View Full Version : Neptune interest poll!
Psycho Killa
21-06-04, 00:32
Ok I know this has been done 1000 times but none recently. If this was posted a year and a half ago I would bet my life over 95% would say yes but the game has changed alot since then in player base and the fact that there will be fewer safe zones in doy making a small part of neptune unneccesary.
Reasons for neptune/ Hopeful rules
1) Absolutely no safe zones.
2) No safe slot
3) No hack needed to open belt (My personal prefference)
4) Bounty system to reward the hunting of criminals/ give the mercs a reason to exist.
5) MAke being a criminal viable but not as desireable as being a normal citizen. For instance barred from using genereps or atleast good standing city admin members are alerted like 45 seconds after a genrep is used when a criminal uses it. So they are reluctant to use genreps but get a headstart if they chose to. Also max drop is 3 items for severe criminals 2 for average criminals.
6) Give reasons to be a faction and stick there. City mercs get special bounty hunter mechanics. City admin gets certain law enforcement abilities. Black dragon gets to control the drug market. Tsunami can make money off of clubs somehow etc etc.
These rules are not kk's of course just some speculated thing. Please vote yes if you agree with the general idea of neptune not neccesarily all the rules/ideas i posted.
Anyways most people refer to Neptune as the hardcore or pk server though its my beleif that more people will roleplay in this enviroment then the forced enviroment of the current servers.
/Mods can u please add a Maybe option I thought I added one.
leGit v. 2
21-06-04, 00:53
nice idea. nub.. when we going to play together again psycho.. and where are you ? you at work?
None whatsoever.
Neocron shouldn't have a non-carebear server. The whole game shouldn't be carebear in the firstplace.
[EDIT]
@ Below.
Well i certainly agree with that benjie but since thats never going to happen why not throw your support to the only pheasable option.Whatever - I would prefer it if Pluto was made the official RP server with LE, Safeslot, etc - And Saturn was made into the Neptune inspired server with all the features Neptune usually boasts.
Pluto is already the biggest RP server, and Saturn is the Biggest PvP server. Why not fortify this by making it official and altering the game mechanics on those two servers accordingly? Makes a hella sence to me.
Three cheers for Benjie!!
Psycho Killa
21-06-04, 01:27
Well i certainly agree with that benjie but since thats never going to happen why not throw your support to the only pheasable option.
/Ya im at work
1) Absolutely no safe zones.
i have np with that
2) No safe slot
not 100% with this idea because of the importance of rares.
3) No hack needed to open belt (My personal prefference)
100% agree to that
4) Bounty system to reward the hunting of criminals/ give the mercs a reason to exist.
yup thats cool idea
5) MAke being a criminal viable but not as desireable as being a normal citizen. For instance barred from using genereps or atleast good standing city admin members are alerted like 45 seconds after a genrep is used when a criminal uses it. So they are reluctant to use genreps but get a headstart if they chose to. Also max drop is 3 items for severe criminals 2 for average criminals.
seems ok idea
6) Give reasons to be a faction and stick there. City mercs get special bounty hunter mechanics. City admin gets certain law enforcement abilities. Black dragon gets to control the drug market. Tsunami can make money off of clubs somehow etc etc.
yup i think there should be reasons for us to stay in a faction
though i dont see netune as something that will come, since DoY has removal of all safe zones except for HQs
i belive criminal is to be more viable
and i would hope reasons to stay as a faction are in DoY
I would like the complete removal of all safezones, and the reduction of stationary copbots around plaza. Boost the amount of copbots on patroll. and add seating next to all the stationary copbots. Copbots then to shoot you if you pull out a weapon, and the ability to take n extra hit of copbot fire.
One things for sure. If they are going to make clubs safezones then they had better improve the pepetual loop. Even add a dynamic Jukebox with a selection of perpetual loops to choose from.
:p
@ Below. Whatever - I would prefer it if Pluto was made the official RP server with LE, Safeslot, etc - And Saturn was made into the Neptune inspired server with all the features Neptune usually boasts.
Pluto is already the biggest RP server, and Saturn is the Biggest PvP server. Why not fortify this by making it official and altering the game mechanics on those two servers accordingly? Makes a hella sence to me.
Three cheers for Benjie!!
that is THEE worst idea ive ever heard, 3 cheers?, more like 3 kicks up the ass
btw i really dislike you.
that is THEE worst idea ive ever heard, 3 cheers?, more like 3 kicks up the ass
btw i really dislike you.
Maybe explaining WHY you dislike it might be better.
Anywho, God, I love all those options. 100% behind it.
btw i really dislike you.
I always thought you where kind cool in your crazy way, and I like your crazy signature.
:(
I personally wouldn't play Neptune, but I still support the idea and I hope it gets started. It would hopefully get rid of a lot of the retards on my server and I might actually be able to walk around without an LE. Let all the jackasses go noob gank each other on Neptune :lol: with their lack of safe zones, safe slots, etc etc. Would theoretically be their paradise.
Psycho Killa
21-06-04, 02:49
7) Decrease the neccesity of rares :D
Sorin is right anyone who would'nt play on this server but would like to get rid of some of the asshats from there should support this idea. Let the asshats come be criminals on neptune after all im gonna need someone to hunt down :lol:
Yes, under two conditions:
1) Drop rate is increased (alot)
2) Damage from non-rare weapons are all increased to lessen the gap.
Sure
You ppl who want to PK others for no reason - go ahead on your own server.
@ Below. Whatever - I would prefer it if Pluto was made the official RP server with LE, Safeslot, etc
How about no? Just boot griefers (noob & faction killers/Gr campers) out of the game/server. Make it the "we dont PK here for no reason and we role play a bit more"-server. I've just ditched my because of the more mature server crowd on Pluto - dont fuck that server up, fuck up some other server please.
How about no? Just boot griefers (noob & faction killers/Gr campers) out of the game/server. Make it the "we dont PK here for no reason and we role play a bit more"-server. I've just ditched my because of the more mature server crowd on Pluto - dont fuck that server up, fuck up some other server please.
Hey thats a good idea. Then, wait, then why don't we make a new class "elf" and call the game 'everquest'? Don't think that names used, right?
I always thought you where kind cool in your crazy way, and I like your crazy signature.
:(
omg i hurt feelings
<3
All I can do when people just post and post and post the same idea all over again, without even bothering to read through old threads and think about it, is laugh insanely and try to forget how ignorant people can be :D
How about no? Just boot griefers (noob & faction killers/Gr campers) out of the game/server. Make it the "we dont PK here for no reason and we role play a bit more"-server. I've just ditched my because of the more mature server crowd on Pluto - dont fuck that server up, fuck up some other server please.
It will fuck up Pluto though. A large number of Pluto would move to Neptune in a heartbeat (as would other servers). Think its bad with 30 people online in the morning now?
Anyway you clearly haven't played on a hardcore server. Rampant ganking? Most likely, but generally that is from the "Tourists" from other servers who couldn't last long on the server. Once you start getting to mid-high levels you will find people will bond better for a common goal.
Of course you pretty much seem to think the server will be full of assholes, but then I have a better opinion of the people who would join the server.
Hell yes.
@Benjie: There's no reason why RP shouldn't exist on Neptune. So why spoil any chance of that straight off by making it out of Saturn?
Add both of Judge's ideas and one more thing to it and you have my vote:
8) All specialization reduced.
And no, I will not stop until this happens.
Why must you insist on calling it "Neptune"?
Call it the NeoFrag server instead and add a frag-counter, make all weapons buyable and remove all NPCs, Remove all zones except one, because, why would you need more zones when all you'll be doing is fighting other people?
Start characters off capped with all point freely movable, as in, no need for lomming... the list is endless, and it all points in one direction...
--> Counter-Strike with more options and a better chat-box
:rolleyes:
Why must you insist on calling it "Neptune"?
Call it the NeoFrag server instead and add a frag-counter, make all weapons buyable and remove all NPCs, Remove all zones except one, because, why would you need more zones when all you'll be doing is fighting other people?
Start characters off capped with all point freely movable, as in, no need for lomming... the list is endless, and it all points in one direction...
--> Counter-Strike with more options and a better chat-box
:rolleyes:
Because we're not narrow minded and can see that there would clearly be a hell of a lot more to Neptune than simple PK sprees. It would in fact be regular Neocron with a REAL atmosphere, where you experience adrenaline rushes, real fear and panic, and real pride after a victory, because you stand to actually lose or gain something from a fight, and there will be no oppurtunity to sit around in Plaza 2 spamming trade and abusing someone - because they'll run over and kill you, instead of being warned by a CopBot.
Psycho Killa
21-06-04, 12:43
Mishkin your ignorance is blinding.
This isn't an old idea im rehashing its KKS IDEA U DUMBASS
We where promised this 2 years ago. Not to mention the fact that this wont be the "neofrag" server u call it. This enviroment will encourage more roleplay then the current servers ever did. Why be a dodgey tradeskiller when u can be capped anywhere you are? Why be a noob killer when u can be chased to the ends of the earth? Why be an asshat in general when u can be hunted and chased down?
People like in real life will form groups and protect eachother.
I for one will be starting/joining either a Merc clan (carry out assasinations) a police clan or a criminal clan (criminal DOES NOT mean random pker) depending on which one is more needed. My money is on the police clan.
Will neptune be chaos at first? Yep you bet but lets see how long it takes for the people to straighten themselves out. Why have'nt the other servers straightened themselves out? Because assholes can go pk noobs in the aggie cellar then stand up stairs bragging about it as they stand untouchable in a safe zone. Take away the safe zones u take away the asshats.
Because we're not narrow minded and can see that there would clearly be a hell of a lot more to Neptune than simple PK sprees. It would in fact be regular Neocron with a REAL atmosphere, where you experience adrenaline rushes, real fear and panic, and real pride after a victory, because you stand to actually lose or gain something from a fight, and there will be no oppurtunity to sit around in Plaza 2 spamming trade and abusing someone - because they'll run over and kill you, instead of being warned by a CopBot.
What would you have to lose in your belt? Shopbought stuff? If you have a server with no safe-zones, do you know how hard it would be to take on the role of a tradeskiller? You just stated that it would be impossible to sit anywhere and spam trade, that would mean it would be sort of impossible to trade at all... If you want to call me narrowminded, then so be it, I could say the same thing about you, because clearly, we see totally different sides of the subject... :) That's kinda why we post our opinions here at all :rolleyes:
What would you have to lose in your belt? Shopbought stuff? If you have a server with no safe-zones, do you know how hard it would be to take on the role of a tradeskiller? You just stated that it would be impossible to sit anywhere and spam trade, that would mean it would be sort of impossible to trade at all... If you want to call me narrowminded, then so be it, I could say the same thing about you, because clearly, we see totally different sides of the subject... :) That's kinda why we post our opinions here at all :rolleyes:
Trade from an apartment? Faction HQ? Trade with friends nearby with weapons drawn just in case? Trade in rarely used areas like ProtoPharm Lab, OZ, even drop down into the Main Sewers? Ever thought of the fact that nobody would be stupid enough to kill a bunch of tradeskillers if they ever wanted another poke? Or tradeskiller clans, with a poking PPU around, CST/RES spies with pistols since they can easily cap an Exec at no cost to their tradeskill? All sticking together and able to fight off small groups of attackers, bearing in mind that anyone they are doing a job for is obviously going to pitch in and help?
Man... some people can be so stupid.
Neptune != Counterstrike you fools.
Tbh with you, I don't see why the real NC players should be relegated to another server. I think that all the servers atm should have Neptune rules, and then we make a Carebear server.
What would you have to lose in your belt? Shopbought stuff? If you have a server with no safe-zones, do you know how hard it would be to take on the role of a tradeskiller? You just stated that it would be impossible to sit anywhere and spam trade, that would mean it would be sort of impossible to trade at all...
You join a trade guild who protect an area. Generally certain areas would be treated as no-fire zones. Peace treaties are held more.
Also capping a tradeskiller will guarantee you never get a tradeskiller again (unless you own the resources to do it). Similar happens on pluto. You can only be an ass on Pluto for so long.
Or tradeskiller clans, with a poking PPU around, CST/RES spies with pistols since they can easily cap an Exec at no cost to their tradeskill?
Just as a hint, that does not go for CST, as has been pointed out in a different thread... :rolleyes:
criminal DOES NOT mean random pker
Then what does it mean in the world of Neocron? Someone who just robbed Yakarmas and left with 10 Holy heals and 3k in cash? What crimes are possible to accomplish in this game except for killing another player or an NPC?
Because assholes can go pk noobs in the aggie cellar then stand up stairs bragging about it as they stand untouchable in a safe zone. Take away the safe zones u take away the asshats.
Most of the asshats in the game right now are the ones who spend 90% of their time in non-safe-zones pking innocent noobs... Why would that change if you remove the safe-zones all together?
EDIT:
Also capping a tradeskiller will guarantee you never get a tradeskiller again (unless you own the resources to do it)
I hope that by capping, you mean killing, because otherwise I did not understand that sentence... :D
I think this is the best way to help roleplayers.
I think it's a good idea to get rid of safe zones, i don't think it's fair for starters the city is protected by a subliminal drop that weapon message that even effects people in anti city apartments.
Copbots should be about pratrolling the plaza and via, i'd even go as far as to say some S.T.O.R.M.S should be in plaza 1 as it is the City Admin hq area and would be most protected.
MAKE NCPD PLAYABLE.
Make varying tl ncpd armours for CA runners, make the recruitment process hard but rewarding.
Have lotsa items flagged as illegal, ncpd armours with like law enforcemen +1 to say allow officers to do a quick scan of player invs, with the only thing being detailed in the chat is either "Illegal items detected" "Nothing".
heh that's only the start of my idea... i cba to write the rest :D
It will fuck up Pluto though. A large number of Pluto would move to Neptune in a heartbeat (as would other servers). Think its bad with 30 people online in the morning now?
And people are not leaving the game because of griefers doing whatever they please?
Anyway you clearly haven't played on a hardcore server.
I have, but this is not BF 1942 or UT. This is a game of mixed PvP/3vP/PvM and social interaction. Only want PvP? then play Planetside.
Of course you pretty much seem to think the server will be full of assholes, but then I have a better opinion of the people who would join the server.
Did i say that? No, YOU implied that i said that.
+ignore Archeus
Ok I know this has been done 1000 times but none recently. If this was posted a year and a half ago I would bet my life over 95% would say yes but the game has changed alot since then in player base and the fact that there will be fewer safe zones in doy making a small part of neptune unneccesary.
Reasons for neptune/ Hopeful rules
1) Absolutely no safe zones.
2) No safe slot
3) No hack needed to open belt (My personal prefference)
4) Bounty system to reward the hunting of criminals/ give the mercs a reason to exist.
5) MAke being a criminal viable but not as desireable as being a normal citizen. For instance barred from using genereps or atleast good standing city admin members are alerted like 45 seconds after a genrep is used when a criminal uses it. So they are reluctant to use genreps but get a headstart if they chose to. Also max drop is 3 items for severe criminals 2 for average criminals.
6) Give reasons to be a faction and stick there. City mercs get special bounty hunter mechanics. City admin gets certain law enforcement abilities. Black dragon gets to control the drug market. Tsunami can make money off of clubs somehow etc etc.
These rules are not kk's of course just some speculated thing. Please vote yes if you agree with the general idea of neptune not neccesarily all the rules/ideas i posted.
Anyways most people refer to Neptune as the hardcore or pk server though its my beleif that more people will roleplay in this enviroment then the forced enviroment of the current servers.
/Mods can u please add a Maybe option I thought I added one.
im not saying you will, but i expect that most people who want neptune for those reasons, will be spamming on trade 'OMFG KK GIMMIE MY *ITEM* BACK I FUCKING LOSTS IT BECAUSE OF THIS STUPID FUCKING GAME PUT SOULLIGHT AND SHIT BACK IN OR I WILL QUIT' a week after neptune is opened (if it is)
i personally am against the idea of not having a quick slot, but i think there should be no safe zones, but just zones like plaza 1 have the guards still. i think there should be soul light too, but you only loose a few points when you pk sum1 etc (and none if this hunting zone bollocks) and keep warzones the same.
Just as a hint, that does not go for CST, as has been pointed out in a different thread... :rolleyes:
It's a thread I haven't seen then, since I can easily post to the contrary. A spy with a PPU always with him needs no psi use, and 50 base weapon lore for his Exec. Every single remaining point goes into CST, and he has CST 3 on top of that. I know it would work, and it's exactly what I'd do on Neptune. I have a friend who is all for the idea of a poking PPU tradeskiller who also serves to protect the tradeskillers. Between us, we'll make an absolute assload of cash if there aren't many tradeskillers. On top of that, there are hundred more RP oppurtunities. For example, hiring BD thugs to bully other tradeskillers into staying away from our turf, so that we have less competition and make more cash. Far more interesting than 3 spy clones all CSTing and REPping to the same TLs and doing nothing else all day.
Then what does it mean in the world of Neocron? Someone who just robbed Yakarmas and left with 10 Holy heals and 3k in cash? What crimes are possible to accomplish in this game except for killing another player or an NPC?
Only because SL is fucked up. Once having negative SL doesn't have stupid penalties, you have SL loss for buying high level drugs like Beast and Redflash, or perhaps a low penalty for buying them but a high one for producing and selling them, anti city factions automatically become criminals, etc. Surely you can realise that there's considerably more to it than just porting the current servers and taking away safezones and belts?
Most of the asshats in the game right now are the ones who spend 90% of their time in non-safe-zones pking innocent noobs... Why would that change if you remove the safe-zones all together?
Wrong. Most of the asshats PK in aggie cellars and then zone up, etc. When they don't have a PPU, they sit in Plaza 2 until they do, so that they never get killed. Once they're capped, they never set foot outside of a safezone without a PPU up their ass. Now, I DARE you to be an asshat on Neptune. Because if you start pissing off half the server, you have literally nowhere to hide.
Clownst0pper
21-06-04, 13:20
I dont like this idea.
If you werent aware, there will be no safe zones apart from Faction HQ's, and Bars in DOY.
What is the point in Neptune? So you can all get off on ganking one another until you loose all your stuff and start moaning? Or until everyone jumps into a certain clans band wagon, and constantly raids everything and everyone.
No one will play a tank, or a PPU, or a PE, or an APU.
The only people that will play on neptune are pistol/rifle spys and droners, who have the ability to stealth, gaurenteeing they wont loose there stuff.
As unlike spys, no other class has such a "getaway" tool.
Sorry, but ive always hated the Idea of Neptune. Belts are fine, just lower the requirment on hack, and wait for DOY.
Until then, I will enjoy PVP how it supposed to be, in Warzones, and in Belt drop zones, where it has some sort of organisation and balance.
And people are not leaving the game because of griefers doing whatever they please?
You mean leaving the server? Not the game. You don't have to play on Neptune if it is not your playstyle. Look I can understand you not wanting Pluto turned into Neptune as you play there, but I don't see how you could be against this server if the other servers are still there?
I have, but this is not BF 1942 or UT. This is a game of mixed PvP/3vP/PvM and social interaction. Only want PvP? then play Planetside.
Don't knock it until you have tried it. They are nothing like non-stop PvP. If anything it helps build communities as you dont have anything to hide behind (ie. The LE or safezones). So for good or evil, you have to help others, you have to look after your parts of the map.
Did i say that? No, YOU implied that i said that.
+ignore Archeus
No your implying that all Neptune will bring is griefing assholes who will GR camp and kill newbies all day. If that is the case then it will remove them from the server you are playing on? So what is your problem?
Sure scikar, you can be a good constructor if you want without gimping your combat-abilities, but if you want to be the best, you want to be a pure one. :)
Surely you can realise that there's considerably more to it than just porting the current servers and taking away safezones and belts?
Yes, I do, new features that need alot of coding should be added, but I very much doubt that anything will be done about it. Besides, removing all safe-zones and the belt-drop is what most people have proposed as the main rules for the "Neptune" server.
The game is balanced right now, at least on Pluto where I play, come see for yourself if you haven't been there, and could always try to act like an asshat there too, not much difference to what would happen on "Neptune" ;)
Heretic Shadow
21-06-04, 13:31
... RP does happen on saturn, people just dont marry eachother and type actions with stars. on topic, i dont really see the need for it the only core difference is the removal of safezones thats coming with doy anyway.
... RP does happen on saturn, people just dont marry eachother and type actions with stars. on topic, i dont really see the need for it the only core difference is the removal of safezones thats coming with doy anyway.
Safezones are not being removed in BDOY. They are just being moved around.
O h yeah
if MC5 SERVED ITS PURPOSE by the time "noobs" reach neocron they should be getting to a decent level with some decents weps.... but tbh i think mc5 should take players upto half cap before it chucks them out to the real world... ie you hit rank /35 the copbot wastes you and your forced to gr out to nc.
Add some kinda player shops, a ebay type system then tradeskillers (cst/res) can do it from there apt and set the store up for players to buy/sell etc.
I think places should give certain bonuses ie medicare gives imp +20 or something or even let medicare hire players to imp and give them a flag Medicare Employee, make them green to most peeps (like the red cross kinda).
Offer people jobs within there faction or within the world aswell .... shops hire guards, players, factions hire runners to do things for them etc
Sure scikar, you can be a good constructor if you want without gimping your combat-abilities, but if you want to be the best, you want to be a pure one. :)
You do realise of course that 50 base weapon lore is a loss of 10 CST? Any constructors who go pure CST I can just bully. That's the whole beauty of the Neptune server - people can really be evil, and be real Tsunamis and Black Dragons. That creates a need for real CAs. So we have good vs bad which always makes a good fight. As opposed to now, where there is no incentive for CA to be any less of a bunch of asshats than BD.
Yes, I do, new features that need alot of coding should be added, but I very much doubt that anything will be done about it. Besides, removing all safe-zones and the belt-drop is what most people have proposed as the main rules for the "Neptune" server.
Of course nothing will be done about it if everybody says "No it will be a PK fest without even thinking".
The game is balanced right now, at least on Pluto where I play, come see for yourself if you haven't been there, and could always try to act like an asshat there too, not much difference to what would happen on "Neptune" ;)
I have been playing on Pluto for quite some time now. I've played on and off over the last few months, you may recognise the name Scipher amongst Mirror-Shades. However, I never stay on Pluto for long periods at a time, because it's always being dominated by one group of people I don't like or another. First NDA, then FF, then DarK. Pluto is as bad as Saturn is for asshats, and anyone who believes otherwise hasn't played both.
Psycho Killa
21-06-04, 18:22
If you don't like the idea fine say so but dont go on and on about how its never going to work.If it doesn't work then good all the jerks will be on neptune and you will have your nice little server all to yourself.I can see why you would not want to play on neptune but I see ZERO reason to be against other people getting a server they would enjoy.
Sure scikar, you can be a good constructor if you want without gimping your combat-abilities, but if you want to be the best, you want to be a pure one. :)
Theyre will be ZERO difference between a constructer spy with 50 base weaponlore and one with all construct. Anyone who tells you otherwise is a fool.
Ive been pretty devoted to Pluto and considered staying on it even if Neptune was released, but Pluto has been pretty damn dissappointing lately. Not much reason to play on it any more. I think I'd gladly make the switch to Neptune, or at least play there occasionally. Might be fun to play it as a sort of Bizarro world and join CityAdmin on Neptune. :p
As for the constructor issue, I personally have two accounts, Id probably create a Jest PE and just make him pure tradeskill like Killer did with his. The PE would cap faster than the spy and I could just LoM it out no problem. Granted this would only be an option for multiple account whores like me, but then again there are quite a few of us. :P So tradeskilling will most likely not suffer.
Doc Holliday
21-06-04, 19:25
if it brings more rp and allows some actual fun to be had im in. only one concern is the safeslot.as stated in benjis post on a similar issue.removal of safeslot means noob gets hurt if he loses his weapon. not many can afford spares and its always the best one which u use to level. other than that. im all for it.
If neptune does come around I think that there should be a warning before you try to make a character on it that "Neptune is the hardcore (real) server and that the game is alot harder to play on this server, we recommend that you start on another server and progress to Neptune once you understand the game better."
-=BlackBeard=-
21-06-04, 20:41
if no safe slot then no sl either
and i think the belts shud be hackable or at least u shud be able to destroy them
also we want to be able to sell tags to ure faction councellor for i dunno 10 k?
but yeah i want neptune bad
if no safe slot then no sl either
and i think the belts shud be hackable or at least u shud be able to destroy them
also we want to be able to sell tags to ure faction councellor for i dunno 10 k?
but yeah i want neptune bad
Anarchy is not the land of "do as you please" - V for Vendetta.
You want a reasonable amount of laws so as to not turn it into a death match. Leave SL in but lower the penalties for it (more of were you can go, rather then item loss).
that is THEE worst idea ive ever heard, 3 cheers?, more like 3 kicks up the ass
btw i really dislike you.
LOL!!!!!!!!!!! someone had to say it...nothing personal, but opiniated people are annoying, in my opinion :)
I can easily believe that you are really bisexual, you are as bad as my ex-girlfriend
(not to personally insult you, just harmless fun) :angel:
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.