours) ;)
My solution to that is keep kill you I will not give in to such fowl play it is just stupid to GR back if your dead your dead you should be in your appy when you die. Which is how I want it to be it would be more realistic and fair on the person who killed you
and to tell ya the truth the server has calmed down LOTS from when i made my first n00b.
Hell yea, I was cold blooded PK'd as a n00b 5-10 times daily during my initial 10+ hours a day when I very first started playing. And there were no safeslots then. I made a lot of trips to my weapon constructor in those times.
Things are a lot more relaxed as a new char now tbh.
anyway, I dont want to seem like that "hrhr put your LE in if you dont want me to pk you n00b" person, but really, if it hurts that much to be killed... you can spare a headslot for it, i used to run the risk (and pay the price, repeatedly, and completely randomly) for the extra xp, now that penalty doesnt exist.
Ive only ever suffered as a result of PKing really, my grand total of blind PK's in my year and a half on cron is very unlikely to have reached double figures.
Dirk_Gently
05-08-04, 00:11
My solution to that is keep kill you I will not give in to such fowl play it is just stupid to GR back if your dead your dead you should be in your appy when you die. Which is how I want it to be it would be more realistic and fair on the person who killed you
lol I only do that if somebody breaks the structure of the game (i.e. ally ganking me), if I'm red then that's fair enough and I don't do it.
Personally I think that if you gank an ally the cosmic hand of Ceres should descend from the sky and bitch-slap you back into the stoneage.
YET ANOTHER 'IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT LEAVE' POST
I'm done responding intelligently to people basically telling me that if I don't like being harrassed for their amusement to stick it up my ass.
you can all fuck off, I pay for your precious servers too
To those of you actually trying to find a solution, it's going to be an uphill battle to get KK to do anything, but I agree something needs to be done.
don't want a purely non-PvP environment, I agree that if you're a pure pacifist then you need to realize that Neocron might not be up your ally and play a game that accomadates that better... but saying, 'if you don't like it, leave' is really kind of immature.
The problem, as it has been stated thousands of times, is not PvP, it's PK, it's griefkilling and it's harrasment in general of new players.
There are several good solutions that have been proposed, only to have the threads flamed into oblivion.
Since it's obvious that many players will never be mature, KK needs to step in and do something to protect the people that are getting forced out of the game...
My personal favorite idea is making warzones free-for-all zones (IE going into one you know you're on dangerous ground and are consenting to accept the risks) making LEs work everywhere else, adding LE clans and taking away some of the minuses to the LE, but making it not work in a warzone or a faction HQ (the guards protect you there) and I HATE the idea of HQs being safe zones in DoY, seems completely backwards from what it ought to be...
THE_TICK!!!!
05-08-04, 16:14
well what solution could you POSSIBLY think of to take away the human elament without corrupting the base logic of the game ? people are imature people are HUMAN they hold grudges and act stupid..to fix this you would have to take the HUMAN equivelent out of the game..and then what kind of game would it be ?
ResurgencE
05-08-04, 19:23
Deal with it...IMHO the only thing
this game needs is some sort of age verification...to keep the kiddies out...So
now that ive said my peace....flame away..im sure i will have some more
affleunt people who can state what im tryin to say a tad more clearly..help me out
Heh..ill help you out. 'Affluent' means 'rich'. :p
cent..i guess in part its about your post but not fully..let me start with a question..when you started where there capped players..and if so..did you get killed ? did it scare you away? no? why not..ill answer my question on my behalf yes there was capped players and yes i got pk'd and YES i stayed, And i loved the game and still do...even since CURRENTLY and for the past 7 months ive been in iraq..and it doesn't look as if im coming home anytime soon..so the coming back and having to play catchup thing doesn suck..since i did get a 2 week vacation to come home. But thats not KK's fault that i took and extended break..so im not goin to try and change anything im goin to bust my ass to get back where i belong..on top.
Well i gave up reading after the third page but this says it all really... Tick u are spot on theres always people thats higher then u... its the nature of the game....
If when i started just after retail and i didnt go PP and see some tanks in blue PA i proberly would have quit... but all i could think of is that smurf PA so off i went with a challenge to avoid being PK'd and to get the smurf asap.
Seeing higher lvl people is inspiration.... also u need high lvl peeps to do epics and start clans.... clans then help help new people to the game by helping them lvl and give them equipment, these new players then get high and help other new people lvl and get equipment, IT IS A CIRCLE, and it works, simple.
Only thing i didnt agree with u Tick m8 is about u being on top :P lol
Totaly agree with you Tick you get 1 rep from me and it annoys me these people only like the game when its going in there favour. I was hunting WB's at battle dome and some LE'd noob ppu comes and fukin holy buffs the WB it went from me doing 100 plus damage to 20 damage he said he did cos I'M THE GRIEFER me the griefer when that tit was griefing cos he was LE'd and there was nothing I could do about him buffing the WB.
Another thing that gets on my nerves is when I kill some one they come right back through the GRep I kill them agian and agian they start whining I'm like "what ?" . There like "your a fucking greifer GR KILLER OMG " and its there stupid fault for comming back through that GR people are so fuking stupid and so ANTI PVP they need to stay in there little safe zones and avoid people like me
So, you only like it when the game is going your way- you expect people to play the game your way and not come back once you PK them. Nice, real nice.
THE_TICK!!!!
09-08-04, 20:03
Ok cerbi i just added you to the LIST 8| MUHAHAHAHA but i agree totally with everything you said..except for one thing..common man you know you look under my cloak when im standing on my pedestal :p
Tick, don't bump this thread again, please.
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