Weapon discussion: Vehicle combat category

[jonus]

Heavy artillery, drone carrier, I see them as kinda the same thing, but it's a fine line

Well, you can set the droner as the sight painter (have to use a special drone) and another char as the gunner, but really, what's the gunner gonna do? Just hit the button when the droner says "now?" I understand what you're saying, but who's gonna subject themselves to being the gunner in that case? It'd be no fun. (Or did you have another idea in mind?)

Now, if we can get the gunner to also pilot it, and make the veh fairly slow compared to other vehs, but not turtle slow, that would change things up. The gunner would run around the wastelands in random patterns while the droner kept telling him when to fire. That way, the vehicle would be harder to find, thus having bombardments coming from who knows where, and when they know where, it may have moved. Maybe the beam could have a moderate arc out of the sky so the people getting hit can see from what general direction, but not see the vehicle itself (which would give them some hope of finding the artillery.)

Ooh, and an idea... the drone that is used for ammo could stay put, just damaged beyond repair (could be salvaged for common drone parts or researched) and the opposition could pick it up, hack it, and then have the location of the artillery at the time of firing (not current, mind you, as that would be overbalanced and just plain dumb as the thing is now out of contact with the artillery and isn't functioning properly.)

And another thing, the drones would have to be fast.... very fast, to cover the distance from the artillery to the op (or wherever) to make the artillery viable.

[jonus]

And Clive, I love the latest drawing you posted. It would work, but only if that were to fire something other than drones. Otherwise, it'd be a giant gamma/x-ray tank with gamma/x-ray cannons, but no gamma/x-ray firing capabilities lol.

[Heavyporker]

I heavily dislike the 'drone carrier' artillery idea.


Just have it fire in arcs, like a functional grenade launcher. The physics is there, with practice the gunner would be able to aim accurately.

What is so frigging hard about this concept?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??????

[Clive tombstone]

Exactly what Im talking about my friend =), I think idealy what they mean with the drones though, is that they are used in tandem with the tank itself (used for target painting) while the gunner manually fires at the painted targets, think Tribes 2 targeting lasers like below, minus the jackassery


thanks for the compliment about the tank btw

[Bozz-Von Mel]

I heavily dislike the 'drone carrier' artillery idea.

Just have it fire in arcs, like a functional grenade launcher. The physics is there, with practice the gunner would be able to aim accurately.

What is so frigging hard about this concept?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??????

Still requires line of sight. Now matter how much you practice, you will not hit something you cannot see.

[John Doe]

As announced, here are the details of the three new vehicles – the concept changes that were discussed have been implemented for all vehicles. Therefore the initial examples greatly differ from the following (aim speed, aim precision, range) – as these values have been balanced with the TechLevel of the vehicle keys, you can expect similar behavior from the other vehicles.

The values for condition (Healthpoints) and the armor have been balanced by a group classification – the following groups have been created:
- Tank: Very good condition, very good armor (i.e. Rhino, DoY Hoverbomber)
- Chaincraft: Good condition, good armor (i.e. HH4x4 Chaincraft)
- Hover: Medium condition, good armor
- Scorpion: Medium condition, good armor
- Glider: Low condition, good armor (i.e. Scout, Advanced Scout)
- Usual: Low condition, medium armor (i.e. Speedbike, Wheeler, Quad)


Example #5: NEXT Rhino4x4 Chaincraft V.3 – KeyTL 102

Vehicle Setup (Group: Tank):
Condition: 16000 HealthPoints
Weight: 9600 Kg
Armor:
100 % Force
96 % Piercing
96 % Fire
92 % Energy
92 % X-Ray
100 % Poison (Damage is ignored)

Seat #1: Driver (INT 30, VHC 62)
Seat #2: Gunner (STR 96, H-C 113, T-C 81)
Seat #3: Passenger
Seat #4: Passenger

Weaponry:
Weapon: NEXT VHC RayGun Cannon
Category: Heavy Combat, HighTech
TechLevel: 96
Mode: Single Shot
Aim speed: 1.43 Seconds (64 %)
Aim precision: 1.86 Reticule start size (62 %)
Clip: 50 Shots
Real firing frequency: 37.50 / Minute
Range: 618.75 Meter
Ammo: NEXT VHC Raygun Cannon Ammo, 50 Units, 1860 Gramm

Damage per shot: 404.4978 (Energy, X-Ray)
Damage per minute: ca. 14798


Example #6: DoY HH4x4 Combat Chaincraft – KeyTL 88

Vehicle Setup (Group: Chaincraft):
Condition: 11950 HealthPoints
Weight: 2800 Kg
Armor:
96 % Force
96 % Piercing
90 % Fire
92 % Energy
92 % X-Ray
100 % Poison (Damage is ignored)

Seat #1: Driver (INT 18, VHC 45)
Seat #2: Gunner (STR 84, H-C 107)
Seat #3: Passenger

Weaponry:
Weapon: DoY VHC Improved Gatlin Cannon
Category: Heavy Combat, LowTech
TechLevel: 84
Mode: Burst (4)
Aim speed: 1.57 Seconds (70 %)
Aim precision: 2.04 Reticule start size (68 %)
Clip: 100 Shots
Real firing frequency: 315.79 / Minute
Range: 595.31 Meter
Ammo: NEXT VHC Improved Gatlin Cannon Ammo, 100 Units, 1980 Gramm

Damage per shot: 39.8140 (Piercing, Energy, X-Ray)
Damage per minute: ca. 11375


Example #7: NEXT Observer Prototype V.0.2 – KeyTL 64

Vehicle Setup (Group: Glider):
Condition: 5550 HealthPoints
Weight: 520 Kg
Armor:
90 % Force
92 % Piercing
96 % Fire
94 % Energy
94 % X-Ray
100 % Poison (Damage is ignored)

Seat #1: Pilot (INT 23, VHC 53)
Seat #2: Passenger

We hope you like these suggestions

[commerzgandalf]

Example #5: NEXT Rhino4x4 Chaincraft V.3 – KeyTL 102

Vehicle Setup (Group: Tank):
Condition: 16000 HealthPoints
Weight: 9600 Kg
Armor:
100 % Force
96 % Piercing
96 % Fire
92 % Energy
92 % X-Ray
100 % Poison (Damage is ignored)

Seat #1: Driver (INT 30, VHC 62)
-------------------------------------------
Seat #2: Gunner (STR 96, H-C 113, T-C 81)
-------------------------------------------
Seat #3: Passenger
Seat #4: Passenger

So PE cant gun rhino anymore ?

[Brammers]

Example #6: DoY HH4x4 Combat Chaincraft – KeyTL 88

Vehicle Setup (Group: Chaincraft):
Seat #1: Driver (INT 44, VHC 73)
Seat #2: Gunner (STR 84, H-C 107)
Seat #3: Passenger

Why is the driver requirements for the DoY HH4x4 Combat Chaincraft set at INT 44, VHC 73? Thats very high for a Chaincraft group vehicle, or are vehicles like the Reveler or ER HH4x4 Chaincraft V1 going to have higher requirements?

[Comie]

Well to be perfectly honest Mr Doe, you have made the group classifacation to complicated, youve basically just catorgerised the vehicles on their names.

e.g
Hover type
Scorpian type

theres only 2 types of these vehicles, and all they really are is the same vehicle but with a main weapon strapped on.

Make the catagories simpler.

secondly

Tank V2

Vehicle Setup:
Units: 12000 HealthPoints
Weight: 9600 Kg
Armor: 90 % Force
70 % Piercing
95 % Fire
65 % Energy
65 % X-Ray
100 % Poison

Weaponry:
Weapon: NEXT VHC Laser Cannon
Category: Heavy Combat, HighTech
TechLevel: 90
Modus: Single Shot
Aim speed: 3.44 Seconds (76 %)
Aim precision: 3.43 Reticule start size (69 %)
Clip: 48 Shots
Real Firing Frequency: 32.60 / Minute
Range: 548.40 Meter
Ammo: NEXT VHC Laser Cannon Powercell, 48 Units, 1040 Gramm

Damage per shot: 409.3280 (Energy)
Damage per minute: ca. 13335

Vs

Tank V3

Vehicle Setup (Group: Tank):
Condition: 16000 HealthPoints
Weight: 9600 Kg
Armor:
100 % Force
96 % Piercing
96 % Fire
92 % Energy
92 % X-Ray
100 % Poison (Damage is ignored)

Seat #1: Driver (INT 30, VHC 62)
Seat #2: Gunner (STR 96, H-C 113, T-C 81)
Seat #3: Passenger
Seat #4: Passenger

Weaponry:
Weapon: NEXT VHC RayGun Cannon
Category: Heavy Combat, HighTech
TechLevel: 96
Mode: Single Shot
Aim speed: 1.43 Seconds (64 %)
Aim precision: 1.86 Reticule start size (62 %)
Clip: 50 Shots
Real firing frequency: 37.50 / Minute
Range: 618.75 Meter
Ammo: NEXT VHC Raygun Cannon Ammo, 50 Units, 1860 Gramm

Damage per shot: 404.4978 (Energy, X-Ray)
Damage per minute: ca. 14798


one word for you

Consistancy.

V3 is a tank VARIENT, not a new vehicle, what this means is that its the same armor same resistances same hps... different weapon load out.

and speaking of resistances, why are the vehicles weakest to energy? most of them are earthed to buggery so a lightning strike shouldnt do anything to it.

the vehicles should we weak to force and pierce (for normal weapon types) and if you want to be spangly about it make an invisible resist called "VHC" and have anti vehicle weapons deal this type of damage, then you can decide how much damage each type takes

e.g.
Tank catagory takes 40% VHC damage
Scorp catagory takes 60% VHC damage...

etc.

[Kierz]

So PE cant gun rhino anymore ?

i thought that when i read it first, but it's the new RGC (please make it fusion=[) rhino not the normal one

also vehicles should be weaker to force than nrg/xrr

[John Doe]

Rhino V.3:
There is no decision against the PE to use that weapon - it will become harder to reach that requirements. Nothing more!

DoY HH4x4 Combat Chaincraft:
Thank you for mentioning that fault - this was to heavy for the driver seat. New requirements are INT 18, VHC 45 (Origin version has INT 15, VHC 37).

[Comie]

also with reguards to stat requirements for driving/gunning.

i think you should drop the main stat requirement.

e.g.

Seat #1: Driver (INT 18, VHC 45)
Seat #2: Gunner (STR 84, H-C 107)

should become

Seat #1: Driver (VHC 45)
Seat #2: Gunner (H-C 107)

a Monk with 20 STR can get 73 HC.
a Spy with 40 STR can get 105 HC.

yet that will mean that they will have no carrying capacity, and therefore they cant really carry much.

It makes no sence that vehicles require strength for you to turn/aim a turret... what are you doing manually pushing the turret left and right??

[John Doe]

These examples differ because we've changed the concepts for vehicles - aimingspeed, targetspeed, range AND ARMOR! I've mentioned that before - please try to get the full information about this topic to build your conclusions.

The Rhino V.3 is just a little bit better than the origin version (Rhino V.2). Change names and weapons, calculate a few differences to it (different TLs!) and you will have the Rhino V.2!

No one of us talked about NEW vehicles - we've announced VARIATIONS of existing versions.

[Comie]

These examples differ because we've changed the concepts for vehicles - aimingspeed, targetspeed, range AND ARMOR! I've mentioned that before - please try to get the full information about this topic to build your conclusions.

The Rhino V.3 is just a little bit better than the origin version (Rhino V.2). Change names and weapons, calculate a few differences to it (different TLs!) and you will have the Rhino V.2!

No one of us talked about NEW vehicles - we've announced VARIATIONS of existing versions.

they why bother making the other varients, with the addition of the V3 Vehicle you make the other 2 obsolete, and by doing so you just wasted your time.

It would be better to have the new variants similar, but either one with better speed, one with better armour and one with better weaponry, then there is choice, making one vehicle the best over all will mean that no one will bother brininging the other 2 to a battlefield.

and from what it seems you will only ever see V3 Rhinos at OP battles... its tough, it does more damage, it has a larger clip size and it even does aoe.

Who needs anything else.

[msdong]

Rhino V.3:
There is no decision against the PE to use that weapon - it will become harder to reach that requirements. Nothing more!...

how do i get 96 STR on a PE ????

dont tell me i need to Drug and Drive ....