View Full Version : PvP in hunting zones
sir retail
14-06-04, 11:32
Yes i know a lot of you will think this sir Retail is a stupid munk for posting this.. but ill try it anyway.
I am absolutly not against PKing.. im not an angel to. :angel:
But i dont think that huntingzones (i mean the sewers and the caves). Are places where you have to be afraid of being Pked.
For instance if you have an droner in a cave you are most of the time the last man on the sene. You will not be in front off all the mobs. And you cant see youre body when flying a drone. So Yes you will be the first that dies by Pking.. Not even notice you been pawnd.. You cant hide there..
Now they changed the LE story it makes it verry hard to keep an good feeling about leveling in the caves.
i hope the info i just writed down is explaining what i mean.
So i have an idea..
1. if you are Pking someone in a Hzone. You will suffer 50% damage of what you are doing to youre opponent.. and loose SL of course..
2. Let ppl put there LE back in. Regardless of youre rank.. You could even let pp. buy high level LE's at shops.. Or you cant pull it out for a week.
3. PPl dont take dammage from other ppl in the sewers/caves.
lets poll this..
nono, keep the LE in and then you dont have to worry bout that, i think the current system is very good. Except someone exploting the LE function, by running into an op and tell where the enemies are etc. or driving a chaincraft up upon a dead enemy, there is no chance to rezz then. Okay if it was an UN le'd player who did the chaincraft\revler thing i would say it was ok, but not the LE's. And offcourse LE repairer -> Rhino.
I hate it.
If i see someone Red anywhere in game even if it is in a Cave then i shall kill them.
The only times i won't if they are part of a group who are allies of mine then i will let him be.
But yes, red = dead hunting zone or not.
Only place i think that should be control in "pvp" is the sewer coz thats like lowest of teh low, the aggy dens should be the same as the rest, it's dull without pondering if some cs tank doing some quick int missions is gonna suddenly turn and plant cs all over ya face.
I ain't really into pking and never really have been but i think the Hunting Zone is excessive, there's plenty of other places to hit if they Den has a pker in and generally in the city a small force will eventually sort em.
sir retail
14-06-04, 11:45
okey.. how about an LE that only works at sewers and caves?
than ppl cant exploid the vehicle repair thingy.. :wtf:
sounds good?
How about LE's be neutralised in Warzones :confused:
sir retail
14-06-04, 12:02
How about LE's be neutralised in Warzones :confused:
this was a differend thread..
We could have 2 LE's : one that comes from the beginning and one that you could buy and put in later. this one could like only work in sewers and caves.
this was a differend thread..
We could have 2 LE's : one that comes from the beginning and one that you could buy and put in later. this one could like only work in sewers and caves.
Higher level you should be able to defend yourself, although i am in favour of LE based play if you start making all the prime spots safe then loads of people will be LE'd and the rest will be fighting.
Everyone will just use it to powerlevel safely in caves
Jeezes, if you pull the le and decide to level in a dangerous zone, you have a chance to die, simple as that.
Actually, try leveling without implants, it goes a lot faster and you don't have to worry about getting killed either cuz it'll level your con.
Like this morning my 0/30 veh rep research spy was ganked 4 times in a row by the same TG tank, at MB. I didn't care, i just an back each time, as i love the con i get, since being in a rhino you don't level that up much :-)
nah get out of here, theres nothing better than a black dragon hit squad raiding the TG caves and wipe them all out while they are trying to kill a chaos luitenant :lol:
im sorry but far to many people are wanting the danger and excitement from this game, its not as fun as it used to be to PvP/Pk and the way things are going with the current crop of players this game is gonna be carebearocron.
sir retail
14-06-04, 12:12
Higher level you should be able to defend yourself,
how can a droner spy defend himself in a cave..?
im not talking for my spy.. becouse he is still LEed but i was leveling yesterday with a frienly non LEed spy in a cave..
when a BD just poped in.. and killed him.. even when he was alied with him..
(yes i know BD do that.)
how can a droner spy defend himself in a cave..?
im not talking for my spy.. becouse he is still LEed but i was leveling yesterday with a frienly non LEed spy in a cave..
when a BD just poped in.. and killed him.. even when he was alied with him..
(yes i know BD do that.)
heh
The sheer amount of exp and money a droner makes caving....
Hell he can solo the graves and prolly not do badly in the others, a few deaths a day is no way a sting on him.
He just needs to get back out there.
Out of all who need help leveling it aint no droner
how can a droner spy defend himself in a cave..?
im not talking for my spy.. becouse he is still LEed but i was leveling yesterday with a frienly non LEed spy in a cave..
when a BD just poped in.. and killed him.. even when he was alied with him..
(yes i know BD do that.)
The droner can go level somewhere like the Graves, which are fairly bad for other classes to go to with all the poison snakes around, but droners are fine. I can't believe you're honestly suggesting remove all PvP in hunting zones just because droners can't fight back after they choose to make the risky tactical decision of going into a cave.
In sewers, yes, there is no reason for people to be fighting in sewers, but in caves? Hell no. There shouldn't even be an SL hit for PKing in caves.
sir retail
14-06-04, 12:34
i honnestly tryed to make the point..
but i see im the onlyone that has that idea..
so i'll rest. I really thought i was comming with a really good idea.
But seeing all youre posts. i think im the only one. DAMN.
i will stop defending this idea.. -- untill i come up with a better one :D
Richard Slade
14-06-04, 12:58
I'd say only give 50% dmg so you can atleast get have a chance to survive
Never been ganked in the sewers.. only in warzones and other non-city facilities.
Richard Slade
14-06-04, 13:13
Never been ganked in the sewers.. only in warzones and other non-city facilities.
n00b..
sir retail
14-06-04, 14:11
okey my last try on this..
it is a shame that you cant just have a place for a quiet evening leveling.. afther a hard day work.. without being fucked up by an overactive murderer...
8| auw.... 8| why am i looking to the seeling O_o dead who me? :eek:
HoneyMonster
14-06-04, 14:14
The droner can go level somewhere like the Graves, which are fairly bad for other classes to go to with all the poison snakes around, but droners are fine. I can't believe you're honestly suggesting remove all PvP in hunting zones just because droners can't fight back after they choose to make the risky tactical decision of going into a cave.
In sewers, yes, there is no reason for people to be fighting in sewers, but in caves? Hell no. There shouldn't even be an SL hit for PKing in caves.
Said by the same person with remove para in his sig *whistles*
not bd are u ? :lol:
Anyway i think the point retail is trying to make is that there would be no need to talk about isolating pvp from hunting zone's if there was a option for people to put the le in past rank 30.
And why should a player be forced to go hunt somewhere else ?? i would like to see u get the the graves as a pro city spy with no stealth no con or no str aka a standard droner :o
but i toataly agree with disabling the le in a WZ
just my thoughts :angel:
-=BlackBeard=-
14-06-04, 14:17
I hate it.
But yes, red = dead hunting zone or not.
cudnt agree more
$tormbringer
14-06-04, 14:22
ffs the caves r zones where mob with 3 stars r crawling around... i dont even get it y they r "noob lvl zones"... if u can go and lvl there u r strong enuff to defend yourself when u get attacked... i would say remove the sl hit when killiing ppl in the caves -_-
n00b..
Yes - my little foofoo Tank is still a noob; dont have much to put up a fight with when tagging GR's (was 0/7 or something), and unlike most i dont have 10 million on the server to pay drivers - or for protection... i just storm the premises and try to tag'em. More challenging that way, especially when some loosers are camping (read GRIEFING) the GR. (When grown up i'll be retaliating.. again and again and again.)
Besides; This thread never talked talked about disabling the LE. You lameasses who constantly pick on LE users should give it a rest. All you want to do is to kill newbies. Why not play counterstrike against bots with the AI off ? Should be just as challenging..
Btw, regarding "red is dead",
are you talking about the faction name that appear over the player, or the targetting reticule, or the overall thing?
..if i do missions to get 50 symphaty in all factions, will i be green to everyone? I generally dont run around and PK people with my main char on Pluto (still LE'd, dooh?!) but i consider it, because i really REALLY want to do the epic(s) soon. I know, J random PK'er wont be stopped, but i'm talking about the majority "red is dead" players.
Red = dead to me means anyone i see who is enemy to my faction i will attack.
Usually if they are clanless though i may just leave them, especially if they are level 35 or below because thats just pointless.
But if they are clanned and Red then i will 100% attack.
Why not play counterstrike against bots with the AI off ? Should be just as challenging..
you dont level characters in counterstrike.
and besides killing noobs is more fun than killing bots.
of course killing capped players is also fun.
killing afk players now that is a fun sport, umm what else is there.
rez killing oh ya you gotta try these things before you knock em ;)
sir retail
14-06-04, 16:02
and besides killing noobs is more fun than killing bots.
killing afk players now that is a fun sport,
:confused:
i dont have to comment on that i think
I hate this idea.
THere is something called al LE, believe it lame or not, if you don't want to die use it, if you want to then take it out.
Simple as that.
It's already getting a bit annoying seeing so many posts try to make LE , do epic, LE do this, Le do that, u get the huge advantage of being able to repair rhino, like ppl suggested, spy OP's without ever dying, infact there is a PPU LE guy nearcap on uranus who does exactly taht.
So leave it in or remove it, simple as that.
it is a shame that you cant just have a place for a quiet evening leveling.. afther a hard day work.. without being fucked up by an overactive murderer..
Not to sound too harsh, but thats the LE. You just have to live with the consequences of having an LE in.
sir retail
14-06-04, 17:19
I hate this idea.
THere is something called al LE, believe it lame or not, if you don't want to die use it, if you want to then take it out.
Simple as that..
to never put it back in again..
u get the huge advantage of being able to repair rhino, like ppl suggested, spy OP's without ever dying, infact there is a PPU LE guy nearcap on uranus who does exactly taht.
so how can you repair a rhino with that advantage if the LE would only work inside caves/sewers..
i never seen a rhino there.. but if someone can drive one in ill pay him a big tip.
Said by the same person with remove para in his sig *whistles*
not bd are u ? :lol:
Want to explain how you put that together? It's completely beyond me...
And no I'm not BD.
I say eliminate the hunting zones altogether, and just make it so the LE can be re-implanted.
The game would have more non-LE people if the players knew they could put the LE back in.
sir retail
14-06-04, 18:03
I say eliminate the hunting zones altogether, and just make it so the LE can be re-implanted.
The game would have more non-LE people if the players knew they could put the LE back in.
That is not a bad idea..
Yes lets do this..
ehh.. o, i dont work at Reakktor.. damn i forgot it again.
HoneyMonster
14-06-04, 18:29
Want to explain how you put that together? It's completely beyond me...
And no I'm not BD.
From your previous post imo u didn't seam to look at the problem form a very broad minded prospective.
Your answer to being killed in a hunting zone was pack up and move somewhere else :wtf: and the graves ain't exactly safe either :).
A rather simple answer to a complex problem ie. removing para : ) but i don't want to turn this into another para rant :rolleyes:.
The point is a player should have the right to lvl wherever he/she likes.
also looking at it from the other prospective ;).
A player should have the right to kill another "non LE" player where he/she likes.
i agree with both and think the sl hit should be removed from hostile factions killing people in a Hunting zone
however more times than i can count it is usually a neutral or allied faction who is doing the killing.. "see BD saturn"
In the current sl system it really is no big deal to kill 4-5 allied faction runners and just leave yourself logged in over night hey presto u are back to positive Sl in no time this imo is wrong and needs to be sorted.
From your previous post imo u didn't seam to look at the problem form a very broad minded prospective.
Your answer to being killed in a hunting zone was pack up and move somewhere else :wtf: and the graves ain't exactly safe either :).
A rather simple answer to a complex problem ie. removing para : ) but i don't want to turn this into another para rant :rolleyes:.
The point is a player should have the right to lvl wherever he/she likes.
also looking at it from the other prospective ;).
A player should have the right to kill another "non LE" player where he/she likes.
i agree with both and think the sl hit should be removed from hostile factions killing people in a Hunting zone
however more times than i can count it is usually a neutral or allied faction who is doing the killing.. "see BD saturn"
In the current sl system it really is no big deal to kill 4-5 allied faction runners and just leave yourself logged in over night hey presto u are back to positive Sl in no time this imo is wrong and needs to be sorted.
No, my answer to a droner being killed in a cave is to pack up and level somewhere else. The Graves are safe for droners, seeing as the poison the snakes use there is lethal to anyone stood out in the open. Unless they have a PPU with antidote sanctum up, anyone stood out is going to die. And the reward they get for going in there with a PPU to kill? A few droners. Not exactly worth it when they can kill more people in the Chaos Caves.
It would be a very good idea to avoid a para rant with me, yes. Concerning the sig, I can't exactly put a full page explaining my reasoning and suggestions there, can I? :)
Players don't necessarily have the right to level wherever they wish. They do have the right to hunt wherever they want provided they are prepared to watch their back in hostile areas, fight back when attacking in such areas, and accept that they will be killed every once in a while. They don't have some kind of right to level in the Chaos Caves unmolested despite being in a hostile controlled area, unless they put and keep their LE in.
Regarding killing allied faction runners, SL is completely screwed, see the numerous threads and suggestions.
I think the best solution is let em put their LE back in.
That will let people not pvp to do their epic and put their LE on after
:confused:
i dont have to comment on that i think
I think Ezza was being sarcastic, weren't you E?
HoneyMonster
14-06-04, 19:02
It would be a very good idea to avoid a para rant with me, yes. Concerning the sig, I can't exactly put a full page explaining my reasoning and suggestions there, can I? :)
No but u can pm me :lol:
The Graves are safe for droners, seeing as the poison the snakes use there is lethal to anyone stood out in the open. Unless they have a PPU with antidote sanctum up, anyone stood out is going to die. And the reward they get for going in there with a PPU to kill? A few droners. Not exactly worth it when they can kill more people in the Chaos Caves.
100% agree the graves are sweet xp for a droner however getting there as pro city is quite a challenge :) unless u discuise yourself as a system unit and wheel yourself in "heres one i made earlier" ;)
unless they put and keep their LE in.
Ahh yes the answer to avoid being pked and strangely enough moving back on topic :D.
If u dont want to be a part of pvp put it in why not ?
However i am sure u know when u are past rank 30 u can't :(
This imo is wrong there should always be a method of putting your le in with the same restrictions as there is now... maybe more ?
Perhaps a system by it takes 2 minutes for every 2nd rank to implant/take out
ie.
xx/02 4 mins
xx/30 1 hour
xx/60 2 hours
That would stop people swaping about :angel:
Absolutely not. Infact, hunting zones should be made anarchy zones so its easier to pk people in the caves. Red= Dead, no matter what. There should be no LE, no safezones, not even apts should be able to be broken into. Pkers should run around freely causing chaos and death, and the "normal" players should be left quivering in fear, always looking over their shoulder for the next pker to come along.
HoneyMonster
14-06-04, 19:31
Absolutely not. Infact, hunting zones should be made anarchy zones so its easier to pk people in the caves. Red= Dead, no matter what. There should be no LE, no safezones, not even apts should be able to be broken into. Pkers should run around freely causing chaos and death, and the "normal" players should be left quivering in fear, always looking over their shoulder for the next pker to come along.
That would seam like a good idea and imo improve neocrons pvp arena :).
but for that to work the would need to be some severe penalty for the green/yellow= dead rule implemented by some people ;).
make faction alliances and soul light mean something !
Absolutely not. Infact, hunting zones should be made anarchy zones so its easier to pk people in the caves. Red= Dead, no matter what. There should be no LE, no safezones, not even apts should be able to be broken into. Pkers should run around freely causing chaos and death, and the "normal" players should be left quivering in fear, always looking over their shoulder for the next pker to come along.Pop quiz everyone: which well known carebear said the following:
I would be up for a pvp server and any rules, just as long as slot 1 is safe. I just simply will not stand for losing my only rare weaponYou only get one guess.
;)
sir retail
14-06-04, 23:04
Absolutely not. Infact, hunting zones should be made anarchy zones so its easier to pk people in the caves. Red= Dead, no matter what. There should be no LE, no safezones, not even apts should be able to be broken into. Pkers should run around freely causing chaos and death, and the "normal" players should be left quivering in fear, always looking over their shoulder for the next pker to come along.
good idea.. but you have to start with level 3 again..
only you..
lets see how happy you are :D :D :D
I agree with your idea retail. If you've had a bit of a crap day and you just want to go hunt some mobs then you should be able to without somebody pking you while your doing so. If you want to fight someone then theres plenty of other places you can go kill people other then leveling places
I have always felt that it wouldnt hurt to have some lowbie non-PK hunting zones both inside the city and out in the wastelands. Wouldnt want it to apply to a large number or across high levels - since i, like many others here, feel that Neocron at its heart is a PK oriented game, with all the other stuff being either supportive of that or leading up to it. As always, your own opinions may vary.
Spook @ Pluto
Ahh yes the answer to avoid being pked and strangely enough moving back on topic :D.
If u dont want to be a part of pvp put it in why not ?
However i am sure u know when u are past rank 30 u can't :(
This imo is wrong there should always be a method of putting your le in with the same restrictions as there is now... maybe more ?
Perhaps a system by it takes 2 minutes for every 2nd rank to implant/take out
ie.
xx/02 4 mins
xx/30 1 hour
xx/60 2 hours
That would stop people swaping about :angel:
You're missing the spirit of the LE here. NC is supposed to have a 'watch your back, always' atmosphere. Practically everywhere outside of the city is dangerous. Especially the wastelands. You can be just walking into Tech Haven, you stop to stare at a Giant Hoverbomber, and you get shot in the back by some mad TG terrorist. That's supposed to happen. You're supposed to be constantly on the lookout for people like that. Even when you're hunting.
However, KK realise that a 10/15 pistol PE isn't going to be able to defend himself, or run away, if he is attacked by a capped runner. So the LE exists. The idea is, you level up, using the LE, and you only take it out when you feel you are ready for PvP. By doing so, you take the risk that you might not actually be ready for PvP, and if you are past /30 you will not be able to reimplant it. Some people feel ready for PvP at low levels (e.g. fighting other newbies), others never really feel ready for it and keep their LE in permanently. But the point is, you make the choice to move from the 'levelling up to be able to defend yourself' stage to the 'capable of defending yourself' stage. By making that choice, you accept the consequences that you cannot reimplant the LE. Also remember that this restriction has finally ended the exploiting by people who killed newb after newb in the sewers and aggie cellars, put their LE in, and did missions to get their SL back, then rinse and repeat.
HoneyMonster
15-06-04, 20:31
You're missing the spirit of the LE here. NC is supposed to have a 'watch your back, always' atmosphere. Practically everywhere outside of the city is dangerous. Especially the wastelands. You can be just walking into Tech Haven, you stop to stare at a Giant Hoverbomber, and you get shot in the back by some mad TG terrorist. That's supposed to happen. You're supposed to be constantly on the lookout for people like that. Even when you're hunting.
However, KK realise that a 10/15 pistol PE isn't going to be able to defend himself, or run away, if he is attacked by a capped runner. So the LE exists. The idea is, you level up, using the LE, and you only take it out when you feel you are ready for PvP. By doing so, you take the risk that you might not actually be ready for PvP, and if you are past /30 you will not be able to reimplant it. Some people feel ready for PvP at low levels (e.g. fighting other newbies), others never really feel ready for it and keep their LE in permanently. But the point is, you make the choice to move from the 'levelling up to be able to defend yourself' stage to the 'capable of defending yourself' stage. By making that choice, you accept the consequences that you cannot reimplant the LE. Also remember that this restriction has finally ended the exploiting by people who killed newb after newb in the sewers and aggie cellars, put their LE in, and did missions to get their SL back, then rinse and repeat.
I agree that in the old system having a massive sl hit then raising sl via missions was a compleat misuse of the LE, but the decision to not allow the le be implanted beyond rank 30 was a indirect solution to the problem.
surely they could have implemented a system by if a player has negative sl the LE can not be re-implanted "how hard can that be ?".
Also u seam to forget that the LE is not just there to prevent you for getting ganked as a noob until u are high enough to defend yourself, for some people its a means of isolating themselves from the world of pvp role players do exist... somewhere :lol:.
What happens when a player past rank 30 decides he/she wants to join a clan maybe do some pvp and finds out that it is not for them ?
What options does this person have re-role ?
Take a couple of hundred loms ?
That is what i have a problem with most of the nc players aspire to be a good pvp player maby join a clan and take some op's but how do u know unless u take the LE out ?
This imo is a little discriminating and i think most people would agree !
Yes the LE should be deactivated in a WZ, and little fu****s should not be able to nick your hard earned wb's. But for all the bugs/features/exploits which should not be there the LE is there for people who have a tough life and log onto nc for some r&r :) there is no need to denied them at least a taste of pvp and not let them go back if they dislike it...
anyway rant over :o
Ironically, the main beef I have with the LE is that it damages the RP atmosphere almost as much as the CS kiddies do. o_O
HoneyMonster
15-06-04, 23:39
Ironically, the main beef I have with the LE is that it damages the RP atmosphere almost as much as the CS kiddies do. o_O
Amen to that :angel:
think of this lvling with a ppu ;)
makes role play more fun
safety in numbers
Okay, i withdraw my earlier comment about adding some safe hunting zones. I mulled it over some more. KK has a game here where they expect you to be at risk from your fellow players. Sure there are some safe zones. And yes you can wear an LE up to level 30. But there comes a time where if you want to do PvM then you have to be alert and prepared to deal with PKers. And as we all know they are making it even more dangerous in DOY by removing various safe zones. The message is very clear.
So i guess i dont see suggestions like this thread's starter ever being accepted; although we'll probably see lots more of them, just as we have seen lots in the past. KK isnt looking to weaken the PK/PvP aspects of this game. They in fact seem to be strengthening them (or at least reaffirming them). I think this is a good thing, and may help to be a drawing card for more players, although at the same time it will admittedly cause other players to not buy the game to avoid PKing. Note that Lineage 2 also has PKing as its underpinnings - you can go off and focus strictly on PvM to your hearts content and do all sorts of questing ... but pretty much anywhere you go you are at risk to being PKed. It will be interesting to see if games that have a strong PK foundation (such as Neocron and Lineage 2) are able to attract enough interest to survive over the long term.
Spook @ Pluto
*shrug* I think you should be able to kill anyone anywhere
They will remove all the safe zones apart from clubs and faction HQ's but hey the pkers have to get inside the city safely first you will be able to lvl in pease down in those aggie pits ;)
*shrug* I think you should be able to kill anyone anywhere
I second that. Remove safe zones, remove QuickBelts, LE should have restrictions like it did before, but once out its out if you go over level 30.
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